My hate for Russia, explained

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Here's a post to end 2016. This will likely be my final post of the year.

It may be true that McCain and Romney said things anti-Putin (not to mention Palin who was saying absurd things and make her support of Trump all the more hilarious) and the Democrats might've mocked them for that. To be honest I wasn't quite in that, since I was staunchly opposed to Russia when they attacked Georgia and wish the US had aided Georgia more. However it wasn't really right wingers that shaped my opinion.

My disgust that grew came from the moronic squad of pro-Putin people on the left. People such as Snowstalker, Ed Schultz, Thom Hartmann, Glenn Greenwald, Lee Camp, Michael Tracy and Eric Draitser. But mostly just randoms on message boards in recent years, who keep raving about the "Nazi government" of Ukraine or something something neoliberalism, something something NATO imperialism. It's absurd because Putin has done nothing to stymie neoliberalism anyway and I'm failing to see how on earth anything NATO has done in the past 25 years could be described as "imperialism". This is not a strawman, just read Tracy's Twitter (he all but supported Trump due to this), or this article. It's nothing but knee jerk anti-Americanism, I've even seen some defend Russian war crimes in Chechnya, or the "gay propaganda" law. Yes seriously. Common points made:
1-Gay bashing still occurs in the US, therefore no American can ever criticize gay bashing anywhere else.
2-Some American evangelicals like to spread anti-gay sentiment in countries like Uganda, therefore it's wrong for any American to criticize any other country's government or people's anti-gay policies (the contradiction of this with point #1 is apparently lost on them.)
3-Some US states still had laws against gay sex before Lawrence v. Texas over 10 years ago, so it's still wrong and hypocritical for Americans to criticize any anti-gay laws anywhere else.
4-Some US states still don't have gay marriage yet (at the time), therefore these states are just as repressive and unfriendly to LGBT people as any notably anti-gay foreign country and thus no American can criticize any other country.
5-Cultural relativist bulls[inks].

It's pretty easy to see how infuriating this garbage is. And that was BEFORE Russia took action to make Trump President.

So I'm just fed up. F[inks] that country and f[inks] anyone who defends it. And for that matter f[inks] anyone who supports that regime. Why are people crying more over some career diplomat gunned down than all the thousands of innocents in Aleppo the assassin was motivated by? Please note that on most liberal websites after said assassination happened the general sentiment and posts in response were "oh well haha, you reap what you sow". And here's the thing: Would all these pearl clutching conservatives cry decades ago if a Soviet ambassador was assassinated.

So yeah. Just f[inks] that country and all its lovers.

[Torie]

Not a bad rant actually by BRTD - drunk as he may be as he gains attitude to get to the cruising point by midnight.  

[Dr. Arch]

Not a bad rant actually by BRTD - drunk as he may be as he gains attitude to get to the cruising point by midnight.  

[Filuwaúrdjan]

A country and its government - or even system of government - are not the same thing. Russia has generally had appalling governments, yet it has produced great art (this is the land of Dostoyevsky, Shostakovitch, Tolstoy, Pushkin, Prokofiev, Diaghilev, Mussorgsky, Bulgakov, Tchaikovsky...) and much of the culture of day-to-day life is frankly charming (i.e. this is a society in which it is common to add jam to tea). One can express disgust at the current regime in the Kremlin and its actions abroad (and domestically!) without engaging in Russophobic chest-beating.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

A country and its government - or even system of government - are not the same thing. Russia has generally had appalling governments, yet it has produced great art (this is the land of Dostoyevsky, Shostakovitch, Tolstoy, Pushkin, Prokofiev, Diaghilev, Mussorgsky, Bulgakov, Tchaikovsky...) and much of the culture of day-to-day life is frankly charming (i.e. this is a society in which it is common to add jam to tea). One can express disgust at the current regime in the Kremlin and its actions abroad (and domestically!) without engaging in Russophobic chest-beating.

That's too much nuance for BRTD.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

A country and its government - or even system of government - are not the same thing. Russia has generally had appalling governments, yet it has produced great art (this is the land of Dostoyevsky, Shostakovitch, Tolstoy, Pushkin, Prokofiev, Diaghilev, Mussorgsky, Bulgakov, Tchaikovsky...) and much of the culture of day-to-day life is frankly charming (i.e. this is a society in which it is common to add jam to tea). One can express disgust at the current regime in the Kremlin and its actions abroad (and domestically!) without engaging in Russophobic chest-beating.

As Jacek Kaczmarski, a "bard" of the Solidarity era, wrote in one of his songs: "I'm an anticommunist russophile". I think that would best explain my own position, except you'd have to exchange an anti-communists to an anti-putinist. You bet I hate the Russian government and what it stands for. At the same time I absolutely love a lot of things about Russia.

A country is not, as Al rightly pointed out, the same as its present government. Its also millions of people, centuries of history, etc. BRTD's naive generalization (not just about Russia but pretty much everything) reminds me of a neocon idiots' view of the world. One dimensional and childish.

Interestingly, he hardly spoke out on how awful Russia is before this election. I don't remember him making such a long an passionate posts about Russian actions in Ukraine.

I guess one thing determines everything in his silly mind.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

You do realize the Putin loving clowns I'm condemning and that infuriated me so much are in favor of Russia's government though?

[America Needs R'hllor]

I agree with most of your points, and I love the Russian culture almost as much as I hate its government. I hope the Russian people will understand how much of a missed opportunity they are for the world.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

A country and its government - or even system of government - are not the same thing. Russia has generally had appalling governments, yet it has produced great art (this is the land of Dostoyevsky, Shostakovitch, Tolstoy, Pushkin, Prokofiev, Diaghilev, Mussorgsky, Bulgakov, Tchaikovsky...) and much of the culture of day-to-day life is frankly charming (i.e. this is a society in which it is common to add jam to tea). One can express disgust at the current regime in the Kremlin and its actions abroad (and domestically!) without engaging in Russophobic chest-beating.

That's too much nuance for BRTD.

Yeah you understand nuance quite well. After all you were able to give out criticisms of Hillary Clinton that weren't just raving about "NEOLIBERAL CORPORATIST NEOCON IMPERIALIST WARMONGER" and took Bernie's endorsement of her in stride understanding why he did so instead of disappearing from the forum completely the day it happened until literally the day after the election.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

You do realize the Putin loving clowns I'm condemning and that infuriated me so much are in favor of Russia's government though?

OK, so you were triggered by a bunch of pro-Putin clowns. I hated Putin and his policy before you started to show such an interest in the matter in the last year. Hell, we can probably agree on almost every specific instance.

I would hope someone declaring to be "all liberal all the time" would see there's something not quite right with the collective guilt thinking.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Actually most liberal sites I read were actually celebrating the assassination. DU was holding up the assassin as a hero.

What's your opinion of Herschel Grynszpan?

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

Actually most liberal sites I read were actually celebrating the assassination. DU was holding up the assassin as a hero.

What's your opinion of Herschel Grynszpan?

Grynszpan's act played right into the Nazis' hands just like this will play into the Putin's hands. The Nazis exploited it to the fullest.

[Virginiá]

BRTD murder is never really something to be celebrated. There are instances where it may serve a greater good, but still. I really don't even know who that Russian is. I don't like Putin by any means but I don't think every employee of the Russian government deserves summary execution.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

BRTD murder is never really something to be celebrated. There are instances where it may serve a greater good, but still. I really don't even know who that Russian is.

A close friend of Putin and someone who had worked in the reprehensible regime of the f[inks]ing SOVIET UNION.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

OK, political sentiments aside for a moment. What is this act supposed to accomplish exactly? Do you realize how beneficial it'll be for the Russian diplomacy and propaganda?

Life is not a Tarantino movie. And life is not about making far-fetched comparisons. I could make dozens of such comparisons to link the guy to Jesus himself and it's still pretty dumb. 

[Virginiá]

A close friend of Putin and someone who had worked in the reprehensible regime of the f[inks]ing SOVIET UNION.

Still, if he did bad things, maybe prison then. Not murder. Plus you'd have to forgive me for being unswayed by the USSR argument in part since my parents worked for RAS/education commissariat. Sure, the USSR was bringing oppression, they were bringing threat of nuclear holocaust, but some I know are good people!

[Mad Deadly Worldwide Communist Gangster Computer God]

BRTD murder is never really something to be celebrated. There are instances where it may serve a greater good, but still. I really don't even know who that Russian is.

A close friend of Putin and someone who had worked in the reprehensible regime of the f[inks]ing SOVIET UNION.

For all we know, that man had a family back home.  Maybe some children who had to celebrate Christmas this year without their dad.  I'm not big on emotional appeals generally, but you can oppose Putin's regime and have some basic respect for your fellow man.  Plus it's not like the man killed Kim Jong-un or Mugabe or even Putin himself or whatever.

I mean yeah, Russia's bad (or at least its political elements are) but it's not Nazi Germany like you were comparing it to the other day.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

So question guys: If we had a poster from Ukraine, and they had the same sig as me currently, would you be as harsh on them?

[Coolface Sock #42069]

I don't need an explanation. I also hate Russia, or at least the Putin regime.

[Green Line]

I don't need an explanation. I also hate Russia, or at least the Putin regime.

[White Trash]

So question guys: If we had a poster from Ukraine, and they had the same sig as me currently, would you be as harsh on them?

Yes. The ambassador was doing the job of an ambassador. This isn't Hitler dead on the ground in the picture for Christ's sake. This man was not objectively evil. He may be a part of a government that you have disagreements with, but is that enough to celebrate this man's murder?

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

So question guys: If we had a poster from Ukraine, and they had the same sig as me currently, would you be as harsh on them?

Well, you're not a poster from Ukraine. There's something ridiculous about a dude posting from his studio apartment in Minneapolis comparing his situation, even for the purpose of this discussion, to someone from a war-torn country. And I'm saying this as someone whose family suffered a lot from the Russian imperialism under successive regimes and someone who got family ties with Ukraine.

I'm still waiting someone to explain to me what exactly this whole thing accomplished. The Russian diplomacy and propaganda got the best gift they could've hoped for and now they have additional leverage in relations with Turkey.

I might understand the assassins' sentiments (and, mind you, we still don't know the full truth about his motivations and ties, if there were any), but it was still stupid and unproductive. It won't help the Syrians, it won't help the Ukrainians.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Look if I was a government official in a government doing immoral things I'd resign. I wouldn't continue to "just follow orders". Yes that would apply if I was an ambassador now to some country that Trump was planning on screwing over. Not that that thought EVER crossed this guy's mind because he was actually a friend of Putin's, not some generic bureaucrat.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

Btw, we should really wait before declaring someone a "hero" until we know all relevant facts. If the guy was in any way connected with the terrorists then the whole "FF" thing becomes even more absurd.

[FEMA Camp Administrator]

BRTD, I take it you oppose the United States' ban on assassination, then.