Dems now demonize the same policies Obama once championed

[(Still) muted by Kalwejt until March 31]

Another excellent piece on Dem hypocrisy by the good Glenn Greenwald:

https://theintercept.com/2017/03/06/democrats-now-demonize-the-same-russia-policies-that-obama-long-championed/

Seriously, I really am tired of the mad Russophobia emanating from the Dems. If only Saudi Arabia were given the same treatment! What's next, the Dems calling for war on Iran?

[ApatheticAustrian]

i am all but not a friend of SA, even while they are improving during the last years and take blame for their many mistakes and try to redeem themselves a little bit.

imho SA would be much more deserving of a travel ban or sanctions than many other countries but compared to the danger russia today symbolizes for liberalism and moden progressivism, SA is a real regional power.

i understand that the nihilicstic relativists at the intercept could never understand this and are still living in the cold war era, in which russia was still somehow seen as "left-wing" ....but today this country is ruled by nothing but illiberalism, anti-capitalism, religion and far-right thoughts, which are exported all over the west each day through hundreds of channels.

[JA]

Sort of like the Republican hypocrisy on the ACA, which was essentially modeled after Gov. Romney's healthcare plan and the one promoted by Republicans in Congress and the Heritage Foundation in the late '90s?

We're in a period of hyper-partisanship and polarization. If Trump is a proponent of X, Democrats will rally against X. If Obama supported Y, Republicans hated Y. Of course both sides will rationalize it because they can't make it obvious that the underlying philosophy of their policy position is "I hate that guy so now I hate that policy."

[Trapsy]

The notion that calling for investigations into Trump-Russian relations makes you hawkish is ridiculous. I think the rampant noise of calls for investigations is annoying and may reflect that sentiment. It also due to part that Republicans are looking to stall these investigations for their own policy goals. I want you to point out the democratic hypocrisy regarding  Obama's policy on Russia because in the article GG points out that hawkish wing of the party were in disagreement with Obama but its alluding that democrats were once in cohesion with Obama.

In the large scheme of things aligning your administration with Russia is not a good FP or beneficial t our European allies especially when Putin is trying undermine elections throughout the west through these cyber information wars.

We need to investigate Trump's financial/political ties to Russia so we know whether or not Trump is compromised to Putin. We just need a conclusion to understand where Trump stands, so we can strictly focus on policy but Trump's resistance only fogs this Russia talk with hysteria that is not beneficial to anyone.

[Hindsight was 2020]

Oh please Glenn is a Putin apologist hack who like Assang has no problem backing him because they both hate Western governments more

[Antonio the Sixth]

Both sides do it.

[Dr. Arch]

Both sides do it.

Gtfo

[Antonio the Sixth]

Both sides do it.

Gtfo

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarcasm

[Dr. Arch]

Both sides do it.

Gtfo

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarcasm

No sarcasm tag so I thought you contracted bronzitis.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Explain this to me EHarding...

Republicans say that the news is sensationalizing Mexican deportations now that Trump is in office but when Obama was actually deporting illegals at higher rates the news didn't cover it.  Does that not undercut the conservative argument that Obama was weak on immigration and we need a wall?  Do you see hypocrisy in this?

A reminder that Obama and Hillary both voted for the wall.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secure_Fence_Act_of_2006

[Devout Centrist]

Greenwald, Uygur, and Dore are cancers on liberalism. An unholy trinity of bullsh**ting.

[Vosem]

Wanting to cozy up to the Russian regime was bad when Obama was doing it and it's still bad now that Trump is doing it. One of the fringe benefits of it being such an intense topic of discussion right now is that more-or-less all Democrats and FP-oriented Republicans should try to block any future attempts, at least until after the Putin regime has fallen, so that this sort of thing won't happen again. The pressure from home is probably strong enough to force Trump into hawkish activity, like hopefully strengthening of sanctions, as well.

[SteveRogers]

For the last time, one can support détente with Russia without supporting fondling Putin's you-know-whats when he orders that crimes be committed on U.S. soil. Those two things are not the same policy.

[MeanBeanMachine]

Unfortunately this happens in politics.  It's a shame.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

Both sides do it.

Gtfo

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarcasm

No sarcasm tag so I thought you contracted bronzitis.

Putting /sarcasm defeats the whole purpose of making a sarcastic post.

[(Still) muted by Kalwejt until March 31]

Explain this to me EHarding...

Republicans say that the news is sensationalizing Mexican deportations now that Trump is in office but when Obama was actually deporting illegals at higher rates the news didn't cover it.  Does that not undercut the conservative argument that Obama was weak on immigration and we need a wall?  Do you see hypocrisy in this?

-O was quite weak on immigration. He could have been weaker. Nothing complicated.

[(Still) muted by Kalwejt until March 31]

Wanting to cozy up to the Russian regime was bad when Obama was doing it and it's still bad now that Trump is doing it. One of the fringe benefits of it being such an intense topic of discussion right now is that more-or-less all Democrats and FP-oriented Republicans should try to block any future attempts, at least until after the Putin regime has fallen, so that this sort of thing won't happen again. The pressure from home is probably strong enough to force Trump into hawkish activity, like hopefully strengthening of sanctions, as well.

-What's your beef with RU, again?

[FEMA Camp Administrator]

Wanting to cozy up to the Russian regime was bad when Obama was doing it and it's still bad now that Trump is doing it. One of the fringe benefits of it being such an intense topic of discussion right now is that more-or-less all Democrats and FP-oriented Republicans should try to block any future attempts, at least until after the Putin regime has fallen, so that this sort of thing won't happen again. The pressure from home is probably strong enough to force Trump into hawkish activity, like hopefully strengthening of sanctions, as well.

-What's your beef with RU, again?

Vosem's heritage is Jewish-Russian. His username is an Anglo perversion of "восем".

[Chunk Yogurt for President!]

Not surprising.

[Associate Justice PiT]

Not surprising.

     It's an expected result of partisan politics. As an aside, this is why partisan politics poisons governments.

[Chief Justice Keef]

I'm gonna be the contrarian leftist and say that I actually like Glenn Greenwald and I get what he's saying here.

The Democrats' fixation on Russia is honestly troubling considering the terrible things that are going on in Washington right now. The GOP is ready to pass a bill that'll take away coverage for preexisting conditions while giving out more corporate tax cuts, but instead some Democrats like Chris Coons want to shutdown the federal government because of Russia. It just comes off as hawkish and, frankly, unresponsive to the massive threat the GOP's policies pose to low-income and middle-class Americans, something that investigating and impeaching Trump won't solve.

Should Democrats push for investigations into possible ties between the Trump admin. and Russia? Yeah, sure. It compensates for the endless GOP investigations into Hillary and Benghazi. But the mentality taken on by some liberals, such as that solving the Russian conspiracy will end our national nightmare, is outright delusional.

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

For the last time, one can support détente with Russia without supporting fondling Putin's you-know-whats when he orders that crimes be committed on U.S. soil. Those two things are not the same policy.

The point is Democrats are not supporting Obama-style detente.

[Bojack Horseman]

Welcome to politics, this is Mitt Romney.

[Virginiá]

Personally, the actual policy that was changed (Ukraine arms) never really bothered me so much as the possible motive behind the change. Let's say for a minute that Russia really did get Trump's team to change this (not proven), that would mean that Trump made changes to US foreign policy in a secret deal with Russia, presumably in return for hurting Clinton's campaign. That is unacceptable, regardless if the policy change aligns with Obama's policy or not, because it's not really about the specific policy.

I just want this whole Russia thing to be thoroughly investigated, so we can move on from this kind of speculation. If Trump really did cut a deal with Russia for them to attack Clinton's campaign/DNC and help throw the election to Trump, then he needs to be removed from office and prosecuted.

[Mr. Morden]

If Trump really did cut a deal with Russia for them to attack Clinton's campaign/DNC and help throw the election to Trump, then he needs to be removed from office and prosecuted.

I agree that it should be investigated, but I just think it's highly unlikely that anything like that happened in such an explicit manner.  More likely would be that Trump people saw Putin acting against Clinton, and decided to egg them on....giving Russia more things that they would want, in order for them to continue, without ever cutting an explicit deal.  That's pretty much how campaign finance corruption happens.  You do things that your donors want, and they keep giving you money, without either of you having to actually articulate the corrupt bargain that you're engaging in (because that would get you in trouble).

Now, I think that if Trump world had any meetings with Russian officials during the campaign in which they telegraphed future foreign policy intentions, that in itself is highly scandalous, because that is quite obviously giving them more motive to hack Clinton world during the campaign.  But I can't see something like that in itself ever leading to Trump impeachment, even if there were a Democratic Congress.  The people in the meetings could get canned, but that's as far as it would go.