California Secession referendum in 2018?

[rob in cal]

   It looks like an initiative petition will be starting to try to get an initiative on the ballot in 2018 which if passed would trigger a follow up California independence referendum in early 2019.  I confess to liking the idea to an extent. There are obviously tonnes of logistic, economic, social, military, legal roadblocks and complications involved.  Still I think it might actually be a healthy situation for California to go its own way and try out its own solutions.  I think it might have a more conservative political impact for California and the remaining US.
   On immigration for instance a California government might want to switch to a point system which favors highly educated and skilled workers, and might look long and hard about how many new poorer and uneducated people we want coming into an economy that is already called the "hour glass economy". 
   I wonder if there were any Scottish Tories who voted for independence in their recent referendum. I remember reading about the argument that an independent Scotland would have made the remaining UK politically more conservative (which seems obvious), but also would have moved Scottish politics to the right as well.

[justfollowingtheelections]

I support the California independence movement too, even though I know it would be terrible losing our largest and richest state and the country will become more conservative.  They're getting screwed on so many issues and I would totally understand if they would want to leave. 

[Tender Branson]

Big hurdles:

Support is only 30% right now.

Congress has to approve with a 2/3 majority.

3/4 of states have to approve the secession of CA.

[Pandaguineapig]

Secession doesn't work like that, you would need congressional and state support  even if the voter want to secede. If this idea does take off from just a liberal tantrum over national elections not going their way I would think there would be a California national party that rises up because the national democrats will never support a secession that would make their party almost irrelevant on a federal level

[President Johnson]

Big hurdles:

Support is only 30% right now.

Congress has to approve with a 2/3 majority.

3/4 of states have to approve the secession of CA.

30% may be not the majority (not yet), but that is a huge number.

[America Needs R'hllor]

Cowardly move of a 5 year old child throwing a tantrum. Don't do this.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

6 Californias had $5 million backing it, and didn't even qualify for the ballot.

[DPKdebator]

If this ended up happening, I wonder if the more conservative inland parts of California would stay part of the U.S.

[justfollowingtheelections]

6 Californias had $5 million backing it, and didn't even qualify for the ballot.

But that was a terrible idea.

[MAINEiac4434]

Big hurdles:

Support is only 30% right now.

Congress has to approve with a 2/3 majority.

3/4 of states have to approve the secession of CA.

"Only" 30%. That is absurdly high for a secession referendum. There are 38.8 million people in California. This means 11 and a half million people support secession.

[100% pro-life no matter what]

If this actually happened, there would be a mass rush of some Californians trying to move to other states (and probably some of the reverse too).  But, if California were to vote to secede, let's just say that they're not worth fighting a war over, as long as conservative Californians can legally cross the border to Arizona.

[Firestorm]

If this ended up happening, I wonder if the more conservative inland parts of California would stay part of the U.S.

"If America is divisible, so is California."

...said the West Virginians.

Of course I nonetheless support this. Secessionists of the world, unite!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o3UUS1kx5oE

[R/H]

I think that California will instead focus on electing most Democrats as possible to the Congress because 2018 will be an opportunity for all the American people, including California, to demonstrate it's disapproval of Donald Trump's leadership.

Democrats will focus on keeping their senate seats in red states (MT, ND, MO, IN, WV) and on taking senate seats in Nevada, Arizona and probably even Utah (if Evan McMullin runs as an independent). That way the Democrats will be able to block all Trump's policies and décisions, so I don't think California needs to secede.

[Cashew]

I support the California independence movement too, even though I know it would be terrible losing our largest and richest state and the country will become more conservative.  They're getting screwed on so many issues and I would totally understand if they would want to leave.  

Honesty, I'm not too excited about leaving the United States, and would oppose many of the legislatures actions, still California is getting a raw deal as it is.

At the end of the day, my conditions for staying in are a repeal of the conneticut compromise, as well as abolishing the electoral college. No amount of nostalgia would gloss over how undereresented we are at the federal level.

Come to think of it thought, if the legislature does go too far and aim for what were previously constitutional rights at the federal level, I may very well welcome a federal invasion.

[Lothal1]

Well, if they vote on this good ruddance, but however the Supreme Court case Texas vs White says that if a state were to leave the union, they would need support from other states and congress, or a dissolution of the US.

[Bojack Horseman]

Hopefully the Congress would allow it to proceed. At least having an aunt that lives there, Od have a couch to crash on until I got on my feet.

[ag]

We would welcome our friends from Alta California into the new North American Union. Hopefully, Washington, Oregon and Hawaii would join in the movement. I also hope our Canadian partners would support it.

[America Needs R'hllor]

Well, if they vote on this good ruddance, but however the Supreme Court case Texas vs White says that if a state were to leave the union, they would need support from other states and congress, or a dissolution of the US.

Lol, good riddance? Face it, the US NEEDS California just as much as California needs the US because of the size and strength of its economy. You want to become a 3rd world country? The first step on the way there is to allow states like California and New York to secede.

[politicallefty]

If it makes the ballot, it will have my vote. I don't expect it to pass, but if the vote is even somewhat close (say at least in the low to mid-40s support), I expect it to have serious ramifications on political discourse in this country. If it were to actually somehow pass, I think we'd be facing one of the most serious constitutional crises this country has ever faced.

[America Needs R'hllor]

If it makes the ballot, it will have my vote. I don't expect it to pass, but if the vote is even somewhat close (say at least in the low to mid-40s support), I expect it to have serious ramifications on political discourse in this country. If it were to actually somehow pass, I think we'd be facing one of the most serious constitutional crises this country has ever faced.

Then you're just like these Brexit "sending a message, no chance it passes" voters.

[politicallefty]

Then you're just like these Brexit "sending a message, no chance it passes" voters.

Not at all. I actually would like it to pass. But if it doesn't, I'm not going to have my heart broken. There's no doubt it would send a powerful message if a significant population of a state chooses independence.

[AndyHogan14]

The 2018 referendum actually isn't for independence, it's to make it theoretically legal under state law. The California constitution currently says "The State of California is an inseparable part of the United States of America, and the United States Constitution is the supreme law of the land." The theoretical 2018 ballot proposition would strike that language from the state constitution and authorize an actual independence vote in 2019.

Even if someone doesn't want California to become independent, I would hope that they would still vote yes on the 2018 proposition because it may give us some leverage to help reform the federal government. I think a national popular vote amendment and congressional districts drawn by independent committees nationwide would be enough to kill any talk of secession. If the US government digs its heels in and tells CA to go f*** itself (possible with Trump as president), I'd give the 2019 initiative a better than 50% chance of passing.

If California actually votes for independence (both 2018 AND 2019), then it would be a rather insane turn of events and I would assume that both would get together and include California in the Compact of Free Association. CA would be a sovereign state politically, but we would remain one economically. If California were to leave economically as well, it would make Brexit look like child's play and both the CA and US economies would be in big trouble.

[Ronnie]

Let me put it this way: if America decides to go down the rabbit hole of ultra-nationalism, militarism, and isolationism, and, in a similar vein as the Labour Party in Israel or the CHP in Turkey, the national Democratic Party becomes permanently locked out of power, then I would at least think about supporting a secessionist movement.  But we'll cross that bridge when we get there.  There is no chance California will secede in 2018.

[LLR]

6 Californias had $5 million backing it, and didn't even qualify for the ballot.

But that was a terrible idea.

And this isn't? Wtf?

[justfollowingtheelections]

6 Californias had $5 million backing it, and didn't even qualify for the ballot.

But that was a terrible idea.

And this isn't? Wtf?

It is for the rest of us, but as I said, Californians are getting screwed when it comes to representation and appropriation of government funds.