S11: Bessell-NeverAgain Transgender Rights Act of 2017 (passed)

[fhtagn]

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Sponsor: JustinTimeCuber
Co-sponsors: West_Midlander, fhtagn

[JustinTimeCuber]

Finally catching up to the rest of Atlasia by affirming that transgendered individuals get fair treatment under the law by the Southern government.

[West_Midlander]

Finally catching up to the rest of Atlasia by affirming that transgendered individuals get fair treatment under the law by the Southern government.

Here, here!

[Classic Conservative]

The Southern Independence Party, stands firmly against this garbage piece of legislation that does not protect young women and children.

[President of the great nation of 🏳️‍⚧️]

The Southern Independence Party, stands firmly against this garbage piece of legislation that does not protect young women and children.

As a young woman and child, I'm pretty sure this makes me safe, if anything.

[fhtagn]

It's about time for the South to be able to protect and grant equal treatment to ALL of it's citizens. There is no evidence to support that protecting transfolk presents a danger to anyone. 

[diptheriadan]

Government ID documents display sex, not gender.

[JustinTimeCuber]

The Southern Independence Party, stands firmly against this garbage piece of legislation that does not protect young women and children.

Are you proposing that this bill legalizes creeping on little girls in bathrooms?

Government ID documents display sex, not gender.

This bill would fix that!

[Unconditional Surrender Truman]

Speaking as the author of the original version of this bill, I would very much urge the Chamber of Delegates to adopt this legislation with all due haste.

[Mr. Reactionary]

As a supporter of the Southern Independence Party,  I also support this bill. Freedom and happiness for all!

[diptheriadan]

Why are we putting identity on IDs in the first place? I think that would cause more problems than solve.

[JustinTimeCuber]

Why are we putting identity on IDs in the first place? I think that would cause more problems than solve.

I'm honestly not sure why "official gender/sex" is a thing, but given that it is, we shouldn't be forcing trans people to carry an ID that says they're male when they identify as female or vice versa.

Given that discussion has died down and that it appears that we're all in agreement on this legislation, I move for a final vote.

[diptheriadan]

Okay, what happens when you (not you specifically, anyone) need to know their sex?

[JustinTimeCuber]

Okay, what happens when you (not you specifically, anyone) need to know their sex?

Depends on the situation.

[diptheriadan]

Okay, what happens when you (not you specifically, anyone) need to know their sex?

Depends on the situation.

Does it? If a doctor needs to know the sex of a patient and the ID is the only thing on them, wouldn't it make sense to include their sex on their ID? I'm cool with having their gender on the IDs as well.

[JustinTimeCuber]

Okay, what happens when you (not you specifically, anyone) need to know their sex?

Depends on the situation.

Does it? If a doctor needs to know the sex of a patient and the ID is the only thing on them, wouldn't it make sense to include their sex on their ID? I'm cool with having their gender on the IDs as well.

Doctor: "Can I see your ID? I need to know what parts you have."

I doubt that would happen.

Withdrawing the motion for a final vote, as I think this could be worth discussing. I'd like to hear from people with more knowledge on the issue than me.

[West_Midlander]

Okay, what happens when you (not you specifically, anyone) need to know their sex?

Depends on the situation.

Does it? If a doctor needs to know the sex of a patient and the ID is the only thing on them, wouldn't it make sense to include their sex on their ID? I'm cool with having their gender on the IDs as well.

Doctor: "Can I see your ID? I need to know what parts you have."

I doubt that would happen.

Withdrawing the motion for a final vote, as I think this could be worth discussing. I'd like to hear from people with more knowledge on the issue than me.

Wouldn't they just tell their doctor what gender they physically are? Or the doctor would see when doing a physical, etc?

[JustinTimeCuber]

Okay, what happens when you (not you specifically, anyone) need to know their sex?

Depends on the situation.

Does it? If a doctor needs to know the sex of a patient and the ID is the only thing on them, wouldn't it make sense to include their sex on their ID? I'm cool with having their gender on the IDs as well.

Doctor: "Can I see your ID? I need to know what parts you have."

I doubt that would happen.

Withdrawing the motion for a final vote, as I think this could be worth discussing. I'd like to hear from people with more knowledge on the issue than me.

Wouldn't they just tell their doctor what gender they physically are? Or the doctor would see when doing a physical, etc?

That's what I was thinking.

[diptheriadan]

You see what I mean though. Certain problems can arise when you completely nuke sex off IDs.

[West_Midlander]

You see what I mean though. Certain problems can arise when you completely nuke sex off IDs.

For what purpose, though? Seems as though that would just further discrimination/biases based on physical gender v. gender identity.

[fhtagn]

Does anyone else have anything they want to add?

Discussion seems to be dying down.

[diptheriadan]

Does anyone else have anything they want to add?

Discussion seems to be dying down.

Hold on. I'll have a response to West_Midlander here in a bit.

[diptheriadan]

You see what I mean though. Certain problems can arise when you completely nuke sex off IDs.

For what purpose, though? Seems as though that would just further discrimination/biases based on physical gender v. gender identity.

Okay, still. By having 'Sex' on IDs, they may face prejudice, but without having it, they may face being misprescribed medication, misdiagnosed, and other problems. An example President DFW brought to my attention was Blood Alcohol Concentration. Male and Female BAC levels are different. By only including 'Gender' on IDs, you may be putting drivers at risk.

[West_Midlander]

You see what I mean though. Certain problems can arise when you completely nuke sex off IDs.

For what purpose, though? Seems as though that would just further discrimination/biases based on physical gender v. gender identity.

Okay, still. By having 'Sex' on IDs, they may face prejudice, but without having it, they may face being misprescribed medication, misdiagnosed, and other problems. An example President DFW brought to my attention was Blood Alcohol Concentration. Male and Female BAC levels are different. By only including 'Gender' on IDs, you may be putting drivers at risk.

Hmm. Valid point.

[diptheriadan]

I think adding 'gender' rather than replacing 'sex' would be beneficial without causing too many problems. Anyone want to add an amendment?