Recitation of Pledge Found Unconstitutional... Again (user search)
       |           

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
April 27, 2024, 02:12:59 AM
News: Election Simulator 2.0 Released. Senate/Gubernatorial maps, proportional electoral votes, and more - Read more

  Talk Elections
  General Discussion
  Constitution and Law (Moderator: Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.)
  Recitation of Pledge Found Unconstitutional... Again (search mode)
Pages: [1]
Author Topic: Recitation of Pledge Found Unconstitutional... Again  (Read 13645 times)
I spent the winter writing songs about getting better
BRTD
Atlas Prophet
*****
Posts: 113,043
Ukraine


Political Matrix
E: -6.50, S: -6.67

P P
« on: September 15, 2005, 08:27:19 PM »

Good. I don't really care about "Under God", I just don't want kids saying the damn thing. Forced nationalistic oaths belong in North Korea.
Logged
I spent the winter writing songs about getting better
BRTD
Atlas Prophet
*****
Posts: 113,043
Ukraine


Political Matrix
E: -6.50, S: -6.67

P P
« Reply #1 on: September 15, 2005, 08:33:39 PM »

Anyway people who oppose the ruling:

Would you be opposed to requiring teachers to inform students that they do not have to say the thing, something that many students are not aware of?

Only way I'd tolerate it is if the school says that it's voluntary.
Logged
I spent the winter writing songs about getting better
BRTD
Atlas Prophet
*****
Posts: 113,043
Ukraine


Political Matrix
E: -6.50, S: -6.67

P P
« Reply #2 on: September 15, 2005, 08:42:47 PM »

Well, I will admit that the argument of "de facto coercion" is not necessarily the most compelling one (the establishment clause argument has always seemed better to me), although I don't see anything particularly unsound with the underlying logic: if de jure coercion was prohibited by Barnette, then it stands to reason that de facto coercion is also prohibited. The situation is perhaps analagous to Plessy: "separate but equal" may be equal de jure, but not equal de facto. Similarly, there may be no coercion by law, but there may be coercion in fact.

Thus, the only question is as to whether there is indeed de facto coercion, and that is of course a debatable point.

I live in a neighborhood where I might be de facto coerced from living.  Certainly my choice has raised the eyebrows of some posters.  Is that "de facto coercion?"  In every class I attended in elementary school, I attended with a girl that was a Jehovah's Witness; she, as was her right, did not say the Pledge of Allegiance.  That might have helped teach me tolerance.  Permit those who wish to  say it, and those people who don't wish to not say it.

How many say it because they aren't aware they don't have to?

Like I said, would you oppose mandating that teachers inform the  class that it is optional?

I'm just thankful they never even had that thing in class since 6th grade at the schools I went tol.
Logged
Pages: [1]  
Jump to:  


Login with username, password and session length

Terms of Service - DMCA Agent and Policy - Privacy Policy and Cookies

Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines

Page created in 0.029 seconds with 12 queries.