End of gerrymandering

[American2020]

What do you want to replace gerrymandering for US House of representatives ?

[justfollowingtheelections]

Just draw straight lines.

[Tintrlvr]

MMP basically eliminates the incentives for gerrymandering (other than, I suppose, incumbent protection), provided you have enough at-large seats available to create proportionality.

[MarkD]

A little over 3 years ago I drafted a proposal for a constitutional amendment that rewrites Section 1 of the 14th Amendment to make its meaning narrower and clearer. It is long and detailed and I was careful to design it as a compromise between conservative and liberal points of view. One provision within it requires all of the states to use independent commissions to draw congressional district maps and state legislative district maps  And I'd be perfectly willing to change my proposal so that it requires redistricting done by computers that use algorithms.

[Heisenberg]

"Independent" commissions are just a different type of gerrymander IMO. How about minimizing county splits.

[Lachi]

STV in statewide districts

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

STV in statewide districts

Interesting but the number of candidates in say California and votes would make it rather complex, no?

"Independent" commissions are just a different type of gerrymander IMO. How about minimizing county splits.

Some commissions are bad and some legislatures are pretty good.

Commissions alone are not enough. Iowa has a whole county requirement and combination. Commission offers the legislature maps and if they reject the first two, whatever the third map is, gets picked.

You have to have a good set of a rules. A good set of rules can leash a bad legislature to bring it under control (Florida). A Commission with a weak set of guidelines can be just a bad as a legislature (Arizona).

Some of the best maps in my opinion of the previous cycle were drawn by courts (New York and Colorado).

[Starpaul20]

STV with statewide districts for all states that have 5 seats or less in the house and multi-member districts of either 3, 4 or 5 seats for all the larger states (6 seats or more).

[muon2]

STV in statewide districts

Interesting but the number of candidates in say California and votes would make it rather complex, no?

"Independent" commissions are just a different type of gerrymander IMO. How about minimizing county splits.

Some commissions are bad and some legislatures are pretty good.

Commissions alone are not enough. Iowa has a whole county requirement and combination. Commission offers the legislature maps and if they reject the first two, whatever the third map is, gets picked.

You have to have a good set of a rules. A good set of rules can leash a bad legislature to bring it under control (Florida). A Commission with a weak set of guidelines can be just a bad as a legislature (Arizona).

Some of the best maps in my opinion of the previous cycle were drawn by courts (New York and Colorado).

I agree that the rules are more important than the body. With good software and well-defined rules there's nothing that prevents the public from drawing the maps. Final approval can happen by the legislature as in IA.

[Lachi]

STV with statewide districts for all states that have 5 seats or less in the house and multi-member districts of either 3, 4 or 5 seats for all the larger states (6 seats or more).

That sounds much better, didn't think about that when I first posted.

[Slander and/or Libel]

STV with statewide districts for all states that have 5 seats or less in the house and multi-member districts of either 3, 4 or 5 seats for all the larger states (6 seats or more).

https://uselectionatlas.org/FORUM/index.php?topic=194907.0

This was pretty much my first post in this forum.

[Enduro]

Just draw straight lines.

[Antonio the Sixth]

PR would be best, but if we HAVE to keep using FPP then the British system is the only way forward.

[muon2]

Just draw straight lines.

A bad idea. Rivers make natural borders in many cases and they are usually anything but straight.

[politicallefty]

I agree that the rules are more important than the body. With good software and well-defined rules there's nothing that prevents the public from drawing the maps. Final approval can happen by the legislature as in IA.

Doesn't the IA plan allow the legislature to eventually draw the map themselves if they keep refusing what is giving to them? If so, I don't think that's an acceptable remedy to gerrymandering.

Not every independent commission gets it right and not every legislature gets it wrong. Washington and New Jersey strike me as states with independent panels that are prone to failure (i.e. tie-breaker models) and erred in their maps.

I think California's system is one of the better ones that stymies partisan/incumbent gerrymandering. It requires a majority of all parties to agree to specific maps. I'd like to extend a system like that to encourage the people themselves to submit maps subject to specific criteria for consideration.

[muon2]

I agree that the rules are more important than the body. With good software and well-defined rules there's nothing that prevents the public from drawing the maps. Final approval can happen by the legislature as in IA.

Doesn't the IA plan allow the legislature to eventually draw the map themselves if they keep refusing what is giving to them? If so, I don't think that's an acceptable remedy to gerrymandering.

Not every independent commission gets it right and not every legislature gets it wrong. Washington and New Jersey strike me as states with independent panels that are prone to failure (i.e. tie-breaker models) and erred in their maps.

I think California's system is one of the better ones that stymies partisan/incumbent gerrymandering. It requires a majority of all parties to agree to specific maps. I'd like to extend a system like that to encourage the people themselves to submit maps subject to specific criteria for consideration.

You are mostly correct. If the IA legislature fails to enact either of the first two plans, then the third plan submitted to the legislature can be amended. If that amended plan fails it goes to the court. Even with the partisan make up after the 2010 election, the process did not get to the amendment stage.

Your last point about having the public submit maps is part of my motive for the muon rules (SPICE). They define measurable criteria to judge submissions from the public, politicians or computers. The maps can be crowdsourced and the best plans given to the legislature for approval. I'd leave off the amendment step and have the Sec of State certify the best submitted plan if none are approved.

[Figueira]

MMP, but the most realistic option would be redistricting commissions.

[krazen1211]

Nothing is not an option in the poll.

[Lachi]

Nothing is not an option in the poll.

Oh, well that's simple: Nothing= HP

[KingSweden]

Commissions are better than the nakedly partisan crap you see a lot, though they're not perfect. WA's commission is basically an incumbent protection racket