Nations comparable to America?
       |           

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
March 28, 2024, 03:23:45 PM
News: Election Simulator 2.0 Released. Senate/Gubernatorial maps, proportional electoral votes, and more - Read more

  Talk Elections
  General Discussion
  History (Moderator: Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee)
  Nations comparable to America?
« previous next »
Pages: [1]
Author Topic: Nations comparable to America?  (Read 3260 times)
FEMA Camp Administrator
Cathcon
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 27,284
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« on: January 25, 2017, 07:57:24 PM »

On mobile, so verbiage, formatting, and grammar may be subpar.

In any case, I've been rethinking the concept of "America" overall; while we are situated in the Western tradition, we are not really comparable to Europe in regards to our social history on a whole host of dimensions. We are a settler nation with a past rooted in slavery that is very much still with us today. By the standards of our ideals--and this likely holds true for all nations--we have fallen far short. As such, maybe judging us by some European or Western "standard" is inappropriate in many respects. Are there nations with similar contentious and often ugly histories that we may judge as our contemporaries? One I had thought of, perhaps lazily, was Russia. While sociologically very different, we share pasts as expansionist nations which resulted in actions that would be deemed regrettable by modern standards; in one case regarding the American Indian, in another the peoples of Central Asia. In both cases, racialist agendas were implemented for reasons of social control and, perhaps, function. Is there, perhaps, some motley cohort of nations we are more readily compared to vis-a-vis our settler status, our recurrent social dysfunction, our immigrant communities, and our (perhaps manufactured) ideology committed to some sense of destiny?
Logged
buritobr
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 3,604


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #1 on: January 25, 2017, 10:42:34 PM »

Brazil is a settler nation with a past rooted in slavery too.
There are descendants of european settlers, descendants of african slaves, descendants of european immigrants from many countries, descendants of asian immigrants and native americans (índios) too.
Brazil is also a federal republic with presidential system of government. The bicameral system in the legislative branch and the Supreme Court system are copies of the USA.
Brazilian has almost the same area of the USA. Brazilian population is 2/3 of the US population.

However, there are differences, beside the obivous one, that USA is a high income country and Brazil is a medium income country.

Brazil had never something like the north of the USA. Brazil looked like the south of the USA. Slavery was widespread.
47% of the Brazilians are white, 40% are pardo (mixed black/white), 10% are pure black, 3% are asian or native. USA is whiter than Brazil. Racism in Brazil is a little bit different of the racism in the USA.
Logged
2952-0-0
exnaderite
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 7,221


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #2 on: January 25, 2017, 11:38:46 PM »

^ Aren't the three southern Brazilian states more similar to the US north? As in, whiter, more industrialized, settlement by European farmers than by African slaves, sense of superiority over the rest of the nation, etc?
Logged
buritobr
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 3,604


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #3 on: January 27, 2017, 08:43:44 PM »

^ Aren't the three southern Brazilian states more similar to the US north? As in, whiter, more industrialized, settlement by European farmers than by African slaves, sense of superiority over the rest of the nation, etc?

Slavery was more scarce in the three southern states, but still existed, in the ranchs that produced beef. However, in the mid 19th century, when slavery was still legal, the southern Brazil was settled by Italian/German immigrants, who started agriculture in small farms.

The three southern states have the best education and health indicators in Brazil. However, the richest and most industrialized state in Brazil is São Paulo, located in the Southeast. São Paulo was a big coffee exporter in the 19th century. The coffee farms used slave labor. Before the abolition, some farms already started to replace African slaves by Italian free workers. In the early 20th century, coffee businessmen started to invest the profits they earned selling coffee in the manufacturing. The Italian workers, who earned wages, were a consumer market for the manufactures.

It is easier to compare São Paulo to the southern USA than to the northern USA.
Logged
FEMA Camp Administrator
Cathcon
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 27,284
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #4 on: February 06, 2017, 08:13:45 PM »

Also, I just realized, Russia abolished serfdom at around the time the US abolished slavery, and I believe some US abolitionists looked to that as inspiration. I'll have to research that part a little bit more.

I'd noted the near-simultaneous occurrence as well. While skimming around Cassius M. Clay's* Wikipedia page, I noted Clay does seem to have been inspired by the emancipation, telling Lincoln in 1862 that he would only fight if the President promised to emancipate the slaves. Incidentally, it appears that Alexander II vowed to enter the war should Britain and France intercede on behalf of the Confederacy. Rather perplexing that as illiberal and agrarian a country as Russia would fall on the side of ending slavery and promoting industrial capitalism (in this isolated instance). I'd be forced to speculate that it might be related to the cotton trade; it was the Civil War that spurred the Russians toward Central Asia, and Uzbekistan is still a significant source of cotton, as I recall. This might be attributing false motives, however.

*Not the boxer
Logged
FEMA Camp Administrator
Cathcon
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 27,284
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2017, 08:35:04 PM »

Also, holy sh#t.

Quote
You must be logged in to read this quote.
Logged
Cokeland Chastain
Rookie
**
Posts: 18
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #6 on: February 15, 2017, 01:06:57 PM »

Some countries in Europe (e.g. France)
Logged
Vosem
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 15,624
United States


Political Matrix
E: 8.13, S: -6.09

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #7 on: February 15, 2017, 11:09:34 PM »

Politically, culturally, and in a lot of respects, Australia is by far the most similar nation to the United States.
Logged
Lechasseur
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 10,757


Political Matrix
E: -0.52, S: 3.13

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #8 on: February 16, 2017, 10:30:18 AM »

Politically, culturally, and in a lot of respects, Australia is by far the most similar nation to the United States.
Agreed. This is what I've always told people.
Logged
Blue3
Starwatcher
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 12,035
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #9 on: February 16, 2017, 04:42:37 PM »

Try telling that to a snobby "America is evil, behind the world's problems, incompetent, failing, and irrelevant, all at once" Australian I know.
Logged
smoltchanov
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 7,376
Russian Federation


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #10 on: February 21, 2017, 03:38:27 AM »


+100. Though, not infrequently, in mirror imaage. It was "Go West, young man!", for example, in US, and "go East!" in Russia
Logged
Lachi
lok1999
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 3,347
Australia


Political Matrix
E: -1.06, S: -3.02

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #11 on: February 21, 2017, 03:47:26 AM »

Try telling that to a snobby "America is evil, behind the world's problems, incompetent, failing, and irrelevant, all at once" Australian I know.
Thankfully, those types of people are very rare to find over here.
Logged
Intell
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 6,817
Nepal


Political Matrix
E: -6.71, S: -1.24

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #12 on: February 21, 2017, 06:44:29 AM »

Canada.
Logged
smoltchanov
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 7,376
Russian Federation


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #13 on: February 21, 2017, 06:59:22 AM »


It's, of course, "nation of immigrants" too, but it's much "softer" (people are much more cared about by their government) then US.
Logged
Kringla Heimsins
Jr. Member
***
Posts: 346
France


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #14 on: February 27, 2017, 09:55:53 PM »

I'm French and I lived in Germany. To me, America and the United Kingdom are incredibly similar, and this goes way beyond the common language. But I bet the English wouldn't agree.
Logged
Pages: [1]  
« previous next »
Jump to:  


Login with username, password and session length

Terms of Service - DMCA Agent and Policy - Privacy Policy and Cookies

Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines

Page created in 0.048 seconds with 12 queries.