Can Muslims be white?
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  Can Muslims be white?
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Question: Can Muslims be white?
#1
Yes
 
#2
No
 
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Author Topic: Can Muslims be white?  (Read 5064 times)
they don't love you like i love you
BRTD
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« on: June 12, 2017, 12:47:12 AM »

Yes and this is why people need to quit being f[inks]ing idiots and acting like there's a "white/Muslim" dichotomy and saying things like "oh it was a white guy who did this terrorism, not a Muslim", implying the two are mutually exclusive. They are not. This is what one of the Vox writers who is a Muslim and writes all the articles explaining aspects of Islam looks like:



I mean if I converted to Islam in early 2020, does that mean I shouldn't put down "white" on the 2020 Census? And if so, what should I put down?

For that matter there have also been white guys who have also been Islamist terrorists to boot. Being a Muslim does preclude one from being white, or vice-versa.
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pbrower2a
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« Reply #1 on: June 12, 2017, 01:05:20 AM »

Of course. Bosnia, Kosovo, Albania, Turkey, Iran, Syria, Lebanon, Iraq, Kuwait...

Islam is not racist.
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HAnnA MArin County
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« Reply #2 on: June 12, 2017, 01:07:23 AM »

Isn't Lindsay Lohan a Muslim now?
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Santander
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« Reply #3 on: June 12, 2017, 01:07:55 AM »

Arabs are already considered "white" by the Census Bureau, so...
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The Arizonan
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« Reply #4 on: June 12, 2017, 01:14:40 AM »

Yes, you can be white AND a Muslim whether you were raised as a Muslim or converted.

Some people say that being a Muslim makes you culturally non-white.

Arabs are already considered "white" by the Census Bureau, so...

Arabs are a Middle Eastern people. Why does it even matter whether they are considered white?
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Famous Mortimer
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« Reply #5 on: June 12, 2017, 01:17:11 AM »

The college left is currently trying to redefine "White" to mean basically "not oppressed". It's already seeped into the popular imagination a little bit with things like the trope about "Italians and Jews weren't considered White!" Which is absolutely 100% BS. Italians and Jews weren't liked, they were discriminated against, but no one thought they weren't White. Jews and Italians were allowed to marry WASPS when interracial marriage was illegal. Jews and Italians went to White schools when there was segregation. They have always been considered White. It's a really strange idea and it hasn't yet achieved full ideology hegemony over all of academia. Going off the past re-definitions of "gender" and "racism" though, I imagine they will ultimately be successful.
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BRTD
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« Reply #6 on: June 12, 2017, 01:18:51 AM »

Yes, you can be white AND a Muslim whether you were raised as a Muslim or converted.

Some people say that being a Muslim makes you culturally non-white.

How on Earth is Jennifer Williams (pictured in the OP), culturally non-white? Aside from converting to Islam she's one of the most stereotypical SWPL types ever based on her writings, not to mention that she writes for Vox of all things.
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Beet
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« Reply #7 on: June 12, 2017, 01:26:07 AM »

"Race" is a social construct, so people are whatever they are labelled. For the purpose of how they are treated in Western society though, no, Muslims, particularly Arab Muslims are not white.
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The Arizonan
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« Reply #8 on: June 12, 2017, 01:37:02 AM »

"Race" is a social construct, so people are whatever they are labelled. For the purpose of how they are treated in Western society though, no, Muslims, particularly Arab Muslims are not white.

It's my understanding that "white" refers to Indo-European nationalities.
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Famous Mortimer
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« Reply #9 on: June 12, 2017, 01:38:54 AM »

"Race" is a social construct, so people are whatever they are labelled. For the purpose of how they are treated in Western society though, no, Muslims, particularly Arab Muslims are not white.

To some extent, yes. To some extent, no.

The idea that people in Sub Saharan Africa, people in China, and people in Europe all look different in a generally uniform way was not concocted by evil White racists.
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Beet
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« Reply #10 on: June 12, 2017, 01:41:51 AM »

"Race" is a social construct, so people are whatever they are labelled. For the purpose of how they are treated in Western society though, no, Muslims, particularly Arab Muslims are not white.

To some extent, yes. To some extent, no.

The idea that people in Sub Saharan Africa, people in China, and people in Europe all look different in a generally uniform way was not concocted by evil White racists.

Any essentialist classification of "race", is by definition racist. Yes people from different regions look different, as do people from the same regions. Human phenotype exists along a spectrum and how we choose to chop that up, is a product of society's choice.
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they don't love you like i love you
BRTD
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« Reply #11 on: June 12, 2017, 05:45:57 AM »

"Race" is a social construct, so people are whatever they are labelled. For the purpose of how they are treated in Western society though, no, Muslims, particularly Arab Muslims are not white.

So that person pictured in the OP is not white?
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136or142
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« Reply #12 on: June 12, 2017, 05:50:27 AM »
« Edited: June 12, 2017, 05:55:56 AM by Adam T »

A (white) friend of mine from junior high school converted to the Muslim faith a short time before he was murdered.

I agree with the main point as well.  The terrorist incident in London received front page coverage for several days, but the two mass shootings in the United States that occurred right at the same time were both reported in the Vancouver Sun in a few short paragraphs on B 5.

My friend's murder was an absolutely bizarre case. I have no idea if his conversion to the Muslim faith had anything to do with it or not.  The investigating officer deliberately botched the case.  So, the only people who know are, I guess, the murderer and the police officer.
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Middle-aged Europe
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« Reply #13 on: June 12, 2017, 06:16:55 AM »

Cat Stevens is White.

So, yes.
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Just Passion Through
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« Reply #14 on: June 12, 2017, 07:38:14 AM »

"Race" is a social construct, so people are whatever they are labelled. For the purpose of how they are treated in Western society though, no, Muslims, particularly Arab Muslims are not white.

So that person pictured in the OP is not white?

Beet's first point in that post is actually correct.  Race is not meaningful as a biological concept because humans don't fit into neat little boxes marked "white," "black," etc.  There is more genetic variation within groups than between groups, and this extends well beyond skin color or physical appearance.  Race is a social construct.  This brief article explains things better.

Of course, there are plenty of "white" or light-skinned Muslims, so Beet's assertion there falls flat on its face.
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TDAS04
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« Reply #15 on: June 12, 2017, 08:00:49 AM »

Of course.  Religion isn't the same as race.
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JA
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« Reply #16 on: June 12, 2017, 08:06:43 AM »

Well, what, exactly, is "White?" Historically, the Irish, Italians, Slavs, and so on were not technically "White" in America. Today, White seems to be based almost exclusively on whether your physical appearance resembles that of a person with an obvious ethnic background from Europe. If that is the criteria, then yes, Muslims can be White - whether they are converts or ethnic Bosniaks. After all, Islam is not a race - it is a religion, despite the common association of Middle Eastern and even South Asian people with Islam. However, if White is based on possession of the structural and cultural benefits associated with being White in America, then White Muslims are at a disadvantage and are generally "otherized," albeit to a lesser extent than POC Muslims; therefore, I do not believe they can be fully White in that sense.
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BRTD
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« Reply #17 on: June 12, 2017, 08:11:45 AM »

Well, what, exactly, is "White?" Historically, the Irish, Italians, Slavs, and so on were not technically "White" in America.

No. That was debunked earlier in this thread.
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Zioneer
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« Reply #18 on: June 12, 2017, 11:45:03 AM »

At my first job, I had a Bosnian Muslim coworker, who looked about as white as I am (and I'm like 70% ethnic German), so yes, yes they can be white.
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Associate Justice PiT
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« Reply #19 on: June 12, 2017, 11:55:39 AM »

     Yes, and this false dichotomy (along with the white/Hispanic one) will collapse in coming decades. Which one falls first is an open question though.
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Devout Centrist
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« Reply #20 on: June 12, 2017, 12:12:20 PM »

Arabs are already considered "white" by the Census Bureau, so...
Next census, the classification Middle Eastern and/or North African (MENA) will be added.
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KingSweden
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« Reply #21 on: June 12, 2017, 12:16:20 PM »

Of course they can. Like Santander said, Arabs are considered white for census purposes (Arabs are Indo-European, of course, and share many characteristics with Greeks, Turks, and other Mediterranean and Semitic peoples)
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FEMA Camp Administrator
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« Reply #22 on: June 12, 2017, 12:35:54 PM »

You guys are all making a moot point. Someone of English ancestry can convert to Islam.
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The Arizonan
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« Reply #23 on: June 12, 2017, 01:33:55 PM »

A (white) friend of mine from junior high school converted to the Muslim faith a short time before he was murdered.

I agree with the main point as well.  The terrorist incident in London received front page coverage for several days, but the two mass shootings in the United States that occurred right at the same time were both reported in the Vancouver Sun in a few short paragraphs on B 5.

My friend's murder was an absolutely bizarre case. I have no idea if his conversion to the Muslim faith had anything to do with it or not.  The investigating officer deliberately botched the case.  So, the only people who know are, I guess, the murderer and the police officer.

Why are there so many pieces of s**t in law enforcement these days?

Of course they can. Like Santander said, Arabs are considered white for census purposes (Arabs are Indo-European, of course, and share many characteristics with Greeks, Turks, and other Mediterranean and Semitic peoples)

I thought that Arabs are a Semitic people and that the latter is a classification separate from Indo-European.
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Helsinkian
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« Reply #24 on: June 12, 2017, 01:45:46 PM »
« Edited: June 12, 2017, 02:12:23 PM by Helsinkian »

Of course they can. Like Santander said, Arabs are considered white for census purposes (Arabs are Indo-European, of course, and share many characteristics with Greeks, Turks, and other Mediterranean and Semitic peoples)

Arabs are not Indo-European...

And Indo-European is not a synonym of "white" (if it were that would mean that I as a Finnish person would be non-white; and the same goes for Hungarians, Basques etc.).
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