Stoicism or Epicureanism?

[Blue3]

Stoicism or Epicureanism?

Which is better?


Stoicism
(in short: to accept life and find happiness in all things)

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Epicureanism:
(in short: to find tranquility through moderation, self-discipline, and simple-living in tune with nature/reason/compassion... rational and considerate hedonism)

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[Georg Ebner]

For every religious person doubtlessly Epicureanism.

[Small L]

For every religious person doubtlessly Epicureanism.

I'm religious and I voted for stoicism. I find their metaphysical views more palatable.

[FEMA Camp Administrator]

I am, by nature, somewhat of a stoic.

[Georg Ebner]

For every religious person doubtlessly Epicureanism.

I'm religious and I voted for stoicism. I find their metaphysical views more palatable.

The basis of stoicism was not pagan pantheism (cf. HERDER, GOETHE), it was monism (cf. SPINOZA, HEGEL) - absolutely antireligious and antirational !!!

[Small L]

For every religious person doubtlessly Epicureanism.

I'm religious and I voted for stoicism. I find their metaphysical views more palatable.

The basis of stoicism was not pagan pantheism (cf. HERDER, GOETHE), it was monism (cf. SPINOZA, HEGEL) - absolutely antireligious and antirational !!!

Eh, I never said I liked monism, but I think I prefer it to the way atomists think about that thing they call 'void.'

[Georg Ebner]

For every religious person doubtlessly Epicureanism.

I'm religious and I voted for stoicism. I find their metaphysical views more palatable.

The basis of stoicism was not pagan pantheism (cf. HERDER, GOETHE), it was monism (cf. SPINOZA, HEGEL) - absolutely antireligious and antirational !!!

Eh, I never said I liked monism, but I think I prefer it to the way atomists think about that thing they call 'void.'

Atomism proclaims Your divinity indirectly by making values subjective.
But Monism makes that directly - what is far more disgusting.

[Blue3]

Also this thread is more about their life philosophies than their specific views on God.

[Georg Ebner]

Also this thread is more about their life philosophies than their specific views on God.

But all "practical" ethics derives from the "theoretical" basics.

[Blue3]

Also this thread is more about their life philosophies than their specific views on God.

But all "practical" ethics derives from the "theoretical" basics.

How would you describe them for Stoicism and Epicureanism, then?
(and I wasn't talking about ethics, I was talking about worldviews and life goals)

[FEMA Camp Administrator]

For every religious person doubtlessly Epicureanism.

I'm religious and I voted for stoicism. I find their metaphysical views more palatable.

The basis of stoicism was not pagan pantheism (cf. HERDER, GOETHE), it was monism (cf. SPINOZA, HEGEL) - absolutely antireligious and antirational !!!

Eh, I never said I liked monism, but I think I prefer it to the way atomists think about that thing they call 'void.'

Atomism proclaims Your divinity indirectly by making values subjective.
But Monism makes that directly - what is far more disgusting.

Please speak in complete sentences.

[TJ in Oregon]

Stoicism. Their ethic, while a little strange is nowhere near as offensive as the Epicureans. It even has some noticeable virtue in it. Yes, the monism is also odd, but frankly from a theist view, pantheism is closer than atomism. Also, in modern America while Epicureanism is very much still alive and just as screwed up. If anything we could use a little more stoic mentality creeping into the cesspool of emotional whinging that is our current political discourse.

[Georg Ebner]

Also this thread is more about their life philosophies than their specific views on God.

But all "practical" ethics derives from the "theoretical" basics.

How would you describe them for Stoicism and Epicureanism, then?
(and I wasn't talking about ethics, I was talking about worldviews and life goals)

Epicureanism = InHalation
Stoicism = ExHalation

[Georg Ebner]

Stoicism. Their ethic, while a little strange is nowhere near as offensive as the Epicureans. It even has some noticeable virtue in it. Yes, the monism is also odd, but frankly from a theist view, pantheism is closer than atomism. Also, in modern America while Epicureanism is very much still alive and just as screwed up. If anything we could use a little more stoic mentality creeping into the cesspool of emotional whinging that is our current political discourse.

Indeed, Stoicism doesn't fit to Your country: Stoicism:Epicureanism=NeoPlatonism:Aristotelism=Realism:Nominalism=SU:US

[Lechasseur]

Stoicism. Their ethic, while a little strange is nowhere near as offensive as the Epicureans. It even has some noticeable virtue in it. Yes, the monism is also odd, but frankly from a theist view, pantheism is closer than atomism. Also, in modern America while Epicureanism is very much still alive and just as screwed up. If anything we could use a little more stoic mentality creeping into the cesspool of emotional whinging that is our current political discourse.

[°Leprechaun]

Any other perspectives?

Do you think that the two philosophies are mutually exclusive? I would say that there could be quite a bit of overlap between the two?

[Blue3]

In the same way Protestantism and Catholicism share a lot in common, but are still different.

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

Epicrurianism is not hedonism, and the confusion between the two leads to the former getting a bad rep.

[Blue3]

I would argue that it is hedonism that gets a bad rap as something only about sex/drugs/partying and not thinking.

How is epicureanism not hedonism?

[Associate Justice PiT]

     Hedonism has come to be defined by a base pursuit of short-term gratification. Epicureans would not have understood the hedonic in the modern sense, so I would say it mainly makes sense to describe Epicureanism as not being hedonist in that it is not what people understand hedonism to be today.

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

Yeah, I meant hedonism in the conventional understanding of the term. Epicurius preached the importance of purging suffering and pain, not just from one's own lived experience, but from the lives of others as well. To the Epicurians, simple pleasures were how one achieved peace of mind: they ate simple food, had a small circle of good friends and eschewed the rat race of politicking/glory-seeking/profiteering; their refusal to embrace the grotesque world of Roman politics is why a lot of Ancient writers thought they were deeply suspicious (well, that and the deism). Overindulgence leads to suffering, to yourself or others, so it should be avoided (although the average Romans thought both Stoics and Epicurians to be weirdo reprobates, they would probably both be far better and quieter neighbours than the more conventional upper class Romans)

[Blue3]

Any thoughts for why Ancient Greek Philosophies, such as these, didn't persist in the same way that Taoism and Confucianism persisted in China?

[Del Tachi]

Any thoughts for why Ancient Greek Philosophies, such as these, didn't persist in the same way that Taoism and Confucianism persisted in China?

Many would argue that Stoicism had great influence on early Christian writers, including Paul, and it was a foundation on this philosophy that gave a Jewish religious sect legs to stand on in the Hellenistic world.

Romans 12-15 has been noted as a great place to see the influence of Stoicism on Paul's theology.