Why did God say: Let us give Satan to mankind?

[Greatest I am]

Why did God say: Let us give Satan to mankind?

God created Eden as his heaven on Earth so that he could, some day come down and rule over us.

He cast Satan out of heaven. I guess because she was creating a huge division there, and decided to send her to Earth, to also create division here, which she did.

Why would a good God curse the Earth by sending Satan, the personification of evil, to Earth?

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

Why do you refer to Satan as female?

Because the Orthodox church portrayed her as such.

https://www.google.ca/search?q=michelangelo++eden&biw=1004&bih=564&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi7lIWYgrHSAhVk0oMKHdIVARQQ_AUIBigB&dpr=1.45#imgdii=8OC0KcUfsVExhM:&imgrc=89L0Nrtb4bVcCM:

Do those breasts look like a man's breasts to you?

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

Why do you, a ~Gnostic Christian~, care?

I am looking for opinions on something rather strange in the Christian dogma.

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

Why do you refer to Satan as female?

Because the Orthodox church portrayed her as such.

https://www.google.ca/search?q=michelangelo++eden&biw=1004&bih=564&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi7lIWYgrHSAhVk0oMKHdIVARQQ_AUIBigB&dpr=1.45#imgdii=8OC0KcUfsVExhM:&imgrc=89L0Nrtb4bVcCM:

Do those breasts look like a man's breasts to you?

Regards
DL

Orthodox Church ... Michelangelo

Michelangelo's proportions in his later work are a bit odd, he overdrew muscles and this wouldn't be unusual for a late Michelangelo painting of a male figure

Breasts are not muscles.

Note that Adam is clearly male while Satan is clearly female.

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

Why do you refer to Satan as female?

Because the Orthodox church portrayed her as such.

Do those breasts look like a man's breasts to you?

Regards
DL

Is that literally your only reason?

No. I think that Christianity has always wanted to vilify women and make them second class, hence their, he shall rule over you line in Genesis and the admonishment to remain silent in church and not dare try to teach men.

What is your reason for thinking Satan is a man?

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

Do those breasts look like a man's breasts to you?

It's good to see the continuation of the top-notch religious discussion this board is known for. I've already learned that Michelangelo is the Orthodox Church, and there are so many hours left in this day!

He painted what the church wanted.

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

Why do you refer to Satan as female?

Because the Orthodox church portrayed her as such.

Do those breasts look like a man's breasts to you?

Regards
DL

Is that literally your only reason?

No. I think that Christianity has always wanted to vilify women and make them second class, hence their, he shall rule over you line in Genesis and the admonishment to remain silent in church and not dare try to teach men.

Sure, which is why you have Lilith, the Whore of Babylon, etc. But you also have Sophia.

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The fact that I was raised in a Christian household.

Did no one in your home ever look at the iconography of Christianity?

No need to reply as the answer is obvious.

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

Do those breasts look like a man's breasts to you?

It's good to see the continuation of the top-notch religious discussion this board is known for. I've already learned that Michelangelo is the Orthodox Church, and there are so many hours left in this day!

He painted what the church wanted.

Regards
DL

Not really

Then why did the Pope pay the bill?

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

Sure, which is why you have Lilith, the Whore of Babylon, etc. But you also have Sophia.

I wanted to reply to this alone.

Sophia is representing wisdom. Wisdom is proceeded by knowledge. You might have noticed, that unlike the Jews who see Eden as our elevation, Christianity saw A & E gaining the knowledge that leads to wisdom as a grave sin.

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

[

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You think my family is unique in regarding Satan as male?

That is not implied in my question. Most Christians have little knowledge of their religion.
That is why they can adore a genocidal son murdering God and stay in an intolerant, homophobic and misogynous religion.

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It led to the knowledge of good and evil, which has caused countless men and women to stumble.

[/quote]

How do you know they stumble?
Your moral sense tells you that. Right?

Would you give up the moral sense that came to you thanks to A & E?

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

You know that Satan appears in the Bible and is consistently referred to as male, right?

No. I do not recall her gender ever being spoken of.

How about showing what you have.

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

Let's not get hung-up the gender of a bodiless person, whom not even all Christians believe to even be real.

This is actually the first thread by this guy in a while that might have some potential.

I think almost all Christians buy into the apostles creed and that would make them almost have to believe in Satan.

You are likely right in thinking that some of them are not as delusional as the majority.

That would make them cherry pickers though and not real literalists.

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

That is not implied in my question. Most Christians have little knowledge of their religion.
That is why they can adore a genocidal son murdering God and stay in an intolerant, homophobic and misogynous religion.

They know enough about their religion to practice it, you see, for Christianity has been practiced continuously since its inception - forming a tradition with a two-thousand-year-long paper trail. Which tradition has always regarded Satan as male.

Don't worry, I forgive you if you find this concept a little tricky to grasp. You are a self-described Gnostic.

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No, it has nothing to do with my moral sense. Just look at their lives.

Your looking from a moral perspective are you not?

If not, what perspective are you looking from to form your negative view?

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

That is not implied in my question. Most Christians have little knowledge of their religion.
That is why they can adore a genocidal son murdering God and stay in an intolerant, homophobic and misogynous religion.

They know enough about their religion to practice it, you see, for Christianity has been practiced continuously since its inception - forming a tradition with a two-thousand-year-long paper trail.

Yes and they have also left a trail of dead people with their Inquisitions.

Christianity and Islam have both grown their religions by the sword instead of good deeds.

I cannot forgive you for ignoring the more vile aspects of Christianity.

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

Your looking from a moral perspective are you not? If not, what perspective are you looking from to form your negative view?

The perspective of human suffering. That we can tell the difference between the way the world is, and the way the world should be, has caused a lot of pain. Just look at the story of Cain and Abel.

They know enough about their religion to practice it, you see, for Christianity has been practiced continuously since its inception - forming a tradition with a two-thousand-year-long paper trail.

Yes and they have also left a trail of dead people with their Inquisitions. Christianity and Islam have both grown their religions by the sword instead of good deeds. I cannot forgive you for ignoring the more vile aspects of Christianity.

asserting that Satan has always been regarded as male = ignoring the more vile aspects of Christianity???

I'd tell you to lay off the crack cocaine, but the results are just too amusing.

To know suffering is evil shows you are using your moral sense.

Thanks for making my point.

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

To know suffering is evil shows you are using your moral sense. Thanks for making my point.

Suffering isn't necessarily evil, but evil is necessarily suffering.

If there were no evil, there would be less suffering.

Regards
RAB

Show an example of suffering being good.

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

Show an example of suffering being good.

When your back hurts from sitting at the computer desk, so you go outside and take a walk.

That is quite a reach.

I see it as the impulse to walk as good but the suffering itself as being evil.

It would be better if our bodies gave us an itch instead of pain or suffering.

I do get what you were thinking though.

I would have used something more in line with the pains of healing, like after an opperation.

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

It would be better if our bodies gave us an itch instead of pain or suffering.

If we knew nothing worse than an itch, it would seem an agony to us.

Yes but an agony easily cured by scratching.

I would take itch over pain. Wouldn't you?

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

It would be better if our bodies gave us an itch instead of pain or suffering.

No it wouldn't. Read A Canticle for Leibowitz.

If it had an answer, I am sure you would have given it instead of a useless suggestion.

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

It would be better if our bodies gave us an itch instead of pain or suffering.

If we knew nothing worse than an itch, it would seem an agony to us.

Yes but an agony easily cured by scratching.

The easiest solution isn't always the best.

Regards

If the result is the same, yes it is.

Where did you learned your engineering.

I learned mine from engineers, not lawyers who know how to pad a bill.

Even lowly chimps know this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JwwclyVYTkk

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

It would be better if our bodies gave us an itch instead of pain or suffering.

If we knew nothing worse than an itch, it would seem an agony to us.

Yes but an agony easily cured by scratching.

The easiest solution isn't always the best.

Regards

If the result is the same, yes it is.

But in this case, the result is not the same. What do you have against walking?

Where did walking enter our discussion?

Regardless, if walking half a mile gave the same results as walking a mile then the walker has wasted the time it took to walk the extra half mile when he could have been, let's say, working on his upper body.

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

People inflict minor pain on themselves to get rid of itches all the time. I, at least, wouldn't choose an ineradicable itch over even major pain.

Anyway, this is a pointless digression from the topic of an asinine thread.

Yes it was because no one said the itch was ineradicable.

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

People inflict minor pain on themselves to get rid of itches all the time. I, at least, wouldn't choose an ineradicable itch over even major pain.

Anyway, this is a pointless digression from the topic of an asinine thread.

Yes it was because no one said the itch was ineradicable.

Regards
DL

No one said the pain was ineradicable either.

Again, this is pointless.

True, when you ignore your own words.

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

It would be better if our bodies gave us an itch instead of pain or suffering.

If we knew nothing worse than an itch, it would seem an agony to us.

Yes but an agony easily cured by scratching.

The easiest solution isn't always the best.

Regards

If the result is the same, yes it is.

Where did you learned your engineering.

I learned mine from engineers, not lawyers who know how to pad a bill.

Even lowly chimps know this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JwwclyVYTkk

Regards
DL

What chimps don't know is that life is more than that box with the treat in front of them.  It also involves the people who brought the box.  If you want more treats, simply cutting to the chase for the immediately in sight goal might not be the best policy.

Engineering says that the less moves to any given system tends to improve performance of the whole. So to engineers, doing useless steps in not the best.

Chimps 1. Humans 0 in terms of out of the box thinking.

Regards
DL 

[Greatest I am]

Satan has traditionally described as a male in Jewish and Christian writing from the earliest times, though with innovation in this from time to time. In the late medieval period, iconography of the Fall in the adopted the practice of showing the serpent as appearing to Eve in the form of a woman.

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http://www.christianiconography.info/adamEve.html

I have seen nothing in the old myths that give Satan a gender at all. I do agree that the perception to most is to see Satan as a male, but that was not the way the ancients thought, from what I have read.

Can you link me up to what you say you have seen of Satan as a male?

Regards
DL