Senators look here! *IMPORTANT*

[KEmperor]

No, you are telling people that the government officially endorces a god(doesn't matter which one), which is establishment of religion(again, which one is immaterial) no matter how you dress it up.

The state is not establishing a religion (such as Henry VIII did with the Anglica Church) which is why we established the "Establishment Clause". So by having no official religion we are not directly violating that most flexible of clauses.

How can you not comprehend that by mentioning a god in the national motto that the government is stating a position on such a being?

[PBrunsel]

How can you not comprehend that by mentioning a god in the national motto that the government is stating a position on such a being?

We're establshing their is such a being, but not an Anglican Chirch, which is why the Founding Fathers gave us the Establishment Clause. It was not to save us from all religion, just from one specific state sanctioned religion, such as the Anglican Church.

[KEmperor]

How can you not comprehend that by mentioning a god in the national motto that the government is stating a position on such a being?

We're establshing their is such a being, but not an Anglican Chirch, which is why the Founding Fathers gave us the Establishment Clause. It was not to save us from all religion, just from one specific state sanctioned religion, such as the Anglican Church.

Exactly, thank you.  The government is officially establishing that your god exists.  This is highly inappropriate and most certainly an establishment of religion.  Unless you care to argue that god has nothing to do with religion?

(As a side note, now that I don't have to remain neutral with regard to proposed legislation, this should be fun )

[PBrunsel]

Exactly, thank you.  The government is officially establishing that your god exists.  This is highly inappropriate and most certainly an establishment of religion.  Unless you care to argue that god has nothing to do with religion?

As I keep brining up, saying "God" applies to all religions. If it was to say, "Jesus Christ, Family, and Country" then I would oppose it in all respects because that is the establishment of one religion over all others. Saying God does not discriminate against any other religion.

[KEmperor]

Exactly, thank you.  The government is officially establishing that your god exists.  This is highly inappropriate and most certainly an establishment of religion.  Unless you care to argue that god has nothing to do with religion?

As I keep brining up, saying "God" applies to all religions. If it was to say, "Jesus Christ, Family, and Country" then I would oppose it in all respects because that is the establishment of one religion over all others. Saying God does not discriminate against any other religion.

Note that the constitution does not say, "No agency of government shall make any law respecting an establishment of A religion.  Rather it prohibits the establishment of religion itself.

[PBrunsel]

Exactly, thank you.  The government is officially establishing that your god exists.  This is highly inappropriate and most certainly an establishment of religion.  Unless you care to argue that god has nothing to do with religion?

As I keep brining up, saying "God" applies to all religions. If it was to say, "Jesus Christ, Family, and Country" then I would oppose it in all respects because that is the establishment of one religion over all others. Saying God does not discriminate against any other religion.

Note that the constitution does not say, "No agency of government shall make any law respecting an establishment of A religion.  Rather it prohibits the establishment of religion itself.

Ypu also have to take it into context about why the founding fathers approved of this clause. You see, "seperation of church and state" i not in the Constitution at all.

[KEmperor]

Exactly, thank you.  The government is officially establishing that your god exists.  This is highly inappropriate and most certainly an establishment of religion.  Unless you care to argue that god has nothing to do with religion?

As I keep brining up, saying "God" applies to all religions. If it was to say, "Jesus Christ, Family, and Country" then I would oppose it in all respects because that is the establishment of one religion over all others. Saying God does not discriminate against any other religion.

Note that the constitution does not say, "No agency of government shall make any law respecting an establishment of A religion.  Rather it prohibits the establishment of religion itself.

Ypu also have to take it into context about why the founding fathers approved of this clause. You see, "seperation of church and state" i not in the Constitution at all.

Well, I could ask Peter and co. why they included it, but that would compromise his impartiality if this should go to court.  Regardless, I care little for the reasons why they put it in.  The fact remains that it's in there, and quite clearly prohibits the government from establishing an offical religious position, regardless of which religion we might be discussing.

[PBrunsel]

The fact remains that it's in there, and quite clearly prohibits the government from establishing an offical religious position, regardless of which religion we might be discussing.

We are not establishing "religion". We are not subsidising it with tax revenure, we are not aiding churches, we are not forcing prayer upn the masses. How is this establishing a forced religion such as that of Henry VIII?

BTW, chances of my slogan getting chosen is zilch anyway so this argument is purely just for the fun of debating.

[KEmperor]

The fact remains that it's in there, and quite clearly prohibits the government from establishing an offical religious position, regardless of which religion we might be discussing.

We are not establishing "religion". We are not subsidising it with tax revenure, we are not aiding churches, we are not forcing prayer upn the masses. How is this establishing a forced religion such as that of Henry VIII?

BTW, chances of my slogan getting chosen is zilch anyway so this argument is purely just for the fun of debating.

Yes, I am confident that the other Senators will choose a more reasonable slogan.

[PBrunsel]

The fact remains that it's in there, and quite clearly prohibits the government from establishing an offical religious position, regardless of which religion we might be discussing.

We are not establishing "religion". We are not subsidising it with tax revenure, we are not aiding churches, we are not forcing prayer upn the masses. How is this establishing a forced religion such as that of Henry VIII?

BTW, chances of my slogan getting chosen is zilch anyway so this argument is purely just for the fun of debating.

Yes, I am confident that the other Senators will choose a more reasonable slogan.

Probably a Latin one to sound more official. Saddly, my knowledge of Latin is but a few phrases, and none which warrant writing down.

[Gabu]

I think my motto is clearly the best.

[The Dowager Mod]

Although it does not establish religion per se it does make it official atlasian policy that the country does support a god in some form which is unacceptable to me.

[Joe Republic]

I would like a senator to introduce the following motto on my behalf:

"Flying Spaghetti Monster, Family, and Country."

[MasterJedi]

I would like a senator to introduce the following motto on my behalf:

"Flying Spaghetti Monster, Family, and Country."

This is supposed to be serious Joe.


Now if we can get Texasgurl to make some picks soon I believe we can vote on this after the midterms. (I know we don't have a chance of getting Colin in here)

[Joe Republic]

I would like a senator to introduce the following motto on my behalf:

"Flying Spaghetti Monster, Family, and Country."

This is supposed to be serious Joe.

I'm deadly serious.  Please don't mock my deeply held religious beliefs.

[PBrunsel]

BTW, I will not withdraw my slogan nomintion and I will vote for it as well. I for the life of me can't see why certain parties are so frightended of the word "God". It's like the boogeyman or something.

[CheeseWhiz]

This is Atlasia, it should be:

"Dave, Family and Country"

[Platypus]

PBrunsel-what of all the jeiwsh people who would be denied the right to speak our national motto?

I like mine

[PBrunsel]

PBrunsel-what of all the jeiwsh people who would be denied the right to speak our national motto?

Do Jews not beleive in God now?

[Emsworth]

PBrunsel-what of all the jeiwsh people who would be denied the right to speak our national motto?

Do Jews not beleive in God now?

No, but I believe that a Jew is not supposed to speak God's name.

[Joe Republic]

PBrunsel-what of all the jeiwsh people who would be denied the right to speak our national motto?

Do Jews not beleive in God now?

Yes, but they believe that saying the word is blasphemous, and therefore would be highly inappropriate for them.  Would you want a swear word in your national motto?

[Emsworth]

To be fair, Jewish people only refuse to speak "YHWH." There is nothing objectionable, in the Jewish faith, to the word "God" or "Lord."

[PBrunsel]

Would you want a swear word in your national motto?

What E Plurbis Unum is not a group of swear words? Now I can stop washing my mouth out with soap everytime I say it.

God bless you for pointing that our Mr. President.

[MasterJedi]

*Bump* for Texasgurl to make her choices.

[The Dowager Mod]

Motto: Don't tread on me
Animal:moose
Bird:Rhode island red