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Author Topic: 2017 French Presidential Election  (Read 5551 times)
Devout Centrist
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E: 0.80, S: -8.78

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« Reply #100 on: March 20, 2017, 11:08:09 pm »
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For the left Melenchon is basically a destructive troll and for the same left his Presidency would be even more disastrous than Hollande's to PS. I'd certainly take him over Le Pen or Fillon, but I'm not sure I wouldn't pick Macron instead if the choice boiled down to the two.

Mélenchon is a terrible person, but at least his program isn't a bunch of vague yet distinctly harmful neoliberal platitudes. He'd definitely do less harm in terms of policy, at least.
"Whatabouter" spotted
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The SJW Capitalist
Weirdo

You're not an independent, you're just a confused Democrat.

The thing is neither left-wing economic policy, nor socialism has failed in history.
Tirnam
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E: -3.23, S: -5.22

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« Reply #101 on: March 21, 2017, 01:53:38 am »
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Poll, OpinionWay for Le Point

Who convinced you the most?
Macron: 24%
Le Pen: 19%
Fillon: 19%
Mélenchon: 15%
Hamon: 10%

Do you have a better or worse opinion of the candidate?
Macron: better 29%, same 52, worse 19%
Mélenchon: better 27%, same 59%, worse: 14%
Hamon: better 18%, same 58%, worse: 24%
Le Pen: better 18, same 56%, worse 27%
Fillon: better 14%, same 55%, worse 30%

Honnest: Mélenchon 69%, Hamon 62%, Macron 59%, Le Pen 34%, Fillon 24%
Presidential: Macron 62%, Fillon 49%, Le Pen 38%, Mélenchon 35%, Hamon 33%
Authority: Mélenchon 67%, Le Pen 65%, Macron 63%, Fillon 59%, Hamon 32%
Credible: Macron 59%, Mélenchon 44%, Fillon 38%, Hamon 37%, Le Pen 36%
Understands the concerns of the French: Mélenchon 65%, Macron 56%, Le Pen 54%, Hamon 52%, Fillon 35%
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ModStasi
Kalwejt
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« Reply #102 on: March 21, 2017, 02:11:41 am »
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SFIO eventually transformed into the PS after Defferre's disastrous defeat in 1969. What should PS transform into now?
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modern maverick
Nathan
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« Reply #103 on: March 21, 2017, 02:15:43 am »
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For the left Melenchon is basically a destructive troll and for the same left his Presidency would be even more disastrous than Hollande's to PS. I'd certainly take him over Le Pen or Fillon, but I'm not sure I wouldn't pick Macron instead if the choice boiled down to the two.

Mélenchon is a terrible person, but at least his program isn't a bunch of vague yet distinctly harmful neoliberal platitudes. He'd definitely do less harm in terms of policy, at least.
"Whatabouter" spotted

Huh "This candidate is a worse person than that candidate but has less harmful policies" isn't whataboutery, it's a normal political calculation.
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Professor Nathan. A shameless agrarian collectivist with no respect for private property or individual rights. Can you really trust him?

Yeah that's right, I said Siam. Why don't you go tell Pedro Martinez
AMA IL TUO PRESIDENTE!
Antonio V
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« Reply #104 on: March 21, 2017, 02:21:46 am »
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SFIO eventually transformed into the PS after Defferre's disastrous defeat in 1969. What should PS transform into now?

En Marche! - Left-wing Tendency
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Our numbers are dwindling. Our words are confused.
Some of them have been twisted by the enemy
until they can no longer be recognized.

Now what is wrong, or false, in what we have said?
Just some parts, or everything?
On whom can we still rely? Are we survivors, cast
away by the current? Will we be left behind,
no longer understanding anyone and being understood by no one?
Must we rely on luck?

This is what you ask. Expect
no answer but your own.


Bertolt Brecht
AMA IL TUO PRESIDENTE!
Antonio V
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« Reply #105 on: March 21, 2017, 05:08:59 am »
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RIP Henri Emmannuelli. I guess it's appropriate for a historic leader of the PS left to pass away today...
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Our numbers are dwindling. Our words are confused.
Some of them have been twisted by the enemy
until they can no longer be recognized.

Now what is wrong, or false, in what we have said?
Just some parts, or everything?
On whom can we still rely? Are we survivors, cast
away by the current? Will we be left behind,
no longer understanding anyone and being understood by no one?
Must we rely on luck?

This is what you ask. Expect
no answer but your own.


Bertolt Brecht
Swedish Austerity Cheese
JOHN91043353
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« Reply #106 on: March 21, 2017, 05:41:43 am »
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For the left Melenchon is basically a destructive troll and for the same left his Presidency would be even more disastrous than Hollande's to PS. I'd certainly take him over Le Pen or Fillon, but I'm not sure I wouldn't pick Macron instead if the choice boiled down to the two.

Mélenchon is a terrible person, but at least his program isn't a bunch of vague yet distinctly harmful neoliberal platitudes. He'd definitely do less harm in terms of policy, at least.
"Whatabouter" spotted

Huh "This candidate is a worse person than that candidate but has less harmful policies" isn't whataboutery, it's a normal political calculation.

Yeah, Antonio has clearly stated he'll vote for Macron in the run-off when if Macron faces off against Le Pen so he can hardly be compared to someone who voted Jill Stein or stayed home in a swing state.

Don't get me wrong. I think Antonio is delusional for preferring Mélenchon over Macron, but that's because I think Socialism in general is delusional. Tongue
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Quote from: Badger
Quote from: Swedish Cheese
London of course. Smiley

Shocked

4 realz SWEDISH Cheese? Huh

He's not from Sweden, he's from Scania.
 

RogueBeaver
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« Reply #107 on: March 21, 2017, 09:20:45 am »
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Tomorrow's Canard: neo-Nazi secretly on FN payroll.
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7.35, 3.65

« Les plus nobles principes du monde ne valent que par l’action.  » - Charles de Gaulle



"Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard." - H.L. Mencken
MAINEiac4434
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« Reply #108 on: March 21, 2017, 09:33:05 am »
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Well there's a not so secret one on the payroll too:

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"A Conservative is a man with two perfectly good legs who, however, has never learned to walk forward." Franklin Delano Roosevelt

"Ultimately, America's answer to the intolerant man is diversity, the very diversity which our heritage of religious freedom has inspired." Robert Francis Kennedy



Bumaye
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« Reply #109 on: March 21, 2017, 09:55:09 am »
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Neo-Nazis and the Front National?  
  
Non? Si! Ohh!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r3FEhHF_fzM&feature=youtu.be&t=2s  
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RogueBeaver
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« Reply #110 on: March 21, 2017, 10:06:22 am »
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More importantly in tomorrow's Canard, Fillon and Putin.
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7.35, 3.65

« Les plus nobles principes du monde ne valent que par l’action.  » - Charles de Gaulle



"Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard." - H.L. Mencken
ApatheticAustrian
ApathicAustrian
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« Reply #111 on: March 21, 2017, 10:09:37 am »
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freedom magazine once again.

since they kind of single-handedly destroyed fillon...do we know/guess who loaded that pistol?
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RogueBeaver
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« Reply #112 on: March 21, 2017, 12:12:32 pm »
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Fillon got paid 50k to arrange a meeting between a Lebanese millionaire and Putin.
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7.35, 3.65

« Les plus nobles principes du monde ne valent que par l’action.  » - Charles de Gaulle



"Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard." - H.L. Mencken
Tirnam
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« Reply #113 on: March 21, 2017, 12:16:29 pm »
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Tracking polls

Opinionway (pre-debate)
Le Pen: 27% (=)
Macron: 24% (+1)
Fillon: 18% (=)
Hamon: 14% (+1)
Mélenchon: 11% (-1)

Second round: Macron 61% (+1), Le Pen 39%

Ifop (1/3 post-debate)
Le Pen: 26% (=)
Macron: 25.5% (+0.5)
Fillon: 17.5% (-0.5)
Hamon: 11.5% (-1)
Mélenchon: 11.5% (=)

Second round: Macron 60.5% (+0.5), Le Pen 39.5%
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parochial boy
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« Reply #114 on: March 21, 2017, 01:04:51 pm »
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Salauds de Journalopes Cheesy
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Tirnam
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« Reply #115 on: March 21, 2017, 01:15:58 pm »
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Fillon scandal: the judicial enquiry extended to aggravated scam and forgery and use of forgery
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Chairman (with limited role) of the 2020 Trump campaign
Old Europe
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« Reply #116 on: March 21, 2017, 02:11:06 pm »
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Oh boy. I hope Fillon manages to come in fifth in the end. Cheesy
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MAINEiac4434
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« Reply #117 on: March 21, 2017, 02:14:14 pm »
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Jesus Christ
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"A Conservative is a man with two perfectly good legs who, however, has never learned to walk forward." Franklin Delano Roosevelt

"Ultimately, America's answer to the intolerant man is diversity, the very diversity which our heritage of religious freedom has inspired." Robert Francis Kennedy



RogueBeaver
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« Reply #118 on: March 21, 2017, 02:16:02 pm »
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Misread the headline: Lebanese billionaire paid Fillon to arrange a meeting between a French oil CEO (who happened to be Fillon's 90s COS) & Putin.
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7.35, 3.65

« Les plus nobles principes du monde ne valent que par l’action.  » - Charles de Gaulle



"Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard." - H.L. Mencken
MAINEiac4434
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« Reply #119 on: March 21, 2017, 02:22:50 pm »
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At this point I feel like we're a week away from a headline reading "Fillon pimped out daughter for $20 and a McDonald's gift card"
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"A Conservative is a man with two perfectly good legs who, however, has never learned to walk forward." Franklin Delano Roosevelt

"Ultimately, America's answer to the intolerant man is diversity, the very diversity which our heritage of religious freedom has inspired." Robert Francis Kennedy



Tirnam
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E: -3.23, S: -5.22

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« Reply #120 on: March 21, 2017, 04:06:38 pm »
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First post-debate poll
Elabe for BFM TV

Macron: 26% (+0.5)
Le Pen: 24.5% (-0.5)
Fillon: 17% (-0.5)
Mélenchon: 13.5% (+0.5)
Hamon: 11.5% (-2)

Second round: Macron 64%, Le Pen 36%
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Rogier
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« Reply #121 on: March 21, 2017, 04:10:02 pm »
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A Socialist Minister Bruno Le Roux has been caught up in a similar scandal involving his 15 year old offspring claiming money for work. Some great quotes from Jean-Christophe Cambadelis, who said he shouldn't resign because "he is not running for President, and François Fillon's campaign spokesman, who said he should resign.

The above is exactly why I think some frenchmen are going for Macron as an anti-systeme candidate. Even if he is a hybrid of the above, his victory ensures a return to De Gaulle vision of a President above the parties. Him and Le Pen qualifying will split the PS for obvious reasons and LR (I think the ni-ni policy towards FN in the legislatives will split them, if not a Macron presidency).
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Cassius
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« Reply #122 on: March 21, 2017, 04:35:11 pm »
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Misread the headline: Lebanese billionaire paid Fillon to arrange a meeting between a French oil CEO (who happened to be Fillon's 90s COS) & Putin.

I mean, this took place when Fillon was out of office, so...
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'The greatest thing that could happen to the state and the nation is when we get rid of all the media... then we could all live in peace and tranquillity and no one would know anything'

Çråbçæk
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« Reply #123 on: March 21, 2017, 04:36:58 pm »
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I misread that as "arrange a marriage".
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Castro
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« Reply #124 on: March 21, 2017, 05:36:14 pm »
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I misread that as "arrange a marriage".

At this rate, that will be the next Fillon scandal.
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