Congratulations, Russia.

[Beet]

Today is the 100th anniversary of the overthrow of the evil Romanov dynasty, and the beginning post-Imperial Russia. The road towards Western-style liberal democracy is by no means a straight one, but I hope Russia is able to get there one day.

[Green Line]

Congratulations?  Everything since then has been worse.

[Obama-Biden Democrat]

In 1917 the Russian Empire was a great power, with the potential to be a superpower rivaling or even surpassing the USA. In 2017, Russia now has a GDP roughly the same as Australia and it's population drinking itself to death with a first world birth rate and 3rd world death rate.

It's been a rough 100 years.

[Beet]

In 1917 the Russian Empire was a great power, with the potential to be a superpower rivaling or even surpassing the USA. In 2017, Russia now has a GDP roughly the same as Australia and it's population drinking itself to death with a first world birth rate and 3rd world death rate.

It's been a rough 100 years.

In 1917 it was the weakest of several European powers, have being most recently beaten by Japan. It was a backwards agrarian economy where most people's lives had hardly advanced from the Middle Ages. Today it's the world's second most powerful country, with a growing population and the 6th highest GDP in the world. To be sure, it could have done better had it switched immediately to liberal, Western democracy, but it was going down the drain under the Czars.

[The Mikado]

In 1917 the Russian Empire was a great power, with the potential to be a superpower rivaling or even surpassing the USA. In 2017, Russia now has a GDP roughly the same as Australia and it's population drinking itself to death with a first world birth rate and 3rd world death rate.

It's been a rough 100 years.

In 1917 it was the weakest of several European powers, have being most recently beaten by Japan. It was a backwards agrarian economy where most people's lives had hardly advanced from the Middle Ages. Today it's the world's second most powerful country, with a growing population and the 6th highest GDP in the world. To be sure, it could have done better had it switched immediately to liberal, Western democracy, but it was going down the drain under the Czars.

Um...You are acting like they didn't lose 23% of their territory, over half of their population, and over half of their GDP 25 years ago and are struggling to try to crawl their way back to where they were 30 years ago while the rest of the world has moved on.

[Lumine]

Incompetent as the Romanov dynasty was under Nicholas II, most of the alternatives (even some of the worst White Russian Generals) were miles better than seven decades of totalitarian communist government.

So many lost opportunities, so much pain Russia could have been spared from...

[Tintrlvr]

Congratulations?  Everything since then has been worse.

Agreed. There were even glimmers of democracy in the waning days of Imperial Russia. Russia would most likely look like one of the generic parliamentary monarchies of Europe today if the Revolution had never happened. We might have even been spared WWII (or at least the European theater) and the Nazis since fear of communism would not have been high enough to propel fascists to power without the existence of an actual communist state.

[Beet]

In 1917 the Russian Empire was a great power, with the potential to be a superpower rivaling or even surpassing the USA. In 2017, Russia now has a GDP roughly the same as Australia and it's population drinking itself to death with a first world birth rate and 3rd world death rate.

It's been a rough 100 years.

In 1917 it was the weakest of several European powers, have being most recently beaten by Japan. It was a backwards agrarian economy where most people's lives had hardly advanced from the Middle Ages. Today it's the world's second most powerful country, with a growing population and the 6th highest GDP in the world. To be sure, it could have done better had it switched immediately to liberal, Western democracy, but it was going down the drain under the Czars.

Um...You are acting like they didn't lose 23% of their territory, over half of their population, and over half of their GDP 25 years ago and are struggling to try to crawl their way back to where they were 30 years ago while the rest of the world has moved on.

That has nothing to do with the February revolution. We are talking about the February revolution, not the October revolution. And even after all those losses, Russia is still more powerful today than it was in 1917, relatively or absolutely.

Edit: Everyone is acting like this thread is talking about the October revolution. That is false. I've said many times Western style liberal democracy would be the best form of government.

[Tintrlvr]

In 1917 the Russian Empire was a great power, with the potential to be a superpower rivaling or even surpassing the USA. In 2017, Russia now has a GDP roughly the same as Australia and it's population drinking itself to death with a first world birth rate and 3rd world death rate.

It's been a rough 100 years.

In 1917 it was the weakest of several European powers, have being most recently beaten by Japan. It was a backwards agrarian economy where most people's lives had hardly advanced from the Middle Ages. Today it's the world's second most powerful country, with a growing population and the 6th highest GDP in the world. To be sure, it could have done better had it switched immediately to liberal, Western democracy, but it was going down the drain under the Czars.

Um...You are acting like they didn't lose 23% of their territory, over half of their population, and over half of their GDP 25 years ago and are struggling to try to crawl their way back to where they were 30 years ago while the rest of the world has moved on.

That has nothing to do with the February revolution. We are talking about the February revolution, not the October revolution. And even after all those losses, Russia is still more powerful today than it was in 1917, relatively or absolutely.

Edit: Everyone is acting like this thread is talking about the October revolution. That is false. I've said many times Western style liberal democracy would be the best form of government.

One led more or less inevitably to the other, unfortunately.

[Beet]

Not really. If the Kerensky government had negotiated peace with Germany, it could have survived. The Russians were sick of WW1, that is why it happened. Let's not forget it was the Czar who started and bungled the war in the first place. Without the Czar, we would have been spared both WWI and WWII and communism!

[FEMA Camp Administrator]

I find it self-congratulatory to assume that Russia would look like a generic European power in today's world had democracy just managed to survive. Such ignores the sheer immensity of issues anyone would have faced in managing and then modernizing the country before, during, and after the war.

[The Mikado]

Not really. If the Kerensky government had negotiated peace with Germany, it could have survived. The Russians were sick of WW1, that is why it happened. Let's not forget it was the Czar who started and bungled the war in the first place. Without the Czar, we would have been spared both WWI and WWII and communism!

Like it was at all possible for a government that was heavily in debt to the Entente to peacefully break out of the war and not become a hated pariah. It's more likely that the British and French would've subsidized Kornilov couping the state to turn it into a military dictatorship to keep it in the war than that they'd have allowed it to peacefully leave the war.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

Congratulations?  Everything since then has been worse.

Agreed. There were even glimmers of democracy in the waning days of Imperial Russia. Russia would most likely look like one of the generic parliamentary monarchies of Europe today if the Revolution had never happened. We might have even been spared WWII (or at least the European theater) and the Nazis since fear of communism would not have been high enough to propel fascists to power without the existence of an actual communist state.

It wasn't what propelled Mussolini to power, but local socialists who would have been active no matter what in postwar Italy. For better or worse, it took a second world war to curb the attraction (at least in Europe) of violent leftist and rightist groups that enabled them to successfully take power from a democratic regime.

[Pericles]

Congratulations?  Everything since then has been worse.

[Obama-Biden Democrat]

In 1917 the Russian Empire was a great power, with the potential to be a superpower rivaling or even surpassing the USA. In 2017, Russia now has a GDP roughly the same as Australia and it's population drinking itself to death with a first world birth rate and 3rd world death rate.

It's been a rough 100 years.

In 1917 it was the weakest of several European powers, have being most recently beaten by Japan. It was a backwards agrarian economy where most people's lives had hardly advanced from the Middle Ages. Today it's the world's second most powerful country, with a growing population and the 6th highest GDP in the world. To be sure, it could have done better had it switched immediately to liberal, Western democracy, but it was going down the drain under the Czars.

Yes it is true that vis a vis the West, Russia was backward in 1917, is backward now and was backwards for centuries before. In the late 19th and early 20th centuries, Russia was experiencing lightning fast GDP growth, industrialization and new infrastructure and railroads. For example, the German general staff had agreed that Russia's lightning fast industrialization and new railroads would make their mobilization too fast for Germany to handle in a two front war. They agreed that after 1917, there could be no war with Russia. Russia/USSR has been absolutely devastated by WW1, The Russian Civil War , the Holdomor, Great Purges, and then WW2. To say these wars and tragedies were cataclysmic for the Russian/Soviet demography is an understatement.

Look at the US v Russia population comparisons for 1913 and today :

1913
Russia 170.1 million
USA 97,225,000

2013
Russia 143.5 million
USA 316.5

Russia had nearly a 2 to 1 advantage in population over the US in 1913, although Russia was backwards compared to the US, the population advantage over the US long term could mean Russia could have been the world Superpower, not the USA.  Russia would certainly have needed able leadership to pull it off, but it was doable. Now the US has over a 2 to 1 edge in population and a gigantic edge in GDP. The collapse of the USSR was a big shock to the population which has caused lower birth rates and higher death rates.