Societies worse off 'when they have God on their side'

[angus]

Sigh...correlation does not equal causation.

 

I think the fault in the logic is there, but the fundamental problem is even worse.   It's one of definition.  It's like me saying, "Peanut butter does not cure hunger.  Now, for this experiment I shall define as 'peanut butter' this container of gaseous nitrogen.  Notice that the rhesus monkey starves after being fed sufficient peanut butter for a week.  Clearly, peanut butter does not cure hunger."

another example:  one in ten sub-saharan africans are HIV positive.  ergo, negroid peoples f uck like bunnies.  see what I mean?

Here's a quote "I suspect that Europeans are increasingly repelled by the poor societal performance of the Christian states"  Nothing wrong with that statement.  I personally am repelled by poor societal performance of any state, Christian, Muslim, Hindu, atheist, or irreligious.  This, of course, is a normative proposition, and hardly qualifies as academically rigorous, however.

look, I don't argue that rejecting Darwinism because you foolishly believe it contradicts the first five chapters of the book of Genesis is a good idea.  but you have to realize that this has nothing to do with God, assuming such a thing there be, is "taking sides"  It's like a Simpson's episode:  Remember Milhouse as Moses?  ("We Jews will have smooth sailing from now on.")

I've read the article, and you also have to realize that newspapers are notorious for misquoting scientists.  I remember reading in the San Francisco Chronicle a number given in degrees fahrenheit for the temperature at "which all motion stops" was minus 260.7.  First, that's closer to the Celcius temp for absolute zero.  Second, it's still not correct (I think it's more like 273.15).  Third, absolute zero is the temperature at which all translation motion stops (we still have zero-point vibrational motion in molecules at that temperature.)

I also remember my colleage with whom I worked at Columbia this summer telling me about the press that came out of his original work on the hydrogen exchange reaction, way back in 1984.  Dick Bernstein and others thought it was noteworthy enough to be featured in a real news article, and the Los Angeles Times science reporter did an article on it--which was front page in the early edition of the paper that day.  Nice article.  However, it mutated as it was picked up by other newspapers, into something like "scientists prove quantum theory," which generated a lot of comments as you might guess!

And, I repeat:  the logic is bunk to begin with.  so even if the newspapers got it right (which is indeed rare) the source is playing a bad game of pseudosocialscience to begin with.

Take this with a huge grain of salt, folks.

[angus]

That's an absurd classification

no more or less absurd than the standard by which these "researchers" determined which side god was on in the first place.  I'd say, given the bizarre nature of the thread, and the fact that only one poster is even pretending to take the "study" seriously, any absurdity will simply add to the merriment.

speaking of...

which side the gods are on, or whether they exist, isn't something I give much thought to outside this forum (yeah, I'm shallow like that), but today it came up in a big way.  I was at the convenience store about four blocks from my house, speaking with the overweight black chick who works there.  she's a democrat-sympathizer, as I've found from our previous brief conversations as I sometimes browse the local paper.  anyway, today, the local paper had a big headline about how Governor Barbour is going to push for liberalized casino laws in the state leg.  (not a freebie for him, as only one of the two chambers is controlled by the GOP.  Unlike the US congress, the MS state has one of its chambers controlled by the anti-business party.)    So I saw the headline and mentioned it, "Barbour pushing for onshore casinos"  Right now, you can gamble only on riverboats in the rivers or offshore, but it's silly, and with the storms there's a push to allow them to build on terra firma.  Not that there's any shortage of wetlands (or casinos) here, but forcing them onto rivers and swamps is just bad business.  anyway, when I mumbled the headline out loud, she just shook her head.  I said, "so you're not into more casinos?  but it's good revenue.  and this state needs the revenue badly, don't you think?"  and she promptly said, "I don't think God wants casinos around.  you saw what he did to those in Biloxi last month."

  ?!?!

bizarre.  guess in her mind god isn't on the republicans side anyway.  and apparently he doesn't much care for the city of New Orleans either.

[angus]

I don't think the world is so many trillion years old either

Neither do I, I think it's only been around only about 4 or 5 billion, like the leading scientific theories state.

Yeah, sorry about that   You did get what I was trying to say, though, right?

actually, now the the Cosmic Dust suggests that we're in a fifth expansion of the universe (which followed the first through fourth expansions and contractions), and that we're about 15 billion years into the current expansion.  neato.  anyway, I get what you say.  Although I never really had serious doubts about life on earth starting from single-celled organisms arising from the primordial soup some 3.5 billion years ago, I think it's largely irrelevant whether you "believe" in any of this.  it's just fun with math and such. 

assuming gods exist isn't really a problem either.  but assigning to them "sides" is a little weird, on the other hand.  don't you think?  I know the Maya and the Egyptians and the Romans did that sort of things, but our modern monotheistic religions, and even the ancient poly- and atheistic ones really don't need that sort of dogma.  It's not like the gods all sitting around somewhere in the aether making bets on who'll win wars and such.  Like humans at a football game.  but you never know.  Remember the Q from the continuum.  He was one really bizarre omnipotent fellow, wasn't he?  He had a great sense of humor as well. 

[angus]

Jesus:  whoa, allah, you can't resolve these things with violence.
Allah:  ah, sh**t, who let him in here?
Yahweh:  dude, put out that joint, mary's coming.
Mary:  Are you in there Jesus.  What have I told you about hanging out with those two?  Get upstairs right this instant.  and shave that scraggly beard!
Quetzalcoatl:  hey you old bag, the boy's old enough to make up his own mind.
Zeus:  yeah, Jesus, you want India or Pakistan?  five will get you 20 on pakistan, but the window's closing in two minutes, so make up your mind.
Hera:  Zeus, you better not be up there alone with mary!  Jesus, I don't know how Hillary Clinton could put up with that sort of thing, but I'm not!
Jesus:  Would you guys quit saying "JESUS" every time you get mad.  It's very confusing.

[angus]

Mercury (at door in domino's uniform):  so who ordered the pizza?

I am so f ucking stuffed right now.  Like a thanksgiving turkey.  Like an vietnamese chicken about to give Avian Flu to a hanoi family. 

So we had fried chicken tonight.  Rarely eat food prepared by others, since my wife and I both like to cook, and we both like good food, and we're both cheap.  But there's a Church's Chicken about 5 blocks from here, and we're both tired.  So I walked there and got a ten-piece mixed spicey order.  She had four of the pieces.  I had six.  There's quite a bit of fried chicken in Columbus, I've noticed.  Two Popeye's, at least two KFC restaurants, three Church's that I can think of.  And a bunch of small fried chicken places like that one on 125th street in Manhattan I mentioned.  ("Old fashioned, but good.)  KFC is very exotic, very pricey, and considered very sophisticated in China.  Funny that.  Every chinese person I know thinks of fried chicken as an exotic dish.  Especially that from KFC.  My wife tells me of how when she got her BS in Nanjing from the country's second most prestigious university, how her sister "treated" her family to KFC.  'Round here, it's considered commoners food.  I've also noticed how fried chicken is more and more popular the farther south you go.  And it's not a negro thing.  Because you can go far enough south that you don't see any negros and it just keeps getting more and more popular.  Start at Brownsville and start driving south, for example.  By the time you get to Guatemala City there's a Pollo Campero everywhere.  (You know Pollo Campero, a Guatemalan company, has opened up a restaurant in Barcelona!  Yep, barcelona.  Imperialismo al reves, mis amigos!  woo hoo.)  And there's one on every block in Guatemala.  And a KFC too.  But the condiments are a bit exotic.  Anyway, I'm very full of chicken.  And lots of crust and skin.  The old lady picks hers off.  I can't stand to waste it.  And anyway that's the best part.  Especially if you order spicey.  I can feel my arteries hardening as I type.  I'm going to finish off this bottle of merlot and take them out for a nice long walk.  you know, for the heart.  I'll come back and rant about something or another after I'm able to feel my circulation.  Meanwhile, I'll leave you with a mullet rock lyric.

There she stood in the street
Smiling from her head to her feet
I said hey what is this
Now maybe baby
Maybe you're in need for a kiss
I said slow don't talk so fast
Don't you think that love can last
She said love Lord above
Now you're trying to trick me in love

All right now
Baby it's all right now
All right now
Baby it's all right now

I took her home to my place
Watching every move on her face
She said look what's your game
Are you trying to put me in shame
I said slow don't talk so fast
Don't you think that love can last
She said love Lord above
Now you're tryin' to trick me in love

All right now
Baby it's all right now
All right now
Baby it's all right now

All right now
Baby it's all right now
All right now
Baby it's all right now

[angus]

well, it's called PFK down there.  Like in Quebec.  Ever notice that?  In Quebec and Montreal KFC is called PFK.  Same Colonel.  Same ugly red sign.  But the letters are PFK.  It's like that in guatamala too.  Pollo Frito de Kentuqui, I suppose, and Poullet Frite du Kentuck, I guess. 

oh, it occurs to me that I didn't see much fried chicken when I was in Peru and Bolivia.  So I suppose you can go far enough South that chicken's popularity gives way to cuy.

Short walk.  King Louis wasn't much in for a long stroll this evening.  Had that introspective look, he did.  He gets that way when he's trying to figure out how to achieve World Peace.  Or devising a cure for cancer.  Or thinking about the next great Energy Source.  I can't be sure which, since he doesn't speak much yet.  He knows exactly one English word and one Mandarin word.  Well, it's the same word:  MaMa.  But there'll be time for him to achieve all those things later.  Right now mama says he's not in the mood for a walk.  What mama says is the law.  You know how it is. 

Well, where were we.  Ah, yes, are societies worse off when they have god on their side? 

sh**t, I can't even pretend to take this thread seriously anymore.  I'm just glad none of youze can either.  Remember, it's the New York Times, and not the Times of London, that prints "all the news that's fit to print"  And ever since Jayson with a Y Blair came along, we don't really trust them either.  (and don't even get me started on that "dewey defeats truman" headline the editors chose to run.)  Well, you never really know whether it's the Times or the Onion nowadays.