Clinton :Democrats are to blame for Tom Daschles loss

[MissCatholic]

Bill Clinton said last week that Tom Daschles loss in South Dakota was the fault of democrats.

In 2004, two catholic bishops campaigned in South Dakota telling catholics that 'you can't be a good catholic and vote for a pro-choice catholic democrat in Tom Daschle'. If you look at every single democrat that occupies a senate seat in a red state they have always answered an attack immediately. Blanche Lincoln, Evan Bayh and Mary Landrieu are three of the most popular senators throughout the country yet they never attack themselves but they nullify any attack before it excellerates.

The democrats failed to do what the three above do. Clinton is right to point out that from 1995-2002. Tom Daschle tried to reduce the amount of abortions by allowing the states to verify the laws. The Republicans in the senate never got it passed as they didnt want the dems to have the tag of sticking up for pro-lifers.

Take Mary Landrieu. In 2002, George Bush with an approval rating of 74% campaigned 8 times in the last three weeks to remove Mary from the senate. The Republicans claimed that Mary was not a good catholic as she voted against Partial Birth abortion. However Mary retaliated against this smear campaign by saying that she voted against the bill as it was unconstituitional. She got four lawyers all with Conservative backgrounds to do a commerical detailing why the bill was unconstitutional. How can you be a good senator if you know a law isn't right  legally?

But Tom Daschle and the democrats did the opposite in 2004 and allowed John Thune and Republicans by continuing this assault without a credible arguement. Kerry did the same.

Us democrats cant blame Republicans for what they did and how they did it. We cant blame the people of South Dakota either since the democrats never addressed the issue. So what do we learn from this. Whenever there is an attack you answer it!

Evan Bayh, Blanche Lincoln, Mary Landrieu have three things in common.

1. they are exceptional senators.
2. they reach out to both democrats, republicans and indis.
3. THEY ANSWER ANY ATTACK ON THE DAY OF IT.

So if you want to win elections...fine then lets elect someone who doesn't tolerate republican attacks without reply.

[MODU]

Evan Bayh, Blanche Lincoln, Mary Landrieu have three things in common.

1. they are exceptional senators.
2. they reach out to both democrats, republicans and indis.
3. THEY ANSWER ANY ATTACK ON THE DAY OF IT.

4. they are a bit more moderate than the rest of the gang.

As far as your question goes, Daschle lost his election by himself, and not because of the party.

[Speed of Sound]

Evan Bayh, Blanche Lincoln, Mary Landrieu have three things in common.

1. they are exceptional senators.
2. they reach out to both democrats, republicans and indis.
3. THEY ANSWER ANY ATTACK ON THE DAY OF IT.

4. they are a bit more moderate than the rest of the gang.

As far as your question goes, Daschle lost his election by himself, and not because of the party.

the party didnt exactly help Daschle, either

[MissCatholic]

I disagree.

If you have someone with an approval rating of 74% and he campaigns against you and says your this and that, most people will listen to it.

Bush onced said in a speech five days before the vote by saying that Mary voted against his tax cuts by saying  'a penny earned is a penny gained, Mary Landrieu doesnt want you to earn that penny. she wants to keep it.'

Mary replied on state television that very night..
'a penny earned is not a penny earned Mr. Bush, when at the end of the day you still owe a quarter. Last time i checked i gave more to charity in 2001 than Bush. So the penny i so call keep actually goes to those that need it. For instance the schools that Bush hasnt properly funded by the NCLB act.'

So if Mary can defeat a strong Republican who had three times more money and a campaigner with 74% approval rating then anythings possible.

If the democrats are to win in red states we have to play hard like Mary Landrieu does.

When she speaks Republicans do listen! And as John McCain once said 'Mary never sweats under pressure, her attackers do it for her'

[TomC]

Evan Bayh, Blanche Lincoln, Mary Landrieu have three things in common.

1. they are exceptional senators.
2. they reach out to both democrats, republicans and indis.
3. THEY ANSWER ANY ATTACK ON THE DAY OF IT.

4. they are a bit more moderate than the rest of the gang.

As far as your question goes, Daschle lost his election by himself, and not because of the party.

the party didnt exactly help Daschle, either

The Democrats gave Senator Daschle the top Senate post which was certainly a plus and a minus for his political career. As for the attacks, those were Dascle's to refute. Clinton's right to say the Dems haven't been good at responding to GOP attacks though.

[Blue Rectangle]

The Democrats gave Senator Daschle the top Senate post which was certainly a plus and a minus for his political career.

Exactly.

Bayh, Lincoln and Landrieu didn't have to support the most liberal members of their party.  Daschle, as leader, had to.

In 2002, Thune lost even though Bush's approval was through the roof.  Thune won in 2004 with Bush's <50% approval.  Daschle was the difference that helped Thune.

If I were Harry Reid, I'd be very careful about how supportive I am of the left wing of the party.  (IMO, he's been pretty smart so far.)

[WalterMitty]

daschle lost because he was one big miserable failure.  he was a f'ing failure as senator, so why did the democrats elect him leader?  beats me.

[MissCatholic]

daschle lost because he was one big miserable failure.  he was a f'ing failure as senator, so why did the democrats elect him leader?  beats me.

Why did the Republicans refuse to back a bill for seven years that reduced abortions?

[Blue Rectangle]

daschle lost because he was one big miserable failure.  he was a f'ing failure as senator, so why did the democrats elect him leader?  beats me.

In hopes that giving him power would translate into support at home.  Unfortunately for Daschle, the power gained was not enough to counter the liabilities I mentioned above.

[Blue Rectangle]

daschle lost because he was one big miserable failure.  he was a f'ing failure as senator, so why did the democrats elect him leader?  beats me.

Why did the Republicans refuse to back a bill for seven years that reduced abortions?

Look at abortion rates in Republicans states versus rates in Democratic states.  The Democrats have zero authority on this issue.

[MissCatholic]

daschle lost because he was one big miserable failure.  he was a f'ing failure as senator, so why did the democrats elect him leader?  beats me.

Why did the Republicans refuse to back a bill for seven years that reduced abortions?

Look at abortion rates in Republicans states versus rates in Democratic states.  The Democrats have zero authority on this issue.

Answer me questoin please. SEVEN YEARS republicans blocked the bills why?

[MODU]

Answer me questoin please. SEVEN YEARS republicans blocked the bills why?

Post the bills so we can read them, and then someone will answer.  In all likelihood, the language is bad or makes provisions for things that Republicans cannot support.

[TheresNoMoney]

Look at abortion rates in Republicans states versus rates in Democratic states.  The Democrats have zero authority on this issue.

Nice lie.

Teen pregancies and abortion rates are highest in the red states, and especially the south.

[Blue Rectangle]

Look at abortion rates in Republicans states versus rates in Democratic states.  The Democrats have zero authority on this issue.

Nice lie.

Teen pregancies and abortion rates are highest in the red states, and especially the south.

Bold states voted Kerry in 2004

Rank   State   Abortions per thousand live births
1    District of Columbia    706
2    New York 500   
3    Delaware    453
4    Rhode Island    429   
5    Florida    416   
6    Massachusetts    324   
7    Nevada    322   
7    Washington    322   
9    Kansas    316   
10    Oregon    315   
11    Connecticut    311   
12    New Jersey    290
13    North Carolina    257   
13    Pennsylvania    257   
15    Illinois    253   
16    Georgia    249   
16    Virginia    249   
18    Ohio    247   
19    Vermont    239   
20    Hawaii    234   
21    Tennessee    222   
22    Alabama    221   
23    Minnesota    220   
24    Montana    214   
25    Michigan    212   
25    Texas    212   
27    New Mexico    190   
28    Maryland    184
29    Maine    183   
30    Louisiana    167   
31    Arkansas    160   
31    Nebraska    160   
33    North Dakota    159   
34    Wisconsin    158
35    Iowa    152
36    Oklahoma    140   
37    Indiana    137   
38    South Carolina    126   
39    West Virginia    114   
40    Missouri    103   
41    Arizona    97   
42    South Dakota    85   
43    Mississippi    84   
44    Utah    75   
45    Colorado    69   
45    Kentucky    69   
47    Idaho    36

From 2001, no data from CA, AK, NH and WY.

Next time you call me a liar, please have facts to back it up.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

On the hand, red states lead in teen births and divorces.

[Alcon]

Democrats have zero authority because abortion rates are higher in Democratic states (as if entire states are Democratic, as opposed to localities)?  Why?

Those saying that Daschle lost because he was a failure at are odds with the people of South Dakota - Daschle had a very high (I believe >60%) approval rating in the Mount Rushmore State.

The reason Daschle lost, fundamentally, was because Thune was slightly more popular, and those that approved of both (plenty of people) generally voted Thune about 3-to-2, much in line with the state's overall politics.

[Blue Rectangle]

Democrats have zero authority because abortion rates are higher in Democratic states (as if entire states are Democratic, as opposed to localities)?  Why?

The states with the highest rates of abortion are those that have had the most pro-choice-friendly abortion policies.  In an attempt to appease moderates on the aboriton issue, Democrats who support such liberal pro-choice policies claim that they wish to reduce the number of abortions.  For example, Hillary recently and Kerry during the campaign made this claim.  Is it only coincidence that their home states, which have abortion policies near to their own, also have very high abortion rates?  What evidence is there that the Democrats' abortion reduction policies (whatever they might be) would actually work?

[J.G.H.]

Daschle indeed didn't run a great campaign, but the problem was it was difficult to refute these attacks.  Being party leader had forced him to the left, and issues such as him leading the Democratic fillibuster surely didn't win him votes.  He was perceived as out-of-touch with the state.  I remember one particularly effective ad that received a ton of airtime that had clips of Daschle at some pro-choice rally speaking up for abortion rights and other clips that made him look liberal, ending with a clip where he said "I'm a D.C. resident."  Also it seems SD doesn't like lifetime politicians, as the state has only had one four-term Senator ever, and two other three-term Senators lost their reelections before Daschle had.

[MODU]

Wasn't he the one who ran the commercial showing him hugging Bush?

[12th Doctor]

On the hand, red states lead in teen births and divorces.

Again, great lie.  Almost twice the percentage of people are married in red states than in blue state.  Therefore, the slight raw numerical advantage that red states have over blue when it comes to divorce is meaningless and, on the whole, more people are in stable marriages in the red states than the blue.

[Akno21]

On the hand, red states lead in teen births and divorces.

Again, great lie.  Almost twice the percentage of people are married in red states than in blue state.  Therefore, the slight raw numerical advantage that red states have over blue when it comes to divorce is meaningless and, on the whole, more people are in stable marriages in the red states than the blue.

IGNORE, BAD STATISTICS on my part.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Redstatebluestate=Bulls*t BULLSH*T BULLSH*T

[WMS]

Redstatebluestate=Bulls*t BULLSH*T BULLSH*T

No, really, Al, tell us what you really think. Don't hold back.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

No, really, Al, tell us what you really think. Don't hold back.

Redstatebluestate= ****[/b]

[A18]

On the hand, red states lead in teen births and divorces.

Again, great lie.  Almost twice the percentage of people are married in red states than in blue state.  Therefore, the slight raw numerical advantage that red states have over blue when it comes to divorce is meaningless and, on the whole, more people are in stable marriages in the red states than the blue.

It's a bit old, 1994, but according to a study by the National Center for Health Statistics, that's not true.
bold are red states.

  1   Massachusetts  14,530    2.4     
  2   Connecticut     9,095    2.8     
  3   New Jersey     23,899    3.0     
  4   Rhode Island    3,231    3.2     
  5   New York       59,195    3.3     
      Pennsylvania   40,040    3.3     
  7   Wisconsin      17,478    3.4     
      North Dakota    2,201    3.4     
  9   Maryland       17,439    3.5     
 10   Minnesota      16,217    3.6     
      Louisiana         ***    3.6     
 12   Illinois       43,398    3.7     
 13   District of     2,244    3.9     
      Columbia
      Iowa           10,930    3.9     
 15   Nebraska        6,547    4.0     
      Vermont         2,316    4.0     
 17   Michigan       38,727    4.1     
18   South Dakota    3,022    4.2     
      South Carolina 15,301    4.2     
      Hawaii          4,979    4.2     
 21   California        ***    4.3     
 22   Maine           5,433    4.4     
      New Hampshire   5,041    4.4     
24   Ohio           49,968    4.5     
 25   Virginia       30,016    4.6         
 26   Kansas         12,093    4.7     
      Utah            8,999    4.7
 28   Delaware         3,385   4.8
 29   Montana          4,153   4.9
 30   Missouri        26,324   5.0
      West Virginia    9,179   5.0
 32   North Carolina  36,292   5.1
      Colorado        18,795   5.1
 34   Georgia         37,001   5.2
 35   Oregon          16,307   5.3
 36   Texas           99,073   5.4
 37   Alaska           3,354   5.5
 38   Washington      29,976   5.6
 39   Mississippi     15,212   5.7
 40   Kentucky        22,211   5.8
      Arizona         23,725   5.8
 42   Florida         82,963   5.9
 43   New Mexico       9,882   6.0
 44   Idaho            7,075   6.2
      Alabama         26,116   6.2
 46   Indiana            ***   6.4
 47   Wyoming          3,071   6.5
 48   Tennessee       34,167   6.6
 49   Oklahoma        21,855   6.7
 50   Arkansas        17,458   7.1
 51   Nevada          13,061   9.0

That's divorce rates per 1,000 people. Supersoulty was talking about divorce rate per married people.