Dems become big-time NATO supporters for some reason

[(Still) muted by Kalwejt until March 31]

I don't know what else one can call this other than classic stoogery:


Article here:

http://www.gallup.com/poll/204071/americans-support-nato-alliance.aspx

Shouldn't Dems be condemning NATO as militarist, terrorist, imperialist, harmful to U.S. interests, and a complete waste of money?

[Green Line]

Thank you Democrats!!

[ApatheticAustrian]

NATO is the last foothold of liberal democracy in the world.

it was without merits before putin made a war-loving imperialist religious superpower out of his country, whose only goal seems to be destroying the EU.

today either you support the NATO or you think defending democracy can be done with words and contracts alone.

[Comrade Funk]

Glad Democrats support defending liberal democracy from the fascist Russians and their puppets in Trump, Le Pen, et al.

[(Still) muted by Kalwejt until March 31]

NATO is the last foothold of liberal democracy in the world.

it was without merits before putin made a war-loving imperialist religious superpower out of his country, whose only goal seems to be destroying the EU.

today either you support the NATO or you think defending democracy can be done with words and contracts alone.

-NATO defends militant Islam, not democracy.

You also seem to misunderstand Russian goals badly.

[(Still) muted by Kalwejt until March 31]

BTW, the "last foothold of liberal democracy" is Switzerland, which has never been part of NATO or the E.U.

[Hindsight was 2020]

Your peo-Putin trolling shtick is getting old dude

[ApatheticAustrian]

NATO defends militant Islam

as an european, i know which country really helps militant islam.

and ofc i know of putin's goal to make the most out of the refugee mess.

not even talking about the new russian alliance with the afghan taliban.

[ApatheticAustrian]

BTW, the "last foothold of liberal democracy" is Switzerland, which has never been part of NATO or the E.U.

switzerland is as powerless and unimportant like during the second world war - and the are so liberal they also didn't give a piece of swiss cheese about the persecuted.

[Tartarus Sauce]

Your neo-Putin trolling shtick is getting old dude

[ApatheticAustrian]

don't really care if eharding is "trolling" or not, i respect nearly every opinion - it's just the kind of nihilistic vagueness which usually gets killed first if fascists take over a country.

[(Still) muted by Kalwejt until March 31]

NATO defends militant Islam

as an european, i know which country really helps militant islam.

and ofc i know of putin's goal to make the most out of the refugee mess.

not even talking about the new russian alliance with the afghan taliban.

-There is no Russian alliance with the Afghan Taliban; Russia is just willing to negotiate with them. Merkel and Erdogan did make the most of the refugee mess; Putin does not care if Europe's leaders stab it in the foot or not.

[(Still) muted by Kalwejt until March 31]

I mean, considering he quite literally trolls in every single one of his posts, I would think that people would stop responding to him.

-First people praise Santander over me because "he has a sense of humor", then condemn me for trolling. Well, guess what, folks, less than 5% of my posts can be described as trolling even under the most liberal definition of the term.

Under any serious examination, Dem support for NATO really is bizarre. Either they support militarism or they don't. Or they just do and don't do so opportunistically and only genuinely care about domestic issues.

[JA]

Democrats have rallied around globalization during the age of Trump. Despite some criticisms of these international organizations, treaties, and commitments from the left, we've realized how important they are when they've come under assault by "America First" types. This is why Democrats have suddenly become very supporting of free trade as well. We still have our critiques of these things, but we want to fix them from the inside and view abandoning them as more dangerous and counterproductive than remaining in them as-is.

America should remain an internationally engaged country in partnership with our global allies, particularly those in Europe. Eastern European countries are dependent upon our guarantee of protection from Russia, which has demonstrated a willingness to invade and destabilize neighboring countries. As long as they remain part of NATO, Russia won't touch them.

[ApatheticAustrian]

Putin does not care if Europe's leaders stab it in the foot or not.

do you really believe he "doesn't care" if his enemies make mistakes or not?

there are sooo many available informations about russian gloating, that they could stop the refugee crossing anytime they wanted, if they would feel like it.

radical russian muslims are used as putin's dirthy-work thugs for assassinations and stuff....well, another chechnyan killer, who should care? not even talking about the radicals who got offers like prison or migration.

all of this makes putin into the biggest enemy of freedom, radical muslims are only another chess piece for him to use how he likes.

[Phony Moderate]

These numbers remind me of when support for public healthcare amongst Republican voters mysteriously collapsed during the Obamacare debate. In both cases it is down to sheer partisan reactionism rather than to any critical thinking.

[(Still) muted by Kalwejt until March 31]

Putin does not care if Europe's leaders stab it in the foot or not.

do you really believe he "doesn't care" if his enemies make mistakes or not?

there are sooo many available informations about russian gloating, that they could stop the refugee crossing anytime they wanted, if they would feel like it.

radical russian muslims are used as putin's dirthy-work thugs for assassinations and stuff....well, another chechnyan killer, who should care? not even talking about the radicals who got offers like prison or migration.

all of this makes putin into the biggest enemy of freedom, radical muslims are only another chess piece for him to use how he likes.

-Since when is the present Russian administration a friend of Chechen militants? No; that role falls squarely on the American and British press.

The refugees do not pass through Russia, but through Turkey, Libya, and Morocco.

[ApatheticAustrian]

Dem support for NATO really is bizarre. Either they support militarism or they don't. Or they just do and don't do so opportunistically and only genuinely care about domestic issues.

dems have nothing to do with the "old left" anymore, which is - for example - described by the nice guy in your signature.

other voters, other values......war yes but - "don't to stupid shoot".

abe lincoln is much closer to today's democrats than Lee et al.

[Lief 🗽]

Uh, if you don't understand why Democrats support NATO, then you don't understand the Democratic Party or American liberalism, or the history of either.

[ApatheticAustrian]

Since when is the present Russian administration a friend of Chechen militants?

since chechnya is a dictatorship so grim that even putin can't totally control it and the local warlord uses his many thugs, who are also muslims, to be used for the most gruesome pro-regime jobs of all.

if some opposition figurehead is assassinated, the victim is officially always some little guy out of chechnya......connecting the dots isn't so difficult.

[(Still) muted by Kalwejt until March 31]

I mean, considering he quite literally trolls in every single one of his posts, I would think that people would stop responding to him.

-First people praise Santander over me because "he has a sense of humor", then condemn me for trolling. Well, guess what, folks, less than 5% of my posts can be described as trolling even under the most liberal definition of the term.

Under any serious examination, Dem support for NATO really is bizarre. Either they support militarism or they don't. Or they just do and don't do so opportunistically and only genuinely care about domestic issues.

What even is "militarism" according to you? If you just mean, supporting a strong national defense, then most liberals wouldn't disagree. The main problem was that a lot of money was wasted on failed projects and no bid contracts, as well as useless wars. The concept of NATO is not necessarily at odds with modern day liberal thought.

-NATO is not "a strong national defense" at all; it's just exposing America to a needless possibility of conflict, permitting other countries to rip America off, and a major contributor to world instability of every stripe. Remember, alliances were a big reason for why the First World War became a World War. Alliances, especially big multi-country ones, are inextricably meshed with militarism.

[Green Line]

Lot's of people unfortunately take NATO for granted.  There's not many living WWII people left around.  They remember why we can never go back to that kind of world.

[(Still) muted by Kalwejt until March 31]

Uh, if you don't understand why Democrats support NATO, then you don't understand the Democratic Party or American liberalism, or the history of either.

-Look at the 1990s #s, dude.

[(Still) muted by Kalwejt until March 31]

Lot's of people unfortunately take NATO for granted.  There's not many living WWII people left around.  They remember why we can never go back to that kind of world.

-Yeah; the wars in Libya and Syria are so, so great! Let's thank the great fighters of the wildly successful Operation Euphrates Shield!

[ApatheticAustrian]

NATO is not "a strong national defense" at all; it's just exposing America to a needless possibility of conflict, permitting other countries to rip America off, and a major contributor to world instability of every stripe. Remember, alliances were a big reason for why the First World War became a World War. Alliances, especially big multi-country ones, are inextricably meshed with militarism.

don't want to be disrespectful, even if i am talking to you pretty blunt, but you argue like someone, who wants to convince people, that only isolationism and bridge-building could ever be in the interest of the US, while russia makes the total opposite and increases its influence on a daily basis.