Lefties and left-of-center people: Who do you support in the French election?

[Crumpets]

Inspired by Antonio's criticism of Macron, I'm curious how the different leftist factions in the US see the different left and center-left and centrist candidates in France. I'm not including Fillon, Dupont-Aignan, and Le Pen for obvious reasons.

Personally, I like Macron for three main reasons: 1) He's polling strongly against Le Pen, which is basically the only thing I really care about. 2) He has enough populist appeal to have some political capital should he get into office, while Hamon will be saddled with Hollande's legacy, no matter how much he tries to distance himself. And 3) Basically everyone to the left of those two has to practical chance of winning and is generally too far to the left for my comfort zone. I suspect if I tried to chart the candidates political positions compared to my own, I'd be about equal distance from Macron and Hamon, but I have more confidence in Macron to win and govern than Hamon.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Hamon (normal)

2) He has enough populist appeal to have some political capital should he get into office, while Hamon will be saddled with Hollande's legacy, no matter how much he tries to distance himself.

God this is absurd. Macron was a Government Minister who thought up and enacted Hollande's policies and his whole economic program is to triple down on nice pragmatic managerial post-ideological neoliberal centrist bullsh*t. Hamon resigned from said government because he disagreed with basically everything it was doing economically. But somehow Hamon is "saddled with Hollande's legacy"?

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Hamon. He's a Berniecrat rather than 3rd way, and unlike Mélenchon seems like he could actually win.

[Since I'm the mad scientist proclaimed by myself]

Marcon(wants someone who beat Le Pen, is willing to endorse a muh neolibril to do that instead of a favorite candidate that isn't as strong)

[Crumpets]

Hamon (normal)

2) He has enough populist appeal to have some political capital should he get into office, while Hamon will be saddled with Hollande's legacy, no matter how much he tries to distance himself.

God this is dumb. Macron was a Government Minister who thought up and enacted Hollande's policies and his whole economic program is to triple down on nice pragmatic managerial post-ideological neoliberal centrist bullsh*t. Hamon resigned from tsaid government because he disagreed with basically everything it was doing economically. But somehow Hamon is "saddled with Hollande's legacy"?

I don't care if you're an American who barely ever hears anything about French politics, try to learn a little more before making posts like these.

I admit I don't watch French news closely enough that I would feel I was actually making an informed vote in their election, and I trust that you are probably much, much more familiar with the candidates than I am. But let me elaborate as to why I said that. The policies that Macron helped enact as Minister of the Economy, Industry and Digital Affairs aren't exactly the ones that are the source of Hollande's unpopularity. Meanwhile, Hamon comes across (at least to me) as an even more naïve version of Hollande only with some "but I can get it done!" thrown in. If a major selling point of your candidacy is that the current president from your own party has no idea what he's doing, you're kind of in a lose-lose situation. If you argue he does know what he's doing, despite his unpopularity, you're also in a lose-lose situation. That's what I meant by him being saddled.

Perhaps you could help dispel with fiction by pointing out what someone who disapproves of Hollande would find promising in Hamon's candidacy, apart from the fact that he resigned from his position.

[Antonio the Sixth]

First off sorry for the tone of my previous post, that was completely uncalled-for. It's just the effect Macron has on me.

The policies that Macron helped enact as Minister of the Economy, Industry and Digital Affairs aren't exactly the ones that are the source of Hollande's unpopularity.

What makes you say that? I mean, we can discuss for years about the reasons of Hollande's unpopularity (when your approval % is lower than the legal age to vote, you must have screwed up more than one thing), but it's pretty clear that the reason why he's become so unpopular among the left is that he betrayed the entire economic program on which he ran and ended up doubling down on neoliberal voodoo economics, with tax breaks for corporations, tax hikes for the middle class (through the VAT), deregulation of the labor market, etc. There's a reason Hamon kicked Valls' ass in the primary last month: it was a rejection exactly of all the policies that the Hollande/Valls/Macron unholy trinity championed. (Hollande himself has made hints that he really supports Macron, even though he can't say so in public.)

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Hollande's 2012 platform was full of symbolic, feel-good measures rehashed from the French left's past or from the fads of the moment, intended as a synthesis of different currents of the PS electorate. Hamon's platform proposes a genuinely bold new vision to fundamentally transform French society in a more egalitarian direction (UBI, taxing the means of production, sharing work-hours...).

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Since I just answered that, I'd like to know what the hell you find promising in Macron's proposal of tripling-down on neoliberalism except with a younger and more "hip" face.

[America Needs R'hllor]

Easily Macron, for a simple reason- he lines up with me ideologically almost perfectly.

[Lachi]

Hamon, but Macron would be fine.

[Beet]

Hamon for reasons I stated earlier, but anyone but Le Pen. Even Fillon would be better.

[nicholas.slaydon]

Hamon.

[Intell]

I mean if you're fine with third-way policies tax cuts for business, market and labor liberalisation, cuts to public services, austerity, attacks on labour unions, and all the right-wing polices of Hollande's government, forcing such right-wing policies, even at objection of parliment and the party, than sure vote for Marcon.

Hamon is an actual leftist, who resigned in regards to Hollande's right-wing policies, and Hollande's failure in government, and neoliberal measures made to f*k workers, and the poor.

But sure Marcon, a person in Hollande's cabinet, and in ministry until 2016, when he resigned to run for president and an entrenched part of Hollande's legacy is nowhere put in picture, because he's such a HIP CANDIDATE.

[Lexii, harbinger of chaos and sexual anarchy]

I prefer Hamon, but I'd likely vote for Macron in the first round

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

tbh in some way I think Macron would better than a Holandist (in the same way Renzi was better than the dinosaurs like Bersani - the Hollande presidency is basically the consequence of handing the top job to, essentially, a mediocre party bureaucrat) but Hamon.

tbh I'm pretty sure whoever wins will plummet almost immediately to Flanby levels. Maybe Le Pen will score a bit higher with her loyal cultists, unless her niece throws her under the bridge for not immediately kicking out all the Muslims or whatever.

[MAINEiac4434]

Macron mostly because he polls higher and therefore has a better of chance of interrupting the Fillon-Le Pen duopoly, but either he or Hamon are fine.

[Kingpoleon]

Macron mostly because he polls higher and therefore has a better of chance of interrupting the Fillon-Le Pen duopoly, but either he or Hamon are fine.

Could you retake the PM test? Yours doesn't seem accurate, with Kennedy, Macron, D66, and Newsom in your signature.

[Horus]

Macron, but I guess Hamon isn't that bad.

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

I prefer Hamon, but I'd likely vote for Macron in the first round

[Maxwell]

1) Hamon
2) Melehcon



Better than the horribles and the jokers) Macron
basically equal in horribleness) Fillon and Le Pen

gun to my head if its a Fillon and Le Pen run-off, I may have to vote Le Pen because she'd basically be powerless since I doubt National Front has a chance of gaining a substantial coalition in government.

[Blair]

For what it's worth Macron has taken a hit in the polls lately, and is very untested as a campaigner.

However I'll give the standard blairite answer of obvs supporting Macron. I'm enough of a sadist to hope that he punishes the UK, or offers Prime Minister Khan a new deal in 2025

[MAINEiac4434]

Macron mostly because he polls higher and therefore has a better of chance of interrupting the Fillon-Le Pen duopoly, but either he or Hamon are fine.

Could you retake the PM test? Yours doesn't seem accurate, with Kennedy, Macron, D66, and Newsom in your signature.

My personal politics are radical and extremely far-left. But I'm more concerned with keeping the right-wing out of power. I generally support candidates and parties who are in the best position to do that. That isn't always the party or candidate that best allies with my views. Ergo, Macron.

For D66, I can't support SP and GL in the Netherlands due to their anti-nuclear energy stances which harms the environment, and I don't like Asscher for PVDA.p

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

Macron mostly because he polls higher and therefore has a better of chance of interrupting the Fillon-Le Pen duopoly, but either he or Hamon are fine.

Could you retake the PM test? Yours doesn't seem accurate, with Kennedy, Macron, D66, and Newsom in your signature.

My personal politics are radical and extremely far-left. But I'm more concerned with keeping the right-wing out of power. I generally support candidates and parties who are in the best position to do that. That isn't always the party or candidate that best allies with my views. Ergo, Macron.

For D66, I can't support SP and GL in the Netherlands due to their anti-nuclear energy stances which harms the environment, and I don't like Asscher for PVDA.p

If it's any consolation, there is like one nuclear plant in the whole of the Netherlands and it provides less than 5% of Dutch electricity. So it's not like a pro- or anti-nuclear party will matter very much in that respect (especially as even if you elect the most pro-nuclear power party on earth, it will take about eight decades to build given the amusing failures of all new builds going on).

[Lexii, harbinger of chaos and sexual anarchy]

For what it's worth Macron has taken a hit in the polls lately, and is very untested as a campaigner.

Isn't Hamon relatively untested as well?

[DavidB.]

If it's any consolation, there is like one nuclear plant in the whole of the Netherlands and it provides less than 5% of Dutch electricity. So it's not like a pro- or anti-nuclear party will matter very much in that respect (especially as even if you elect the most pro-nuclear power party on earth, it will take about eight decades to build given the amusing failures of all new builds going on).

I already tried to explain this, but to no avail. Anyway, no person with "radical and extremely far left" politics would vote for the party that increasingly often out-right-wings the VVD on economic issues.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

I would stare blankly at the ballot papers on offer and cry.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

I'm sorry, but what "populist appeal" does Macron have, exactly?

Evidently a lot because that's all he has going for him, really. It feels like a bad joke of course (the Antisystem Contender who literally worked for the Rothschild Bank), but that's politics for you.