Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
September 22, 2017, 03:18:10 am
HomePredMockPollEVCalcAFEWIKIHelpLogin Register
News: Please delete your old personal messages.

+  Atlas Forum
|-+  General Politics
| |-+  Individual Politics (Moderators: Alcon, Torie, AndrewTX)
| | |-+  Civil War Series I, Roman Civil War (49-45 BC)
« previous next »
Pages: [1] Print
Poll
Question: Who would you support?
Populares (Caesar)   -17 (68%)
Optimates (Pompey)   -8 (32%)
Abstain*   -0 (0%)
Show Pie Chart
Total Voters: 25

Author Topic: Civil War Series I, Roman Civil War (49-45 BC)  (Read 238 times)
Representative Carpetbagger
CELTICEMPIRE
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 2927


View Profile
« on: September 12, 2017, 06:12:36 pm »
Ignore

This is the first in a series of polls where I ask Atlas which side they would support in history's various civil wars.

*Only vote abstain if you think both sides were truly the scum of the earth.

Optimates (prefers a Republic over an Empire)
Logged

Do what is right because it is right; and leave it alone.

-Chiune Sugihara

Pray for Peace
Kingpoleon
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 14905
United States


View Profile
« Reply #1 on: September 12, 2017, 06:53:02 pm »
Ignore

Populares, but only because I prefer Antonius and Brutus live.
Logged

"America now is stumbling through the darkness of hatred and divisiveness. Our values, our principles, and our determination to succeed as a free and democratic people will give us a torch to light the way." - Gerald Ford

"Good speech and good looks covers man's every vice. Plain speech and plain looks covers man's every virtue."

Economic: 1.38
Social: -2.36
GoTfan
GoTfan21
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 1544
Australia


View Profile
« Reply #2 on: September 12, 2017, 07:08:29 pm »
Ignore

Populares, but only because I prefer Antonius and Brutus live.
Logged

Endorsements:
2018 Senate: Beto O'Rourke (Texas), Bernie Sanders (Vermont), Elizabeth Warren  (Massachusetts), Sherrod Brown (Ohio)

2020 President: Jeff Merkley

Link to The Australian Republic!
http://uselectionatlas.org/FORUM/index.php?topic=255684.0

Quote
"I'm voting Democrat myself."

"But then I have got a human brain."
-Ian Hislop and Paul Merton
The Govanah Jake
Jake Jewvinivisk
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 980


Political Matrix
E: -3.61, S: -7.48

View Profile
« Reply #3 on: September 12, 2017, 09:10:55 pm »
Ignore

Populares, but only because I prefer Antonius and Brutus live.
Logged

Here - http://uselectionatlas.org/FORUM/index.php?topic=18844.1250

2020 Democratic Primary - Sherrod Brown, Tulsi Gabbard, Steve Bullock

TL: Strong as a Bull Moose! - A Alternate 1912 Election and Beyond
http://uselectionatlas.org/FORUM/index.php?topic=270726.0

Lumine
LumineVonReuental
Moderators
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 7593
View Profile
« Reply #4 on: September 12, 2017, 09:15:27 pm »
Ignore

Optimates. Yes, hindsight would have told me of Caesar's clemency and brilliance in government, but if at the time I had to choose between the legal government of Rome (backed by Pompeius Magnus, no less) and an overambitious general invading his own homeland to avoid being charged with treason, it would have been an easy choice.
Logged
Lechasseur
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 1014
France


View Profile
« Reply #5 on: September 12, 2017, 09:48:51 pm »
Ignore

Probably Populares
Logged
Prime Minister Truman
Harry S Truman
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 6666


View Profile
« Reply #6 on: September 12, 2017, 10:01:38 pm »
Ignore

Of course the Populares, though as Lumine says, hindsight makes the choice much easier.
Logged



Prime Minister Truman
Harry S Truman
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 6666


View Profile
« Reply #7 on: September 12, 2017, 11:47:21 pm »
Ignore

Optimates (prefers a Republic over an Empire)
Generally, I'd be very skeptical of the claim that Rome was not already an empire by 49 BC, or that the Optimates were not equally culpable in the fall of the republic. Let's not forget that the first general to march on Rome was not Caesar, but Sulla.
Logged



Lechasseur
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 1014
France


View Profile
« Reply #8 on: September 12, 2017, 11:57:35 pm »
Ignore

Optimates (prefers a Republic over an Empire)
Generally, I'd be very skeptical of the claim that Rome was not already an empire by 49 BC, or that the Optimates were not equally culpable in the fall of the republic. Let's not forget that the first general to march on Rome was not Caesar, but Sulla.

This. The Republic was on its' last legs anyway.
Logged
Lumine
LumineVonReuental
Moderators
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 7593
View Profile
« Reply #9 on: September 13, 2017, 12:02:22 am »
Ignore

Still, it ought to be remembered only a particular set of circumstances gave us the Empire as we knew it (due to just how unique Augustus was as a historical character), and even then it took decades to turn it into full-scale autocracy.

Even if the old system of the Republic had become corrupt and flawed in many ways, it was by no means dead or doomed, and I would assert it was perfectly possible for a "republican" system to last. An Optimate win doesn't produce an individual strong and popular enough to duplicate Caesar's example within that generation (Pompey was old and had proved he didn't quite had what it took to seize full control, and his sons never appeared to enjoy much popularity outside of Sextus Pompey).

As for Sulla, I've always felt Marius has to take the ultimate blame for pushing Sulla too far.
Logged
Kingpoleon
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 14905
United States


View Profile
« Reply #10 on: September 13, 2017, 08:08:37 am »
Ignore

I'd argue that Rome's best bet was in the next civil war - Marcus Antonius and Cleopatra.
Logged

"America now is stumbling through the darkness of hatred and divisiveness. Our values, our principles, and our determination to succeed as a free and democratic people will give us a torch to light the way." - Gerald Ford

"Good speech and good looks covers man's every vice. Plain speech and plain looks covers man's every virtue."

Economic: 1.38
Social: -2.36
Representative Carpetbagger
CELTICEMPIRE
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 2927


View Profile
« Reply #11 on: September 13, 2017, 08:23:16 am »
Ignore

Optimates (prefers a Republic over an Empire)
Generally, I'd be very skeptical of the claim that Rome was not already an empire by 49 BC, or that the Optimates were not equally culpable in the fall of the republic. Let's not forget that the first general to march on Rome was not Caesar, but Sulla.

This certainly isn't a Civil War with clear good guys and bad guys, and there are reasons to support either side.  But IMO the Republic at least has a better chance with the Optimates.
Logged

Do what is right because it is right; and leave it alone.

-Chiune Sugihara

Pray for Peace
Wakie77
Jr. Member
**
Posts: 91
View Profile
« Reply #12 on: September 13, 2017, 09:00:11 am »
Ignore

Doesn't this thread belong in History?
Logged
The Mikado
Moderators
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 16224


View Profile
« Reply #13 on: September 13, 2017, 09:56:35 am »
Ignore

You mean 52-49, right? Pompey dies in early 48 and the rest of the war is a mop-up operation against Cato and Scipio in Africa that was never seriously in doubt.
Logged



The Handsome Monkey King Son Wukong weighs in on politics.
Lumine
LumineVonReuental
Moderators
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 7593
View Profile
« Reply #14 on: September 13, 2017, 11:56:08 am »
Ignore

You mean 52-49, right? Pompey dies in early 48 and the rest of the war is a mop-up operation against Cato and Scipio in Africa that was never seriously in doubt.

Aye, the whole Africa campaign was sort of a done deal. But what about Spain? Caesar was ridiculously close to being defeated and killed at Munda by the Pompey brothers, and had he died there he would have gone down with most of his senior staff + Octavian. You then have Antonius and Lepidus in Rome against a victorious Pompeian army in Spain, which is by no means a one-sided affair.
Logged
Representative Carpetbagger
CELTICEMPIRE
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 2927


View Profile
« Reply #15 on: September 13, 2017, 02:02:41 pm »
Ignore

You mean 52-49, right? Pompey dies in early 48 and the rest of the war is a mop-up operation against Cato and Scipio in Africa that was never seriously in doubt.

This is the war I'm referring to:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caesar%27s_Civil_War
Logged

Do what is right because it is right; and leave it alone.

-Chiune Sugihara

Pray for Peace
Pages: [1] Print 
« previous next »
Jump to:  


Login with username, password and session length

Logout

Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines