100+ civilians killed by American bombing.

[Atlas Has Shrugged]

https://apple.news/Af0eaxg5jQyi6ioYMjVW4Cg

I wish Trump's non-interventionist policy meant something along the lines of Pat Buchanan/Ron Paul, not this bipolar delusional emulation of "Reagan toughness." Christ, this was exactly what I've been afraid of since Obama and Trump have dragged us back in.

This type of stuff has serious blowback. It won't be forgotten.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

It is tragic, but the alternative unfortunately is to let Daesh remain in charge of Mosul.  As Sherman put it over a century ago in his letter to the mayor of Atlanta, "War is cruelty and you cannot refine it; and those who brought war into our country deserve all the curses and maledictions a people can pour out. [...]

But, my dear sirs, when peace does come, you may call on me for any thing. Then will I share with you the last cracker, and watch with you to shield your homes and families against danger from every quarter."

The problems that will blow back on us is not from this, but if we fail to provide adequately for the provision and safety of the civilians after the battle is over.  Sadly the current Iraqi government probably has not learned that lesson.

[Green Line]

The people of Iraq want us

[Middle-aged Europe]

It is tragic, but the alternative unfortunately is to let Daesh remain in charge of Mosul.  As Sherman put it over a century ago in his letter to the mayor of Atlanta, "War is cruelty and you cannot refine it; and those who brought war into our country deserve all the curses and maledictions a people can pour out. [...]

But, my dear sirs, when peace does come, you may call on me for any thing. Then will I share with you the last cracker, and watch with you to shield your homes and families against danger from every quarter."

The problems that will blow back on us is not from this, but if we fail to provide adequately for the provision and safety of the civilians after the battle is over.  Sadly the current Iraqi government probably has not learned that lesson.

Sherman was fighting a different kind of war. Nowadays, the more civilians you kill the more survivors could turn extremist and join the enemy.

Incidentally, I saw a news report a couple of days ago noting that the number of civilian casualties resulting from U.S. military action in Syria/Iraq seemed to have increased ever since Trump took over. The implication was that the rules of engagement have been loosened in a way that the prevention of "collateral damage" is now of lower priority for U.S. forces.

[ApatheticAustrian]

well, you can't say he lied re: his foreign policy approach...he kind of bragged about being "tough".

[Bismarck]

If loosening the restrictions of the bombing would defeat ISIS quicker and ultimately make the fighting end sooner this could be justifiable (like Hiroshima for example) but in the case of the Middle East there seems to be no reason to expect that that is the case and thus this sad loss of life is probably unnecessary.

[TheDeadFlagBlues]

What makes the refusal to vote for Hillary Clinton even worse, is that the people who refuse to vote for her can't comprehend the idea that, yes, this country and, more broadly, the world could easily become a toxic heap of radioactive sludge that would be deadly to all, regardless of one's skin color or one's religious preference or one's sexual orientation. Ultimately, our continued existence as a species is what is at stake in this election: we have a candidate who is mentally unstable and one who is not. We have one who believes that climate change is a hoax and one who acknowledges that is real. We have a candidate who believes that the Geneva Convention's binding rules of war ought to be shredded and we have a candidate who pledges to respect the Geneva Convention. I could go on and on and on like this but you get my point: we are standing on a precipice right now. There's a clear choice between someone who embodies evil in every possible way and someone who is totally palatable. Make the right choice and feel proud about this. Own your decision to vote for Hillary Clinton and feel proud about it: you are doing your part to save the world and you will be pumping the breaks on the doomsday train.

I don't think I'm exaggerating about this: over the past few years, the world has become increasingly dangerous, increasingly intolerant, increasingly militaristic and increasingly Evil. No more. I'm not willing to put up with this anymore and my vote for Clinton has symbolic value as a vote against the monsters who thrive on bigotry and hatred and Know-Nothingism and militarism and racism and ignorance. Make it stop: vote for Clinton.

A vote for Clinton has symbolic value against militarism?  Good grief.

Welp, you can't say that I didn't try to warn the forum that this was one of the biggest Trump risks.

[Associate Justice PiT]

What makes the refusal to vote for Hillary Clinton even worse, is that the people who refuse to vote for her can't comprehend the idea that, yes, this country and, more broadly, the world could easily become a toxic heap of radioactive sludge that would be deadly to all, regardless of one's skin color or one's religious preference or one's sexual orientation. Ultimately, our continued existence as a species is what is at stake in this election: we have a candidate who is mentally unstable and one who is not. We have one who believes that climate change is a hoax and one who acknowledges that is real. We have a candidate who believes that the Geneva Convention's binding rules of war ought to be shredded and we have a candidate who pledges to respect the Geneva Convention. I could go on and on and on like this but you get my point: we are standing on a precipice right now. There's a clear choice between someone who embodies evil in every possible way and someone who is totally palatable. Make the right choice and feel proud about this. Own your decision to vote for Hillary Clinton and feel proud about it: you are doing your part to save the world and you will be pumping the breaks on the doomsday train.

I don't think I'm exaggerating about this: over the past few years, the world has become increasingly dangerous, increasingly intolerant, increasingly militaristic and increasingly Evil. No more. I'm not willing to put up with this anymore and my vote for Clinton has symbolic value as a vote against the monsters who thrive on bigotry and hatred and Know-Nothingism and militarism and racism and ignorance. Make it stop: vote for Clinton.

A vote for Clinton has symbolic value against militarism?  Good grief.

Welp, you can't say that I didn't try to warn the forum that this was one of the biggest Trump risks.

     You really don't have ground to gloat here. Clinton was a militarist candidate who enabled intervention in Libya and pushed for the same in Syria. That Trump is also a militarist is regrettable, but it's not like we had a serious alternative on this matter, your own melodramatic hyperbole aside.

[Green Line]

There will never be a conflict without collateral damage, never has been.  Maybe that means we should try and not have conflict all together.  Someone should tell ISIS that.

[KingSweden]

If loosening the restrictions of the bombing would defeat ISIS quicker and ultimately make the fighting end sooner this could be justifiable (like Hiroshima for example) but in the case of the Middle East there seems to be no reason to expect that that is the case and thus this sad loss of life is probably unnecessary.

This is pretty close to my own thoughts on the matter

[TheDeadFlagBlues]

What makes the refusal to vote for Hillary Clinton even worse, is that the people who refuse to vote for her can't comprehend the idea that, yes, this country and, more broadly, the world could easily become a toxic heap of radioactive sludge that would be deadly to all, regardless of one's skin color or one's religious preference or one's sexual orientation. Ultimately, our continued existence as a species is what is at stake in this election: we have a candidate who is mentally unstable and one who is not. We have one who believes that climate change is a hoax and one who acknowledges that is real. We have a candidate who believes that the Geneva Convention's binding rules of war ought to be shredded and we have a candidate who pledges to respect the Geneva Convention. I could go on and on and on like this but you get my point: we are standing on a precipice right now. There's a clear choice between someone who embodies evil in every possible way and someone who is totally palatable. Make the right choice and feel proud about this. Own your decision to vote for Hillary Clinton and feel proud about it: you are doing your part to save the world and you will be pumping the breaks on the doomsday train.

I don't think I'm exaggerating about this: over the past few years, the world has become increasingly dangerous, increasingly intolerant, increasingly militaristic and increasingly Evil. No more. I'm not willing to put up with this anymore and my vote for Clinton has symbolic value as a vote against the monsters who thrive on bigotry and hatred and Know-Nothingism and militarism and racism and ignorance. Make it stop: vote for Clinton.

A vote for Clinton has symbolic value against militarism?  Good grief.

Welp, you can't say that I didn't try to warn the forum that this was one of the biggest Trump risks.

     You really don't have ground to gloat here. Clinton was a militarist candidate who enabled intervention in Libya and pushed for the same in Syria. That Trump is also a militarist is regrettable, but it's not like we had a serious alternative on this matter, your own melodramatic hyperbole aside.

"it's not like we had a serious alternative on this matter"

[Atlas Has Shrugged]

What makes the refusal to vote for Hillary Clinton even worse, is that the people who refuse to vote for her can't comprehend the idea that, yes, this country and, more broadly, the world could easily become a toxic heap of radioactive sludge that would be deadly to all, regardless of one's skin color or one's religious preference or one's sexual orientation. Ultimately, our continued existence as a species is what is at stake in this election: we have a candidate who is mentally unstable and one who is not. We have one who believes that climate change is a hoax and one who acknowledges that is real. We have a candidate who believes that the Geneva Convention's binding rules of war ought to be shredded and we have a candidate who pledges to respect the Geneva Convention. I could go on and on and on like this but you get my point: we are standing on a precipice right now. There's a clear choice between someone who embodies evil in every possible way and someone who is totally palatable. Make the right choice and feel proud about this. Own your decision to vote for Hillary Clinton and feel proud about it: you are doing your part to save the world and you will be pumping the breaks on the doomsday train.

I don't think I'm exaggerating about this: over the past few years, the world has become increasingly dangerous, increasingly intolerant, increasingly militaristic and increasingly Evil. No more. I'm not willing to put up with this anymore and my vote for Clinton has symbolic value as a vote against the monsters who thrive on bigotry and hatred and Know-Nothingism and militarism and racism and ignorance. Make it stop: vote for Clinton.

A vote for Clinton has symbolic value against militarism?  Good grief.

Welp, you can't say that I didn't try to warn the forum that this was one of the biggest Trump risks.

     You really don't have ground to gloat here. Clinton was a militarist candidate who enabled intervention in Libya and pushed for the same in Syria. That Trump is also a militarist is regrettable, but it's not like we had a serious alternative on this matter, your own melodramatic hyperbole aside.

"it's not like we had a serious alternative on this matter"

Militarist crook with terrible domestic agenda? Or BIGLY businessman with reasonable sounding foreign policy and decent domestic policy? I won't speak for PiT, but we all know who the actual serious alternative was.