Did Hillary Clinton do anything right
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  Did Hillary Clinton do anything right
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Author Topic: Did Hillary Clinton do anything right  (Read 3379 times)
Da2017
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« on: March 13, 2017, 08:57:30 PM »
« edited: March 13, 2017, 09:07:46 PM by Da2017 »

There was lot of talk about how she ran an awful campaign. Was there anything Hillary Clinton's campaign did right?
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Skill and Chance
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« Reply #1 on: March 13, 2017, 09:04:32 PM »

Taking Nevada seriously as a swing state?
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Eharding
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« Reply #2 on: March 13, 2017, 09:10:56 PM »
« Edited: March 13, 2017, 09:12:54 PM by Eharding »

Yes. Go after Trump personally to attempt to make him an unacceptable candidate. Arguably, cleverly avoid policy discussion to court moderate Republicans. I mean, look at how Texas swung.

Also, she prepped for the debates.

There were a lot of mistakes also (even at the debates), of course; in fact, a boatload of them. From claiming America was illegals' country to mad Russophobia, to not being outspoken about Her support for popular policies.
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Pericles
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« Reply #3 on: March 13, 2017, 11:26:36 PM »

If she'd won she would have been said to have run a genius campaign and Trump's campaign would be said to be perhaps the worst in history. Try to think how the election would be analyzed in a world where she beat Trump(which only requires a swing of half of 1% in three states).
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Mr. Smith
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« Reply #4 on: March 14, 2017, 12:38:13 AM »

Yes.

Excellent laser-like focus on most of the swing-states.

Excellent destruction of Trump's lack of substance when actually called to do it [should've done more of that] and a fairly compelling argument on character assassination that didn't seem all that desperate (as most of those attacks usually do).

Kaine was a decent pick for trying to keep a good image.

However this,

If she'd won she would have been said to have run a genius campaign and Trump's campaign would be said to be perhaps the worst in history. Try to think how the election would be analyzed in a world where she beat Trump(which only requires a swing of half of 1% in three states).

This is going too far. If WI, MI, and PA held by narrow margins while the Sun Belt went nowhere, they'd wonder why she bothered with NC or GA at all

If FL and NC were held up, but everything else fell, including the Rust Belt, pundits would wonder why she tried to hold the Rust Belt at all.

Either case, they'd wonder why it tightened that much against Trump of all people.
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Pericles
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« Reply #5 on: March 14, 2017, 01:47:39 AM »

Strong appeal to minorities, not neglecting them
Good play for college-educated whites, seizing on Trump's weakness with traditionally Republican voters
An optimistic, well-done convention that set out a clear contrast with Trump's dark vision for America
Effectively baiting Trump into fights with sympathetic private citizens like Alicia Machado and the Khans
Apologizing after 'basket of deplorables', while it had no impact I liked that she had some humility rather than Trump always doubling down and getting stuck in the mud on weaknesses
Good debate prep and excellent debate performances
Not making the 2008 mistake of not emphasizing her gender, appealing to women voters
Picking a running mate who did no harm and locked up Virginia
Forcing Trump to spend time in red states and making states like Arizona and Georgia close
Making clear she, and not Trump, was fit to serve
Keeping Trump's favorability ratings underwater with successful attacks
Good attack ads
Outspending Trump
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Eharding
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« Reply #6 on: March 14, 2017, 06:16:03 AM »

If she'd won she would have been said to have run a genius campaign and Trump's campaign would be said to be perhaps the worst in history. Try to think how the election would be analyzed in a world where she beat Trump(which only requires a swing of half of 1% in three states).

-If different stuff happened, different stuff would have happened. It didn't. So what?

Strikethroughs are the places I strongly disagree:

Strong appeal to minorities, not neglecting them
Good play for college-educated whites, seizing on Trump's weakness with traditionally Republican voters
An optimistic, well-done convention that set out a clear contrast with Trump's dark vision for America
Effectively baiting Trump into fights with sympathetic private citizens like Alicia Machado and the Khans
Apologizing after 'basket of deplorables', while it had no impact I liked that she had some humility rather than Trump always doubling down and getting stuck in the mud on weaknesses
Good debate prep and excellent debate performances
Not making the 2008 mistake of not emphasizing her gender, appealing to women voters
Picking a running mate who did no harm and locked up Virginia
Forcing Trump to spend time in red states and making states like Arizona and Georgia close
Making clear she, and not Trump, was fit to serve
Keeping Trump's favorability ratings underwater with successful attacks
Good attack ads
Outspending Trump
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Stranger in a strange land
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« Reply #7 on: March 14, 2017, 09:38:56 AM »
« Edited: March 14, 2017, 12:06:42 PM by Stranger in a strange land »

Her strategy was terrible but she made many good tactical moves. Bringing out Khizr and Ghazala Khan at the DNC was one of the most brilliant acts of political theater I've ever seen. She also took debate prep seriously: Trump had been moving into the lead before the debates and she got a big bounce out of the first one in particular. And keep in mind that expectations for Trump were very, very low, but the debates were still seen as victories for her.
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« Reply #8 on: March 14, 2017, 11:03:39 AM »

Yes, Chelsea.
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Deblano
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« Reply #9 on: March 14, 2017, 11:27:50 AM »

Her twitter account.

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Blair
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« Reply #10 on: March 14, 2017, 12:19:44 PM »

Raising $1.2 billion was certainly an achievement.

I'd love to see the internal polling/data from inside her campaign in the last week- part of me has a feeling that they knew it was going to be tighter than they thought (I read that Priorities had a poll from Michigan that was +1 Clinton the day before the election)

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Beet
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« Reply #11 on: March 14, 2017, 12:33:12 PM »

Her strategy was terrible but she made many good tactical moves. Bringing out Khizr and Ghazala Khan at the DNC was one of the most brilliant acts of political theater I've ever seen. She also took debate prep seriously: Trump had been moving into the lead before the debates and she got a big bounce out of the first one in particular. And keep in mind that expectations for Trump were very, very low, but the debates were still seen as victories for her.

This. Trotting out Khan got her a lead for all of August.

Winning the first debate got her a lead for October.
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ahugecat
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« Reply #12 on: March 14, 2017, 12:38:22 PM »

Raising $1.2 billion was certainly an achievement.

I'd love to see the internal polling/data from inside her campaign in the last week- part of me has a feeling that they knew it was going to be tighter than they thought (I read that Priorities had a poll from Michigan that was +1 Clinton the day before the election)


Some people have said Trafalgar was Trump's internal polling. Kellyanne said they were able to pinpoint where to go to because in the polls they asked "Who do you think your neighbors are voting for?" and that's what Trafalgar asked as well. They also polled for the GOP in 2012 so there could be connections.
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Eharding
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« Reply #13 on: March 14, 2017, 03:13:19 PM »

Her Twitter account and trotting out Khan were net negatives for Her, I think.
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Married Gay Socialist
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« Reply #14 on: March 14, 2017, 03:15:49 PM »
« Edited: March 14, 2017, 03:25:12 PM by Married Gay Socialist »

Yes. Go after Trump personally to attempt to make him an unacceptable candidate. Arguably, cleverly avoid policy discussion to court moderate Republicans. I mean, look at how Texas swung.

Also, she prepped for the debates.

There were a lot of mistakes also (even at the debates), of course; in fact, a boatload of them. From claiming America was illegals' country to mad Russophobia, to not being outspoken about Her support for popular policies.

Clinton literally lost because 90% of her commercials and adds were personal attacks against Trump & had nothing to do with policy. People want real change and real policy solutions. Clinton never gave the people that. Which was why it was a huge mistake not nominating Bernie.

Statistically, the people found her personal attacks against Trump as major turn-offs. The people wanted policy, and at least Donald was giving vague policy ideas. Clinton's wishy-washy "strategy" was a major mistake. People dont care about the personality. They want POLICY, DIRECTION, & FRESH IDEAS. Clinton couldnt offer any of that. In her hunt for republicans, whom she didnt even come close to winning, she turned off her key voter groups, which are arguably FAR more important to win over than GOP voters. For Dems to win in the future they must become strong progressives willing to champion the values the largest voting group in history wants to hear- and that voting group is millennials. Millennials must be the Dems focus. Not middle-aged and elderly white Trump voters.

But lets not forget- in every election Hillary has run, the more she talks and the more exposure she gets, and the longer the election goes on, HER POLL NUMBERS DROP. She literally does her best when she does nothing.
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Harry
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« Reply #15 on: March 14, 2017, 03:23:59 PM »

She ran a good campaign. Trump ran a great one, even though it wasn't obvious at the time.

Trump added millions of first-time voters, flipped a bunch of Obama voters in the states where he needed them, and somehow kept almost all of the conservative evangelicals onboard, despite not really agreeing with them on their most important issues.

No other Republican would have done #1 and few would have done #2.
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« Reply #16 on: March 14, 2017, 03:27:18 PM »

Trump was only able to flip Dem Obama voters and win over independent because he ran under the facade of a change/populist candidate. That's what the people want. That's what they need. Change and fresh ideas. Clinton did not represent change, nor did she have a vision worth fighting for like Bernie Sanders had.
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Eharding
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« Reply #17 on: March 14, 2017, 05:34:27 PM »

She ran a good campaign. Trump ran a great one, even though it wasn't obvious at the time.

Trump added millions of first-time voters, flipped a bunch of Obama voters in the states where he needed them, and somehow kept almost all of the conservative evangelicals onboard, despite not really agreeing with them on their most important issues.

No other Republican would have done #1 and few would have done #2.

-This is a bad take. Hillary got fewer votes than Obama. Trump got a smaller percentage of the vote than Mitt Romney. They both ran bad campaigns; HRC the worse one.
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Pericles
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« Reply #18 on: March 14, 2017, 09:51:48 PM »

Her Twitter account and trotting out Khan were net negatives for Her, I think.

She got a huge bounce in the polls after the Khans and the DNC compared to Trump's meager convention bounce and for all of August she was dominant. Khan helped her.
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Pericles
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« Reply #19 on: March 14, 2017, 09:55:45 PM »

Arguably letting Trump shoot himself in the foot in August was a good move and she minimized her own exposure. Whenever she was the focus her numbers went down. OTOH she may have done better if she was on the trail more.
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ApatheticAustrian
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« Reply #20 on: March 14, 2017, 10:01:23 PM »

ofc she did and her campaign would be called a role model  (even if not she herself) if a few votes would have played out differently.

trump was riding on the zeitgeist, hillary against it...simple as that, even if she would have won.

without the zeitgeist, trump would have lost in a landslide so there are not many hot takes from this whole thing.
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Eharding
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« Reply #21 on: March 14, 2017, 10:05:39 PM »

Her Twitter account and trotting out Khan were net negatives for Her, I think.

She got a huge bounce in the polls after the Khans and the DNC compared to Trump's meager convention bounce and for all of August she was dominant. Khan helped her.

-Correlation is not causation. I think the Khan thing alienated more voters from HRC than from DJT in the long run.
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ApatheticAustrian
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« Reply #22 on: March 14, 2017, 10:07:52 PM »

Correlation is not causation. I think the Khan thing alienated more voters from HRC than from DJT in the long run.

i am usually mock-trolling you but i in this case, i honestly believe you think too much about your own emotions regarding this matter.
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Eharding
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« Reply #23 on: March 14, 2017, 10:21:17 PM »

Correlation is not causation. I think the Khan thing alienated more voters from HRC than from DJT in the long run.

i am usually mock-trolling you but i in this case, i honestly believe you think too much about your own emotions regarding this matter.

-My emotions are generally (not always) a reliable guide to the feelings of the electorate. I refuse to believe so many swing voters are c**ks. But, perhaps, I have too much faith in the American people. But faith is not a good guide to truth. If you have evidence contrary to my judgment, show me where I err.
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Pericles
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« Reply #24 on: March 14, 2017, 10:23:45 PM »

Her Twitter account and trotting out Khan were net negatives for Her, I think.

She got a huge bounce in the polls after the Khans and the DNC compared to Trump's meager convention bounce and for all of August she was dominant. Khan helped her.

-Correlation is not causation. I think the Khan thing alienated more voters from HRC than from DJT in the long run.

You aren't most voters Eharding, you're special. All the evidence shows Khan helped her and hurt Trump.
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