Why are so many True Leftists supportive of Erdogan and Modi?

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

I mean in addition to all the other terrible things, both are very neoliberal-friendly, so it doesn't even make sense from that perspective. What's the reasoning? I sometimes think True Leftists just like to stick it to liberals, ala alt-right.

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

I have a positive opinion of Erdogan and even I'm not sure why a true leftist type would be supportive of him. BRTD show us proof.

[Murica!]

The T-34s I've seen defend Erdogan or Modi tend to instantly get shat on by both other tanks and leftists of all stripes, so its not exactly a popular opinion, even among tankies.

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

The T-34s I've seen defend Erdogan or Modi tend to instantly get shat on by both other tanks and leftists of all stripes, so its not exactly a popular opinion, even among tankies.

What's the logic said T-34s use?

[AtorBoltox]

They're not?

[Coraxion]

They're not?

[SATW]

I have a positive opinion of Erdogan and even I'm not sure why a true leftist type would be supportive of him. BRTD show us proof.

lol why?

[KingSweden]

Because they're terrible

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

I have a positive opinion of Erdogan and even I'm not sure why a true leftist type would be supportive of him. BRTD show us proof.

lol why?

I loathe Kemalism, that's why. France-style secularism imposed on a country that's religious on the level of Alabama or Georgia, if not more. It's profoundly undemocratic. Kemalism is toxic waste, trash, a sorry excuse for a secular dictatorship where parties could be banned solely for being influenced by religion. Erdogan's AKP is a good fit for the country. He needs to do more to help unify the country though. That's important; and I don't think he's been doing that as much as he should in the aftermath. He's been arresting too many people, and frankly he needs to leave Gulen alone.

[OSR stands with Israel]

I know many Sanders supporters who support Modi.

[Coraxion]

I know many Sanders supporters who support Modi.

LOL. Not that I'm surprised. Bernie bots are never consistent in their "purity" tests.

[Murica!]

The T-34s I've seen defend Erdogan or Modi tend to instantly get shat on by both other tanks and leftists of all stripes, so its not exactly a popular opinion, even among tankies.

What's the logic said T-34s use?

The same messed up "anti-imperialism" that completely disregards the Soviet Union's imperialism typically, just somehow dumber and less self aware.

[America Needs R'hllor]

I have a positive opinion of Erdogan and even I'm not sure why a true leftist type would be supportive of him. BRTD show us proof.

lol why?

I loathe Kemalism, that's why. France-style secularism imposed on a country that's religious on the level of Alabama or Georgia, if not more. It's profoundly undemocratic. Kemalism is toxic waste, trash, a sorry excuse for a secular dictatorship where parties could be banned solely for being influenced by religion. Erdogan's AKP is a good fit for the country. He needs to do more to help unify the country though. That's important; and I don't think he's been doing that as much as he should in the aftermath. He's been arresting too many people, and frankly he needs to leave Gulen alone.

So what you're saying is that if the majority is bigoted and wants a bloodthirsty, anti-freedom democracy they should be allowed to have it? Nice. Let's just let Alabama go back to the era of segregation, am I right? And Saudi Arabia executing gays is fine because the majority there supports it?

[JA]

The T-34s I've seen defend Erdogan or Modi tend to instantly get shat on by both other tanks and leftists of all stripes, so its not exactly a popular opinion, even among tankies.

What's the logic said T-34s use?

The same messed up "anti-imperialism" that completely disregards the Soviet Union's imperialism typically, just somehow dumber and less self aware.

Ah, yes, the classic know-nothing leftist belief that imperialism, corruption, and human rights abuses are a monopoly owned solely by America and, to a lesser extent, its allies. The thought process that says "anything anti-American automatically equals good." Their dismissal or ignorance of the legitimate criticisms made against those governments, especially by their own citizens, is disgusting. If your sole factor for deciding whether a government and/or leader is good or bad is their approach to American imperialism, then you're an idiot.

I loathe Kemalism, that's why. France-style secularism imposed on a country that's religious on the level of Alabama or Georgia, if not more. It's profoundly undemocratic. Kemalism is toxic waste, trash, a sorry excuse for a secular dictatorship where parties could be banned solely for being influenced by religion. Erdogan's AKP is a good fit for the country. He needs to do more to help unify the country though. That's important; and I don't think he's been doing that as much as he should in the aftermath. He's been arresting too many people, and frankly he needs to leave Gulen alone.

I'm pretty damn sure a lot of Turkish citizens would vehemently disagree with you. Erdogan, and the AKP, has exploited the increasing religiosity of Turks for personal and party gains. They've used it to route out any remaining democratic elements within society and checks on their power. Through stoking fears in the rising Kurdish population (Kurds are on-pace to outnumber ethnic Turks in Turkey within this century), Erdogan has justified extreme policies against Kurdish citizens, which have amounted to countless human rights abuses. He has purged institutions of any opposition simply by alleging they supported the failed coup. And he has done all this while the rich in Turkey have grown even richer in a society with an already high level of income inequality.

Erdogan is a demagogue, dictator, and violator of human rights. The referendum Turkey held earlier this year was plagued with accusations of vote rigging and other undemocratic methods. He has fanned the flames of Turkish ethnic nationalism to justify militarized occupation of Kurdish areas. In his own words, he has said (paraphrasing) "democracy is a train you ride until you get to your desired destination." He has extorted Europe through threats of sending in more refugees to destabilize the continent. His government has been known to assist or turn a blind eye to ISIS and ISIS collaborators while claiming to fight them.

The man has acquired and maintained his position and the power of his party through religious fanaticism, ethnic divisions, and schmoozing the super-rich. There's nothing good or democratic about Erdogan or the AKP.

[Santander]

I have a positive opinion of Erdogan and even I'm not sure why a true leftist type would be supportive of him. BRTD show us proof.

lol why?

I loathe Kemalism, that's why. France-style secularism imposed on a country that's religious on the level of Alabama or Georgia, if not more. It's profoundly undemocratic. Kemalism is toxic waste, trash, a sorry excuse for a secular dictatorship where parties could be banned solely for being influenced by religion. Erdogan's AKP is a good fit for the country. He needs to do more to help unify the country though. That's important; and I don't think he's been doing that as much as he should in the aftermath. He's been arresting too many people, and frankly he needs to leave Gulen alone.

So what you're saying is that if the majority is bigoted and wants a bloodthirsty, anti-freedom democracy they should be allowed to have it? Nice. Let's just let Alabama go back to the era of segregation, am I right? And Saudi Arabia executing gays is fine because the majority there supports it?

Segregation in Alabama was more complicated than simple "bigotry".

[Gustaf]

I have a positive opinion of Erdogan and even I'm not sure why a true leftist type would be supportive of him. BRTD show us proof.

lol why?

I loathe Kemalism, that's why. France-style secularism imposed on a country that's religious on the level of Alabama or Georgia, if not more. It's profoundly undemocratic. Kemalism is toxic waste, trash, a sorry excuse for a secular dictatorship where parties could be banned solely for being influenced by religion. Erdogan's AKP is a good fit for the country. He needs to do more to help unify the country though. That's important; and I don't think he's been doing that as much as he should in the aftermath. He's been arresting too many people, and frankly he needs to leave Gulen alone.

So what you're saying is that if the majority is bigoted and wants a bloodthirsty, anti-freedom democracy they should be allowed to have it? Nice. Let's just let Alabama go back to the era of segregation, am I right? And Saudi Arabia executing gays is fine because the majority there supports it?

Segregation in Alabama was more complicated than simple "bigotry".

I thought nuance was for liberal snowflakes.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

I have a positive opinion of Erdogan and even I'm not sure why a true leftist type would be supportive of him. BRTD show us proof.

lol why?

I loathe Kemalism, that's why. France-style secularism imposed on a country that's religious on the level of Alabama or Georgia, if not more. It's profoundly undemocratic. Kemalism is toxic waste, trash, a sorry excuse for a secular dictatorship where parties could be banned solely for being influenced by religion. Erdogan's AKP is a good fit for the country. He needs to do more to help unify the country though. That's important; and I don't think he's been doing that as much as he should in the aftermath. He's been arresting too many people, and frankly he needs to leave Gulen alone.

So what you're saying is that if the majority is bigoted and wants a bloodthirsty, anti-freedom democracy they should be allowed to have it? Nice. Let's just let Alabama go back to the era of segregation, am I right? And Saudi Arabia executing gays is fine because the majority there supports it?

Segregation in Alabama was more complicated than simple "bigotry".

"I don't hate Blacks, but segregation is a necessary evil for now, because neither side is ready"/"I don't hate Blacks, but we must protect ourselves against being replaced by cheap Black labor"/"I don't hate Blacks, but hey, what's wrong with separate but equal principle?" are still a bigotry, intentional or not. What counts are the results.

[OSR stands with Israel]

I know many Sanders supporters who support Modi.

LOL. Not that I'm surprised. Bernie bots are never consistent in their "purity" tests.

Most Indians I know indeed do support Modi , and some of them do support Sanders . I don't know why but it does happen.

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

I loathe Kemalism, that's why. France-style secularism imposed on a country that's religious on the level of Alabama or Georgia, if not more. It's profoundly undemocratic. Kemalism is toxic waste, trash, a sorry excuse for a secular dictatorship where parties could be banned solely for being influenced by religion. Erdogan's AKP is a good fit for the country. He needs to do more to help unify the country though. That's important; and I don't think he's been doing that as much as he should in the aftermath. He's been arresting too many people, and frankly he needs to leave Gulen alone.

I'm pretty damn sure a lot of Turkish citizens would vehemently disagree with you. Erdogan, and the AKP, has exploited the increasing religiosity of Turks for personal and party gains. They've used it to route out any remaining democratic elements within society and checks on their power. Through stoking fears in the rising Kurdish population (Kurds are on-pace to outnumber ethnic Turks in Turkey within this century), Erdogan has justified extreme policies against Kurdish citizens, which have amounted to countless human rights abuses. He has purged institutions of any opposition simply by alleging they supported the failed coup. And he has done all this while the rich in Turkey have grown even richer in a society with an already high level of income inequality.

Erdogan is a demagogue, dictator, and violator of human rights. The referendum Turkey held earlier this year was plagued with accusations of vote rigging and other undemocratic methods. He has fanned the flames of Turkish ethnic nationalism to justify militarized occupation of Kurdish areas. In his own words, he has said (paraphrasing) "democracy is a train you ride until you get to your desired destination." He has extorted Europe through threats of sending in more refugees to destabilize the continent. His government has been known to assist or turn a blind eye to ISIS and ISIS collaborators while claiming to fight them.

The man has acquired and maintained his position and the power of his party through religious fanaticism, ethnic divisions, and schmoozing the super-rich. There's nothing good or democratic about Erdogan or the AKP.

I'd like to ask you, frankly, why the AKP has won every free election in Turkey since 2002; why Erdogan did win the support of many Kurds in 2002, 2007, and 2011; why the CHP, the leading opposition, has never gotten close to reclaiming power since the rise of the AKP.
What the referendum did show was that the country was still rather divided. Hence, that's why I said Erdogan needs to do more to help unify the country.
Also I'd say it's mainly Europe's fault the refugee situation is a thing in the first place. So what Erdogan is doing on that front isn't extortion. Rather, the chickens have come to roost. Colonialism messed up the Middle East.

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

I have a positive opinion of Erdogan and even I'm not sure why a true leftist type would be supportive of him. BRTD show us proof.

lol why?

I loathe Kemalism, that's why. France-style secularism imposed on a country that's religious on the level of Alabama or Georgia, if not more. It's profoundly undemocratic. Kemalism is toxic waste, trash, a sorry excuse for a secular dictatorship where parties could be banned solely for being influenced by religion. Erdogan's AKP is a good fit for the country. He needs to do more to help unify the country though. That's important; and I don't think he's been doing that as much as he should in the aftermath. He's been arresting too many people, and frankly he needs to leave Gulen alone.

So what you're saying is that if the majority is bigoted and wants a bloodthirsty, anti-freedom democracy they should be allowed to have it? Nice. Let's just let Alabama go back to the era of segregation, am I right? And Saudi Arabia executing gays is fine because the majority there supports it?

I would hardly say I have such a negative view of the Turkish people. I think some Muslim version of Christian Democracy is ideal for Turkey, and a good reflection of the wishes of the people. Protection for people regardless of sexual orientation, some role for morals serving as a compass for government policies, religious freedom. To pretend the AKP wants Dixie-style segregation is laughable alarmism and shows just how off your views on the party are. Erdogan's policies don't fit this profile exactly, but they are better than Kemalism and that's really 90% of what counts.

[Coraxion]

The T-34s I've seen defend Erdogan or Modi tend to instantly get shat on by both other tanks and leftists of all stripes, so its not exactly a popular opinion, even among tankies.

What's the logic said T-34s use?

The same messed up "anti-imperialism" that completely disregards the Soviet Union's imperialism typically, just somehow dumber and less self aware.

Ah, yes, the classic know-nothing leftist belief that imperialism, corruption, and human rights abuses are a monopoly owned solely by America and, to a lesser extent, its allies. The thought process that says "anything anti-American automatically equals good." Their dismissal or ignorance of the legitimate criticisms made against those governments, especially by their own citizens, is disgusting. If your sole factor for deciding whether a government and/or leader is good or bad is their approach to American imperialism, then you're an idiot.

I loathe Kemalism, that's why. France-style secularism imposed on a country that's religious on the level of Alabama or Georgia, if not more. It's profoundly undemocratic. Kemalism is toxic waste, trash, a sorry excuse for a secular dictatorship where parties could be banned solely for being influenced by religion. Erdogan's AKP is a good fit for the country. He needs to do more to help unify the country though. That's important; and I don't think he's been doing that as much as he should in the aftermath. He's been arresting too many people, and frankly he needs to leave Gulen alone.

I'm pretty damn sure a lot of Turkish citizens would vehemently disagree with you. Erdogan, and the AKP, has exploited the increasing religiosity of Turks for personal and party gains. They've used it to route out any remaining democratic elements within society and checks on their power. Through stoking fears in the rising Kurdish population (Kurds are on-pace to outnumber ethnic Turks in Turkey within this century), Erdogan has justified extreme policies against Kurdish citizens, which have amounted to countless human rights abuses. He has purged institutions of any opposition simply by alleging they supported the failed coup. And he has done all this while the rich in Turkey have grown even richer in a society with an already high level of income inequality.

Erdogan is a demagogue, dictator, and violator of human rights. The referendum Turkey held earlier this year was plagued with accusations of vote rigging and other undemocratic methods. He has fanned the flames of Turkish ethnic nationalism to justify militarized occupation of Kurdish areas. In his own words, he has said (paraphrasing) "democracy is a train you ride until you get to your desired destination." He has extorted Europe through threats of sending in more refugees to destabilize the continent. His government has been known to assist or turn a blind eye to ISIS and ISIS collaborators while claiming to fight them.

The man has acquired and maintained his position and the power of his party through religious fanaticism, ethnic divisions, and schmoozing the super-rich. There's nothing good or democratic about Erdogan or the AKP.

Well said. Per usual.

[JA]

I loathe Kemalism, that's why. France-style secularism imposed on a country that's religious on the level of Alabama or Georgia, if not more. It's profoundly undemocratic. Kemalism is toxic waste, trash, a sorry excuse for a secular dictatorship where parties could be banned solely for being influenced by religion. Erdogan's AKP is a good fit for the country. He needs to do more to help unify the country though. That's important; and I don't think he's been doing that as much as he should in the aftermath. He's been arresting too many people, and frankly he needs to leave Gulen alone.

I'm pretty damn sure a lot of Turkish citizens would vehemently disagree with you. Erdogan, and the AKP, has exploited the increasing religiosity of Turks for personal and party gains. They've used it to route out any remaining democratic elements within society and checks on their power. Through stoking fears in the rising Kurdish population (Kurds are on-pace to outnumber ethnic Turks in Turkey within this century), Erdogan has justified extreme policies against Kurdish citizens, which have amounted to countless human rights abuses. He has purged institutions of any opposition simply by alleging they supported the failed coup. And he has done all this while the rich in Turkey have grown even richer in a society with an already high level of income inequality.

Erdogan is a demagogue, dictator, and violator of human rights. The referendum Turkey held earlier this year was plagued with accusations of vote rigging and other undemocratic methods. He has fanned the flames of Turkish ethnic nationalism to justify militarized occupation of Kurdish areas. In his own words, he has said (paraphrasing) "democracy is a train you ride until you get to your desired destination." He has extorted Europe through threats of sending in more refugees to destabilize the continent. His government has been known to assist or turn a blind eye to ISIS and ISIS collaborators while claiming to fight them.

The man has acquired and maintained his position and the power of his party through religious fanaticism, ethnic divisions, and schmoozing the super-rich. There's nothing good or democratic about Erdogan or the AKP.

I'd like to ask you, frankly, why the AKP has won every free election in Turkey since 2002; why Erdogan did win the support of many Kurds in 2002, 2007, and 2011; why the CHP, the leading opposition, has never gotten close to reclaiming power since the rise of the AKP.
What the referendum did show was that the country was still rather divided. Hence, that's why I said Erdogan needs to do more to help unify the country.
Also I'd say it's mainly Europe's fault the refugee situation is a thing in the first place. So what Erdogan is doing on that front isn't extortion. Rather, the chickens have come to roost. Colonialism messed up the Middle East.

Of course a lot, if not a majority, of Turks like Erdogan. I'm not denying that. But Turks have been on the receiving end of Islamic fundamentalist teachings that have been increasingly radicalizing their populace. That has been occurring throughout the Muslim world. Erdogan and the AKP have been beneficiaries and contributors to this radicalization because it helps to advance their interests, which just so happen to be the interests of wealthy forces within Turkey. Erdogan has also been promoting neo-Ottoman propaganda and aspirations among the population for political purposes. Turkey will never been an empire again, but the AKP has been reviving that legacy to gain support. Nationalism and religious fundamentalism are classic tools used to manipulate people. Erdogan will never unify Turkey; at best he can further radicalize the Turkish ethnics, which would solidify their blind support.

As for Europe, of course ISIS and the refugee crisis is primarily their fault. It's the fault of European colonial actions in the region and American led wars (with European support), but Turkey has played a role here as well. They were the most powerful empire in the region for centuries and treated the Balkans and ME as their colonial territories. The legacy of that is still causing ethnic tensions throughout the region. Add in Turkey's secret collaboration with ISIS and it's impossible to deny their role in this humanitarian catastrophe as well. They aren't some innocent bystander here. They've played a role in destabilizing the ME and Balkans too. That doesn't make playing extortionist politics with Europe justified.

[AtorBoltox]

I loathe Kemalism, that's why. France-style secularism imposed on a country that's religious on the level of Alabama or Georgia, if not more. It's profoundly undemocratic. Kemalism is toxic waste, trash, a sorry excuse for a secular dictatorship where parties could be banned solely for being influenced by religion. Erdogan's AKP is a good fit for the country. He needs to do more to help unify the country though. That's important; and I don't think he's been doing that as much as he should in the aftermath. He's been arresting too many people, and frankly he needs to leave Gulen alone.

I'm pretty damn sure a lot of Turkish citizens would vehemently disagree with you. Erdogan, and the AKP, has exploited the increasing religiosity of Turks for personal and party gains. They've used it to route out any remaining democratic elements within society and checks on their power. Through stoking fears in the rising Kurdish population (Kurds are on-pace to outnumber ethnic Turks in Turkey within this century), Erdogan has justified extreme policies against Kurdish citizens, which have amounted to countless human rights abuses. He has purged institutions of any opposition simply by alleging they supported the failed coup. And he has done all this while the rich in Turkey have grown even richer in a society with an already high level of income inequality.

Erdogan is a demagogue, dictator, and violator of human rights. The referendum Turkey held earlier this year was plagued with accusations of vote rigging and other undemocratic methods. He has fanned the flames of Turkish ethnic nationalism to justify militarized occupation of Kurdish areas. In his own words, he has said (paraphrasing) "democracy is a train you ride until you get to your desired destination." He has extorted Europe through threats of sending in more refugees to destabilize the continent. His government has been known to assist or turn a blind eye to ISIS and ISIS collaborators while claiming to fight them.

The man has acquired and maintained his position and the power of his party through religious fanaticism, ethnic divisions, and schmoozing the super-rich. There's nothing good or democratic about Erdogan or the AKP.

I'd like to ask you, frankly, why the AKP has won every free election in Turkey since 2002; why Erdogan did win the support of many Kurds in 2002, 2007, and 2011; why the CHP, the leading opposition, has never gotten close to reclaiming power since the rise of the AKP.

Tyranny of the majority (or tyranny of the masses) refers to an inherent weakness of direct democracy and majority rule in which the majority of an electorate can place its own interests above, and at the expense of, those in the minority. This results in oppression of minority groups comparable to that of a tyrant or despot.

[Gay Republican]

Here's a question:

Why are so many of BRTD's threads about things that literally only he believes?

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Here's a question:

Why are so many of BRTD's threads about things that literally only he believes?

Amusing from someone who believes that Shariah Law is enforced in the city I live in.