Kentucky Governor’s Crime Plan: Volunteer ‘Prayer Patrols’ Roaming The Streets

[JA]

Kentucky Governor’s Crime Plan: Volunteer ‘Prayer Patrols’ Roaming The Streets

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[Confused Democrat]

They should stop by the hospitals and pray people's sickness away. 

[JA]

They should stop by the hospitals and pray people's sickness away.  

Don't forget to pray away climate change and "the gay."

[Middle-aged Europe]

Probably also helps against climate change.

[JA]

It's rather easy to focus on the sheer stupidity of these remarks, but hidden in plain sight is the more vile motivation behind them. The Governor is intentionally abdicating any responsibility for changing institutional causes of crime, such as poverty, lack of access to a good education, lack of adequate employment opportunities, limited upward mobility, segregation, racism, and mass incarceration. He knows that crime cannot be prevented by simply praying it away, nor would he make such a recommendation if Kentucky's wealthy communities were being victimized by rampant crime. But, since this is a problem primarily for the poor and/or minorities and it would require dramatic structural changes to actually address the issue of crime, the governor chooses to forego any responsible policymaking in favor of "prayer patrols."

[SoLongAtlas]

"Shame, shame, shame ding ding ding. But let me offer you a prayer!" Honestly, Bevin has become one the religious nuts off of GoT.

[KingSweden]

"Shame, shame, shame ding ding ding. But let me offer you a prayer!" Honestly, Bevin has become one the religious nuts off of GoT.

I'm still pissed they didn't walk of shame Natalie Dormer. You had one job, Jon Pryce!

[pbrower2a]

Maybe they can pray poverty away.

I tested the power of prayer one day. I had been harassed on the Web by someone claiming to be a devout Christian libeling me as a homosexual child molester after my mother died of Parkinsonism. That was one harsh juxtaposition. I wanted my father to get involved again in a world in which he had participated little because his wife came first... I got him to attend church. There was a session in which the pastor dealt in  personal concerns (typical marital problems, finances, and personal health). I recognized that the youth pastor was not busy at the time, so I took my concern to him.

The youth pastor and I decided that the libel of me as a criminal (homosexuality was not the problem, and it isn't the problem -- but child molestation of any kind is an abominable crime for what it does to the trust that children need in adults if they are to become competent adults) was a concern appropriate for prayer.  We agreed that it would be appropriate to pray for my tormenter and then put what we did on the web.

I figured that one of my heroes, Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr., did not curse his enemies and opponents or stick needles in voodoo dolls depicting people angry at him for contesting white supremacy or people tied to a corrupt racist order. He was a religious man, and I am guessing that he prayed for his enemies so that they would be delivered from their hatred.

We prayed for him, for deliverance of him from his bigotry, anger, and injustice and to give him wisdom. On Sunday afternoon I posted what I had done.

He retorted

(Homophobic smear), You prayed for me? What a hypocrite! Youth minister? Likely story!


Yes, I know this type all too well. He's the person who accuses Jews of being the greediest and most materialistic people around, and then you find that they get into trouble due to their greed and materialism. (By the way -- Jews are not particularly greedy and materialistic; the successful ones are simply good at what they do and are wildly successful). He's the sort who claims that black men want more than anything else to contaminate white womanhood with biracial children yet has committed serial adultery and has inflicted women with children out of wedlock. He is the sort who excoriates homosexuality yet has strong homosexual tendencies. He has a complete collection of Playboy magazines yet crusades against pornography. He's the Nazi with a Jewish grandfather or a black great-grandmother.  

So maybe there  is something wrong with him beyond hypocrisy -- but I do not do libel, which includes reckless assertions of defamatory falsehood. He got removed from the forum, but the damage to my self-image was real.

To make a long story short, the power of prayer to change the lives of unreceptive people is vastly overrated. Crime is a usual result of sociopathic behavior, and not of economic distress.

[JA]

Crime is a usual result of sociopathic behavior, and not of economic distress.

Crime is not solely the result of sociopathic behavior. Property crime may or may not be related to it, but it could also be the result of desperation, youthful misbehavior, and so on. Violent crime is certainly more likely to be associated with sociopathic behavior. However, from where does this sociopathy originate? In about half of cases, sociopathy stems from genetics; in the other half, it is caused by environmental conditions.

What environmental conditions might those be? Alcoholism, domestic abuse, parental abuse and neglect, being raised in a dangerous neighborhood, and exposure to other social ills. All of those environmental causes of sociopathology have a strong correlation with poverty. While we cannot eliminate the genetic component (due to the limitations of modern science), we can make considerable progress eliminating the environmental components by reducing poverty and ensuring greater protections for children. Thus, to dramatically reduce crime, we need to cut off a major part of its source: economic distress.

[Santander]

What a terrific idea. God bless Governor Bevin.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

This is extremely dangerous. It's legitimizing religious police, like Iran, Israel, or Saudi Arabia. And in such a way as to allow them to wield the force of the state, without being subject to the checks and balances that keep government in line.

[pbrower2a]

Crime is a usual result of sociopathic behavior, and not of economic distress.

Crime is not solely the result of sociopathic behavior. Property crime may or may not be related to it, but it could also be the result of desperation, youthful misbehavior, and so on. Violent crime is certainly more likely to be associated with sociopathic behavior. However, from where does this sociopathy originate? In about half of cases, sociopathy stems from genetics; in the other half, it is caused by environmental conditions.

Someone who steals food to feed the family when other means of feeding the family are no longer available is a hero and not a criminal.   For good reason, merchants prefer food stamps to shoplifters; they can make money off food stamp purchases, but shoplifting is a pure loss. Without question we need a more humane economy than what we now have if we are to have legitimate pride in our decency as a people.

Of course I could name many sociopaths for whom economic distress was not at all a factor in their criminal deeds. Let us remember what Barack Obama learned as a community organizer: there are plenty of good people even in the most depressed of communities.

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People also react to those ills. Donald Trump reacted to his brother's death from alcohol abuse by becoming a tee-totaler, which is about the only virtue that I can see in him.  But given a choice, I would rather have two law-abiding parents who struggle along on humiliating jobs that pay little than grow up in a home that also serves as a meth lab in which it is but a matter of time before the Big Blue Meanies (the police) disrupt life and take Mommy and Daddy off to the clink. Child abuse of any kind betrays the trust that children need in the adult world. But poverty in a culture that values only economic success is itself abuse, especially of children.

This country needs another Martin Luther King, someone who can call us to account for electing politicians like Donald Trump, Scott Walker, Pat Toomey, and others who believe that no human suffering is in excess so long as it rewards, indulges, or enforces class privilege.         

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

Lots of nonsense in this thread.  If you are worried about church-state separation that's fine, but seriously you shouldn't even have to believe in the supernatural to see why going around and praying with people could have a positive effect on a community.

[FEMA Camp Administrator]

Very good.

[Zioneer]

I live in a state literally founded by a church and we don't do this. Bevin is just covering up for his own incompetence.

[FEMA Camp Administrator]

We live in an age of mass incarceration, growing racial tensions, and serious questions of justice. One Givernor is actually trying to introduce needed reforms to our law enforcement system, and you people deride it as weak or incompetent simply because he is a Republican. Let's not forget that the prison-industrial complex was a Clinton project.

[JA]

We live in an age of mass incarceration, growing racial tensions, and serious questions of justice. One Givernor is actually trying to introduce needed reforms to our law enforcement system, and you people deride it as weak or incompetent simply because he is a Republican. Let's not forget that the prison-industrial complex was a Clinton project.

If a Democrat said something equally stupid they'd deserve the same reaction. Sending out 'Prayer Patrols' is not a serious response to crime; it is a deflection of responsibility to his state's citizens by pretending he is doing something while, in reality, doing absolutely nothing. Crime primarily stems from institutional problems - as do nearly all socioeconomic failures. To prevent or reduce crime, it is necessary to reform institutions and policies. You cannot pray away crime, just as you cannot pray away disease, homosexuality, or anything else.

At the same time, the standard law-and-order schtick has done absolutely nothing constructive either and, despite rhetoric to the contrary, Democrats (especially Clinton and Obama) have been just as guilty of perpetuating and exacerbating America's prison-industrial complex and mass incarceration. Punishment is neither a cure nor a deterrent to crime because crime is not a morality issue.

[FEMA Camp Administrator]

We live in an age of mass incarceration, growing racial tensions, and serious questions of justice. One Givernor is actually trying to introduce needed reforms to our law enforcement system, and you people deride it as weak or incompetent simply because he is a Republican. Let's not forget that the prison-industrial complex was a Clinton project.

If a Democrat said something equally stupid they'd deserve the same reaction. Sending out 'Prayer Patrols' is not a serious response to crime; it is a deflection of responsibility to his state's citizens by pretending he is doing something while, in reality, doing absolutely nothing. Crime primarily stems from institutional problems - as do nearly all socioeconomic failures. To prevent or reduce crime, it is necessary to reform institutions and policies. You cannot pray away crime, just as you cannot pray away disease, homosexuality, or anything else.

At the same time, the standard law-and-order schtick has done absolutely nothing constructive either and, despite rhetoric to the contrary, Democrats (especially Clinton and Obama) have been just as guilty of perpetuating and exacerbating America's prison-industrial complex and mass incarceration. Punishment is neither a cure nor a deterrent to crime because crime is not a morality issue.

As a Marxist, I am fully aware of the institutional potential to cause crime. One aspect of this is, of course, the tension-riddled relationship between law enforcement and the, shall we say, urban community. This creates a distrusted image of our men and women in uniform and delegitimizes law in the eyes of many an urban youth. This is why I am overjoyed to see Governor Bevin transforming to a potentially far more effective, community-based form of policing, hopefully replacing the lock-'em-up mentality of the past.

[JA]

We live in an age of mass incarceration, growing racial tensions, and serious questions of justice. One Givernor is actually trying to introduce needed reforms to our law enforcement system, and you people deride it as weak or incompetent simply because he is a Republican. Let's not forget that the prison-industrial complex was a Clinton project.

If a Democrat said something equally stupid they'd deserve the same reaction. Sending out 'Prayer Patrols' is not a serious response to crime; it is a deflection of responsibility to his state's citizens by pretending he is doing something while, in reality, doing absolutely nothing. Crime primarily stems from institutional problems - as do nearly all socioeconomic failures. To prevent or reduce crime, it is necessary to reform institutions and policies. You cannot pray away crime, just as you cannot pray away disease, homosexuality, or anything else.

At the same time, the standard law-and-order schtick has done absolutely nothing constructive either and, despite rhetoric to the contrary, Democrats (especially Clinton and Obama) have been just as guilty of perpetuating and exacerbating America's prison-industrial complex and mass incarceration. Punishment is neither a cure nor a deterrent to crime because crime is not a morality issue.

As a Marxist, I am fully aware of the institutional potential to cause crime. One aspect of this is, of course, the tension-riddled relationship between law enforcement and the, shall we say, urban community. This creates a distrusted image of our men and women in uniform and delegitimizes law in the eyes of many an urban youth. This is why I am overjoyed to see Governor Bevin transforming to a potentially far more effective, community-based form of policing, hopefully replacing the lock-'em-up mentality of the past.

Obviously, I do not have a problem with such an approach. A community-based form of policing would certainly be considerably preferable to traditional policing. However, my issue is primarily with the lack of any institutional or policy changes, which these patrols will be used to mask. Traditional policing will not be replaced but supplemented by individuals who will remain powerless to effect any change on behalf of the residents with whom they interact. Sure, they may be able to communicate concerns and vent to these patrols, but when nothing is done by the state to address those issues and each night they are still confronted with crime, police harassment, and arrests, the residents will feel no different than before and nothing will have changed.

[Badger]

We live in an age of mass incarceration, growing racial tensions, and serious questions of justice. One Givernor is actually trying to introduce needed reforms to our law enforcement system, and you people deride it as weak or incompetent simply because he is a Republican. Let's not forget that the prison-industrial complex was a Clinton project.

If a Democrat said something equally stupid they'd deserve the same reaction. Sending out 'Prayer Patrols' is not a serious response to crime; it is a deflection of responsibility to his state's citizens by pretending he is doing something while, in reality, doing absolutely nothing. Crime primarily stems from institutional problems - as do nearly all socioeconomic failures. To prevent or reduce crime, it is necessary to reform institutions and policies. You cannot pray away crime, just as you cannot pray away disease, homosexuality, or anything else.

At the same time, the standard law-and-order schtick has done absolutely nothing constructive either and, despite rhetoric to the contrary, Democrats (especially Clinton and Obama) have been just as guilty of perpetuating and exacerbating America's prison-industrial complex and mass incarceration. Punishment is neither a cure nor a deterrent to crime because crime is not a morality issue.

As a Marxist, I am fully aware of the institutional potential to cause crime. One aspect of this is, of course, the tension-riddled relationship between law enforcement and the, shall we say, urban community. This creates a distrusted image of our men and women in uniform and delegitimizes law in the eyes of many an urban youth. This is why I am overjoyed to see Governor Bevin transforming to a potentially far more effective, community-based form of policing, hopefully replacing the lock-'em-up mentality of the past.

The words "effective" and, especially, "policing" do not belong in that last sentence.

[Kingpoleon]

Don't let communities do anything, guys.

This title is complete and utter hyperbole.

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

Inb4 Sharia patrol.

[Torie]

This might help a bit to the extent a large group of folks wandering around, might tend to stop criminal activity within their view of sight, in the way a street with a lot of pedestrians might be safer than an empty street. On the other hand, there is a risk that these prayer folks might get hurt. Policing is very high skilled job (or should be), but other than being more sets of eyes, wandering around praying for folks is not "policing."

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

We live in an age of mass incarceration, growing racial tensions, and serious questions of justice. One Givernor is actually trying to introduce needed reforms to our law enforcement system, and you people deride it as weak or incompetent simply because he is a Republican. Let's not forget that the prison-industrial complex was a Clinton project.

Exactly why do we "need" religious police?

And I'm opposed to it because it's a step towards theocracy, not because he's a Republican. (Or are you saying that all Republicans are freedom-hating theocrats? You might have a point, there.)

[pbrower2a]

If anyone needs a fair warning that the Republican Party is becoming an authoritarian Party, at least in some States, then here it is.