Rank every president from most conservative to most progressive
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Author Topic: Rank every president from most conservative to most progressive  (Read 913 times)
Joe McCarthy Was Right
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« on: August 10, 2017, 06:29:56 PM »
« edited: August 11, 2017, 05:03:12 PM by Joe McCarthy Was Right »

James Monroe
Andrew Jackson
Martin Van Buren
James Madison
Thomas Jefferson
Millard Fillmore
Grover Cleveland
Ronald Reagan
Calvin Coolidge
James Polk
George Bush
James Buchanan
Zachary Taylor
John Tyler
Franklin Pierce
George HW Bush
Gerald Ford
Donald Trump
John Adams
Herbert Hoover
Warren Harding
Chester Arthur
George Washington
William McKinley
William Howard Taft
John Quincy Adams
Andrew Johnson
Richard Nixon
William Henry Harrison
James Garfield
Rutherford Hayes
Benjamin Harrison
Dwight Eisenhower
John F. Kennedy
Abraham Lincoln
Jimmy Carter
Bill Clinton
Ulysses S. Grant
Woodrow Wilson
Theodore Roosevelt
Harry Truman
Franklin D. Roosevelt
Barack Obama
Lyndon B. Johnson

I counted protectionism as left-wing and interventionism as right-wing. If you're going to criticize my list, at least make a full list of your own.
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RINO Tom
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« Reply #1 on: August 10, 2017, 09:12:29 PM »

I'll make a list tomorrow, but your two "counts" are ridiculous.  Protectionism was championed by the corporate community in the 1800s and criticized as more or less the original "trickle down economics," while isolationism rooted in American exceptionalism was a staple of the Old Right.  Neither protectionism nor isolationism were, in the times of Lincoln or McKinley, in any way "left-wing," even if you could argue they are today.
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Joe McCarthy Was Right
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« Reply #2 on: August 10, 2017, 09:24:32 PM »
« Edited: August 10, 2017, 09:42:29 PM by Joe McCarthy Was Right »

I'll make a list tomorrow, but your two "counts" are ridiculous.  Protectionism was championed by the corporate community in the 1800s and criticized as more or less the original "trickle down economics," while isolationism rooted in American exceptionalism was a staple of the Old Right.  Neither protectionism nor isolationism were, in the times of Lincoln or McKinley, in any way "left-wing," even if you could argue they are today.
Early communists supported free trade, the conservative party in Canada started out protectionist, paleoconservatives are anti-war, yeah yeah yeah. I could argue both sides if I wanted to, but the consensus from most people in 2017 is that protectionism is left-wing because it isn't a free market principle. You don't have to use my same criteria since it's subjective anyway.
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Bismarck
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« Reply #3 on: August 10, 2017, 09:37:34 PM »

Eh il just do since 1900 because putting presidents before that on a spectrum is very difficult.

Coolidge
Harding
McKinley
Reagan
W Bush
Trump
Hoover
HW Bush
Taft
Nixon
Ike
Ford
Clinton
Carter
Teddy Roosevelt
Kennedy
Truman
Wilson
Obama
FDR
LBJ
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RINO Tom
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« Reply #4 on: August 11, 2017, 10:58:06 AM »

I'll make a list tomorrow, but your two "counts" are ridiculous.  Protectionism was championed by the corporate community in the 1800s and criticized as more or less the original "trickle down economics," while isolationism rooted in American exceptionalism was a staple of the Old Right.  Neither protectionism nor isolationism were, in the times of Lincoln or McKinley, in any way "left-wing," even if you could argue they are today.
Early communists supported free trade, the conservative party in Canada started out protectionist, paleoconservatives are anti-war, yeah yeah yeah. I could argue both sides if I wanted to, but the consensus from most people in 2017 is that protectionism is left-wing because it isn't a free market principle. You don't have to use my same criteria since it's subjective anyway.

Yeah, but it's 2017!  LOL, you can't judge William McKinley - a politician UNIVERSALLY identified as a conservative by experts and historians who have studied primary texts of the time - on today's issues.  I mean, all Abraham Lincoln had to really speak on was immigration, slavery, keeping the union together, class issues and prohibition.  60% of that list is N/A.  However, like you said, it's subjective, so judge how you want.  I'll also do since 1900:

Coolidge (R-MA)
McKinley (R-OH)
Harding (R-OH)
Reagan (R-CA)
Bush 43 (R-TX)
Eisenhower (R-KS)
Hoover (R-CA)
Bush 41 (R-TX)
Trump (R-NY)
Nixon (R-CA)
Ford (R-MI)
Clinton (D-AR)
Roosevelt (R-NY)
Carter (D-GA)
Taft (R-OH)
Kennedy (D-MA)
Truman (D-MO)
Obama (D-IL)
Wilson (D-NJ)
Johnson (D-TX)
Roosevelt (D-NY)
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Joe McCarthy Was Right
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« Reply #5 on: August 11, 2017, 02:52:09 PM »
« Edited: August 11, 2017, 02:58:49 PM by Joe McCarthy Was Right »

I'll make a list tomorrow, but your two "counts" are ridiculous.  Protectionism was championed by the corporate community in the 1800s and criticized as more or less the original "trickle down economics," while isolationism rooted in American exceptionalism was a staple of the Old Right.  Neither protectionism nor isolationism were, in the times of Lincoln or McKinley, in any way "left-wing," even if you could argue they are today.
Early communists supported free trade, the conservative party in Canada started out protectionist, paleoconservatives are anti-war, yeah yeah yeah. I could argue both sides if I wanted to, but the consensus from most people in 2017 is that protectionism is left-wing because it isn't a free market principle. You don't have to use my same criteria since it's subjective anyway.

Yeah, but it's 2017!  LOL, you can't judge William McKinley - a politician UNIVERSALLY identified as a conservative by experts and historians who have studied primary texts of the time - on today's issues.  I mean, all Abraham Lincoln had to really speak on was immigration, slavery, keeping the union together, class issues and prohibition.  60% of that list is N/A.  However, like you said, it's subjective, so judge how you want.  I'll also do since 1900:

Coolidge (R-MA)
McKinley (R-OH)
Harding (R-OH)
Reagan (R-CA)
Bush 43 (R-TX)
Eisenhower (R-KS)
Hoover (R-CA)
Bush 41 (R-TX)
Trump (R-NY)
Nixon (R-CA)
Ford (R-MI)
Clinton (D-AR)
Roosevelt (R-NY)
Carter (D-GA)
Taft (R-OH)
Kennedy (D-MA)
Truman (D-MO)
Obama (D-IL)
Wilson (D-NJ)
Johnson (D-TX)
Roosevelt (D-NY)
McKinley was definitely a conservative when you compare him to the Silver Democrats, but another way to look at it is that he was just carrying on the policies of other Gilded Age Republicans who expanded government and increased spending (although on second thought I shouldn't have put the Harrisons above McKinley, and I will change it). It was just a progressive era of politics, like I have Nixon pretty low. The fact that the issues don't really match up with today's issues is why I thought the topic would be interesting.
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RINO Tom
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« Reply #6 on: August 11, 2017, 03:31:22 PM »

The only things I'm willing to judge pre-1900 Presidents on ideologically speaking are (my idea of the "left" position/philosophy in parentheses):

- Class Issues (did the POTUS support economic policies that would change society in an egalitarian way, even if it penalized the business community, American economic forecasts or the wealthiest in society/did the POTUS oppose conserving the current power structure in society?)
- Immigration (this one is pretty much like today)
- Moral Issues (did the POTUS oppose puritanical influence on the government and its laws/did the POTUS, in general, support a more "morally loose" society?)
- America's Institutions (was the POTUS willing to fundamentally change the narrative about our democratic institutions and Constitutional thought to achieve what he deemed important?)

Fillmore (W-NY)
Grant (R-IL)
Adams (F-MA)
Quincy Adams (DR-MA)
Washington (NP-VA)
Monroe (DR-VA)
Lincoln (R-IL)
Polk (D-TN)
Cleveland (D-NY)
Hayes (R-OH)
Johnson (D-TN)
Garfield (R-OH)
Madison (DR-VA)
Van Buren (D-NY)
Arthur (R-NY)
Jackson (D-TN)
Jefferson (DR-VA)

Don't know enough to rank just yet:
Tyler (W-VA)
Henry Harrison (W-OH)
Taylor (W-LA)
Pierce (D-NH)
Harrison (R-IN)
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ScottieF
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« Reply #7 on: August 11, 2017, 04:19:30 PM »

Since 1900:

Coolidge
Reagan
W. Bush
Trump
Harding
McKinley
Hoover
Ford
H.W. Bush
Taft
Nixon
Clinton
Eisenhower
Carter
T. Roosevelt
Kennedy
Wilson
Truman
Obama
F. Roosevelt
Johnson
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tmcusa2
Junior Chimp
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« Reply #8 on: August 11, 2017, 04:31:54 PM »

James Monroe
Andrew Jackson
Martin Van Buren
James Madison
Thomas Jefferson
Millard Fillmore
Grover Cleveland
Ronald Reagan
Calvin Coolidge
James Polk
George Bush
James Buchanan
Zachary Taylor
John Tyler
Franklin Pierce
George HW Bush
Gerald Ford
Donald Trump
John Adams
Herbert Hoover
Warren Harding
Chester Arthur
George Washington
William McKinley
William Howard Taft
John Quincy Adams
Richard Nixon
William Henry Harrison
James Garfield
Rutherford Hayes
Benjamin Harrison
Dwight Eisenhower
John F. Kennedy
Abraham Lincoln
Jimmy Carter
Bill Clinton
Ulysses S. Grant
Woodrow Wilson
Theodore Roosevelt
Harry Truman
Franklin D. Roosevelt
Barack Obama
Lyndon B. Johnson

I counted protectionism as left-wing and interventionism as right-wing. If you're going to criticize my list, at least make a full list of your own.
Is there a reason that you didn't list all of them?
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Joe McCarthy Was Right
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« Reply #9 on: August 11, 2017, 04:40:52 PM »

James Monroe
Andrew Jackson
Martin Van Buren
James Madison
Thomas Jefferson
Millard Fillmore
Grover Cleveland
Ronald Reagan
Calvin Coolidge
James Polk
George Bush
James Buchanan
Zachary Taylor
John Tyler
Franklin Pierce
George HW Bush
Gerald Ford
Donald Trump
John Adams
Herbert Hoover
Warren Harding
Chester Arthur
George Washington
William McKinley
William Howard Taft
John Quincy Adams
Richard Nixon
William Henry Harrison
James Garfield
Rutherford Hayes
Benjamin Harrison
Dwight Eisenhower
John F. Kennedy
Abraham Lincoln
Jimmy Carter
Bill Clinton
Ulysses S. Grant
Woodrow Wilson
Theodore Roosevelt
Harry Truman
Franklin D. Roosevelt
Barack Obama
Lyndon B. Johnson

I counted protectionism as left-wing and interventionism as right-wing. If you're going to criticize my list, at least make a full list of your own.
Is there a reason that you didn't list all of them?
Which president did I miss?
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tmcusa2
Junior Chimp
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« Reply #10 on: August 11, 2017, 04:41:41 PM »
« Edited: August 11, 2017, 04:43:54 PM by 3D X 31 »

Andrew Johnson
(I wasn't trying to criticize. I just wanted to see if anyone noticed this)

edit: I cut and pasted to excel to see how many were there.
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tmcusa2
Junior Chimp
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« Reply #11 on: August 11, 2017, 04:47:11 PM »

Oh, and welcome to this site. Smiley
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dw93
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« Reply #12 on: August 12, 2017, 10:19:09 PM »

Since 1900:

Coolidge
Harding
(Tie). Reagan
(Tie). Bush 43
McKinley
Hoover
Trump
Bush 41
Ford
Nixon
Taft
Clinton
Carter
Eisenhower
T. Roosevelt
Kennedy
Obama
Truman
Wilson
LBJ
FDR
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HisGrace
Junior Chimp
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« Reply #13 on: August 14, 2017, 02:22:22 PM »

Not even going to bother with the pre-FDR ones. The issues were different so it's not a fair comparison and most old politicians would be by definition conservative today simply because they were from an earlier time period.

Anyway-

Reagan
Bush 41/43 (tie)
Eisenhower
Trump
Ford
Nixon
JFK
Clinton
LBJ
Carter
Obama
FDR
Truman
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OSR stands with Israel
Computer89
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« Reply #14 on: August 14, 2017, 02:37:36 PM »

Since 1896:

Coolidge
Harding
McKinley
Hoover
W Bush
Reagan
Trump
Taft
HW Bush
Clinton
Nixon
Ford
Eisenhower
Kennedy
Obama
Truman
Carter
Wilson
FDR
LBJ
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TheLeftwardTide
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« Reply #15 on: August 15, 2017, 12:13:48 AM »

I'll just do it from 1900:

Reagan
Coolidge
Harding
Dubya
Trump
Hoover
McKinley
Taft
Ford
Nixon
Eisenhower
Clinton
Carter
Obama
Wilson
Kennedy
Truman
Teddy
LBJ
FDR

The partisan split is almost perfect, with the notable exception of Theodore Roosevelt.
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OSR stands with Israel
Computer89
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« Reply #16 on: August 16, 2017, 01:02:34 PM »

I'll just do it from 1900:

Reagan
Coolidge
Harding
Dubya
Trump
Hoover
McKinley
Taft
Ford
Nixon
Eisenhower
Clinton
Carter
Obama
Wilson
Kennedy
Truman
Teddy
LBJ
FDR

The partisan split is almost perfect, with the notable exception of Theodore Roosevelt.


The idea that Reagan is more conservative then Harding/Coolidge is laughable.

1. Harding/Coolidge cut taxes even more than Reagan(by 1927 the top tax bracket was reduced from 73% to 25% and only 2% of the country were paying any Income tax at all , while with Reagan he cut income taxes from 70% to 28%, but he raised capital gains to 28% and got rid of many many deductions) .

2. Harding/Coolidge reduced the size of the government significantly more than Reagan did (even though the government was way smaller in 1920 than 1980 , Harding/Coolidge still cut government more than Reagan).

3. Harding/Coolidge were also just as anti union as Reagan was

4. They also took were more pro deregulation than Reagan was




Heck you could argue Bush Jr admin was more conservative then Reagan:

1. While he cut income taxes by a lower  % than Reagan did, he kept most of the loopholes unlike Reagan, and unlike Reagan dramatically reduced the dividend tax rate(from 39.6% to 15%) and reduced capital gains to 15% as well.


2. He took deregulation to a further level than Reagan did

3. He was also much more socially conservative than Reagan


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Beet
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« Reply #17 on: August 26, 2017, 11:25:34 PM »

The Conservatives

John Adams
John Quincy Adams
Abraham Lincoln
Grover Cleveland
George Washington
William McKinley
William Henry Harrison
Franklin Pierce
Donald Trump
Benjamin Harrison
James Buchanan
Warren Harding
Andrew Johnson
James Garfield
George W. Bush
Calvin Coolidge
Ronald Reagan
Millard Fillmore
Chester Alan Arthur
George H.W. Bush
Herbert Hoover

The Centrists

Zachary Taylor
William Howard Taft
Dwight David Eisenhower
John Tyler
Richard Milhous Nixon
James Monroe
Rutherford B. Hayes
Bill Clinton
Gerald Ford

The Liberals

Jimmy Carter
Martin Van Buren
Harry Truman
Barack Obama
John F. Kennedy
Ulysses S. Grant
Lyndon B. Johnson
James Polk
Theodore Roosevelt
James Madison
Woodrow Wilson
Thomas Jefferson
Andrew Jackson
Franklin D. Roosevelt
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Orser67
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« Reply #18 on: August 29, 2017, 04:26:59 PM »

Since 1900, and in comparison to their own era rather than in comparison to how they would fall on the political spectrum now:

Reagan
Coolidge
Harding
Nixon
W Bush
Trump?
McKinley
Hoover
Ford
Eisenhower
HW Bush
Carter
Taft
Clinton
Kennedy
Truman
Obama
T. Roosevelt
Wilson
LBJ
FDR
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