HB 1152 - Carbon Tax Act (Passed)

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Damn I hadn't even noticed this had been brought up last night.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Not seeing a whole lot of comment/debate here.  Sad!

I agree with Representative VPG and would advise the House to adopt a border carbon adjustment fee for this bill.

I cannot invoke the 24/72 hour debate rule until it has a sponsor.


So in case people didn't read or see where PiT said it, "THIS NEEDS A SPONSOR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I will withhold comment until Gibson can post.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

On what planet is that an advocacy Gibson, really

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

That is thin and borderline pathetic JGibson

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

In the Senate there was discussion of using this to pay for the Energy Subsidy act thing that just passed. Considering we are going to be doing a budget and that is unfunded, I would recommend amending this to direct the necessary funding towards that program that it is paid for.

Just because this is being considered separately doesn't mean that is no longer an option.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

That being said it has long been my policy to oppose both a carbon tax and a cap and trade system. In my view both programs significantly increase the cost of living for the poor, which yes this seeks to address, but also 2) reduces our competitiveness and economic strength.

That is not to say that I don't understand the costs associated with needing to protect the environment and the failure to do so. On the contrary I think it is most likely that technological discovery will find alternative sources of energy that are more cost effective. Just like natural gas displaced coal by and large in power production, which was a benefit to the environment. This was accomplished by private sector research with gov't subsidies produced new drilling techniques like fracking and the cost of gas took a nose dive as production soared, rendering coal noncompetitive.

By the same token, I think private research with incentives and yes even some subsidies will produce cost effective alternatives even in the absence of a carbon tax system. As for cap and trade, to my view, it has all the limitations and difficulties of a carbon tax, but with the added problem of creating a class of what are basically derivatives that Hedge Funds will play football with, distorting the price and availability of energy in the name of short term profit on Wall Street.

I can delve more into detail on any one of these points if anyone desires it, but for me I will likely be voting nay on this bill's final vote. 

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

PiT make sure you recognize each amendment and assign it a number.

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Status: Representatives have 24 hours to object (from when PiT posted, not this post. Time actually expires in 25 minutes )

That way people know which amendment is under consideration. It may seem pointless but if you get several amendments in a row and are dealing with them one at a time, it is better to have the amendment in question in the same post calling for 24 hours.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

     The amendment has been adopted. I will be sure to use a numbering system in the future, as I have found it to be useful as PPT to refer back to amendment numbers.

It will be tricky though, because Amendments are numbered across the whole house so if another one was offered on another bill after my last update to the tracker, that one would take the next number.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I object to proceeding to a final vote.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

In the Senate there was discussion of using this to pay for the Energy Subsidy act thing that just passed. Considering we are going to be doing a budget and that is unfunded, I would recommend amending this to direct the necessary funding towards that program that it is paid for.

Just because this is being considered separately doesn't mean that is no longer an option.

meant so that it is paid for.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I would recommend funding the Green Energy Subsidies Bill with this. Remember, our deficit is going to be large because we inherited the RL situation.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Probably over $500 Billion dollars in deficit.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Those numbers are total bullsh**t by the way.


The highest number I came up with was $72 billion between 2002 and 2008, which divided by six is just over $10 billion a year.

R&D for fossil fuels, is indeed $24 billion, spread over a 30 year period from 1973 to 2003.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_subsidies

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Also it appears the horribly constructed corporate tax reform bill from last year, "appears" to have eliminated the subsidies in question completely.


I say "appears" because that thing is just a mess.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I generally like the idea of starting with the funding and working from there, but it does leave one to wonder that being said, do we have any idea how much a Carbon tax would bring in?

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I am going to have to object pending some answers to the questions posed by the President and myself.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Can we get a time estimate on that process?

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

If texts are unworkable then amendments should be offered as part of this bill that correct the Rebate and Subsidy one so that we may move forward and acquire the necessary data to make this work.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I remove the objection then.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

An amendment vote shouldn't be necessary. I withdrew my objection so the amendment can be declared as passed.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Nay FTR