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Author Topic: UK Local Elections / European Parliamentary Elections  (Read 23864 times)
Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #100 on: June 16, 2004, 05:55:07 AM »

Now, now...I don't think UKIP should be compared to Le Pen or Vlams Blok...there's a marked difference between xenophobic nationalists and racist idiots, IMHO. Vlams Blok vice chairman had to resign after claiming that the Holocaust was very exaggerated. I don't think a lot of people in the UKIP would do that.

One of their new MEP's was a member (and a candidate!) for a white supremicist party.
Kilroy-Silk has made racist remarks about Arabs and Spanish people (he actually lives in a villa in Spain. Hypocrite).
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Gustaf
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« Reply #101 on: June 16, 2004, 06:03:42 AM »

Now, now...I don't think UKIP should be compared to Le Pen or Vlams Blok...there's a marked difference between xenophobic nationalists and racist idiots, IMHO. Vlams Blok vice chairman had to resign after claiming that the Holocaust was very exaggerated. I don't think a lot of people in the UKIP would do that.

One of their new MEP's was a member (and a candidate!) for a white supremicist party.
Kilroy-Silk has made racist remarks about Arabs and Spanish people (he actually lives in a villa in Spain. Hypocrite).

OK...I'll admit to not being an expert but the impression I got is taht there is a difference between Vlams Blok, Le Pen and such parties and more moderate nationalist parties like UKIP...but I could be wrong.
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #102 on: June 16, 2004, 06:12:31 AM »

Now, now...I don't think UKIP should be compared to Le Pen or Vlams Blok...there's a marked difference between xenophobic nationalists and racist idiots, IMHO. Vlams Blok vice chairman had to resign after claiming that the Holocaust was very exaggerated. I don't think a lot of people in the UKIP would do that.

One of their new MEP's was a member (and a candidate!) for a white supremicist party.
Kilroy-Silk has made racist remarks about Arabs and Spanish people (he actually lives in a villa in Spain. Hypocrite).

OK...I'll admit to not being an expert but the impression I got is taht there is a difference between Vlams Blok, Le Pen and such parties and more moderate nationalist parties like UKIP...but I could be wrong.

It's not as bad as LePen (and out-and-out fascist) but it's rather "Powellite"...
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JohnFKennedy
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« Reply #103 on: June 16, 2004, 10:29:05 AM »

Now, now...I don't think UKIP should be compared to Le Pen or Vlams Blok...there's a marked difference between xenophobic nationalists and racist idiots, IMHO. Vlams Blok vice chairman had to resign after claiming that the Holocaust was very exaggerated. I don't think a lot of people in the UKIP would do that.

One of their new MEP's was a member (and a candidate!) for a white supremicist party.
Kilroy-Silk has made racist remarks about Arabs and Spanish people (he actually lives in a villa in Spain. Hypocrite).

I believe the Arab comment he made was not so much a comment as a long article which can be summed up by his own phrase which he used that "All Arabs are terrorists".
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Ben.
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« Reply #104 on: June 16, 2004, 11:08:46 AM »
« Edited: June 16, 2004, 11:09:55 AM by Ben »

Now, now...I don't think UKIP should be compared to Le Pen or Vlams Blok...there's a marked difference between xenophobic nationalists and racist idiots, IMHO. Vlams Blok vice chairman had to resign after claiming that the Holocaust was very exaggerated. I don't think a lot of people in the UKIP would do that.

One of their new MEP's was a member (and a candidate!) for a white supremacist party.
Kilroy-Silk has made racist remarks about Arabs and Spanish people (he actually lives in a villa in Spain. Hypocrite).


Not about the Spanish, it was a "joke" at the time that he made in the "stump speech" he made across the east midlands.

Yeah there is defiantly some prejudice in that party but not blatant racism, Kilroy is simply an islamiphobe, its as i said a small populist rightwing party that could do a lot of damage to the Tory party as a Kilroy lead,  assertive, UKIP could split the Conservative vote and make big inroads into the lower and middle income groups who could support the conservatives and even Labour and the LibDems it would be interesting if you ended up with LibDems (Radical Left) Labour (Moderate Left) Conservative (Moderate Right) and UKIP (Radical Right), its unlikely but not totally impossible...
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #105 on: June 16, 2004, 12:41:57 PM »

Well the LibDems are unlikely ever to develop into a radical leftist party... unless you mean social issues...
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Ben.
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« Reply #106 on: June 16, 2004, 01:33:46 PM »

Well the LibDems are unlikely ever to develop into a radical leftist party... unless you mean social issues...


I say radical... I really mean the "Guardian Party"... "Big State, Social Liberals" (pretty similar to what Kennedy thinks is about right now)... basically a leftwing party positioned as the "real Social Democratic” party, quite a turnaround but not impossible with their constant chasing of the leftwing and leftwing middle class vote.  
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #107 on: June 16, 2004, 01:39:09 PM »

Well the LibDems are unlikely ever to develop into a radical leftist party... unless you mean social issues...


I say radical... I really mean the "Guardian Party"... "Big State, Social Liberals" (pretty similar to what Kennedy thinks is about right now)... basically a leftwing party positioned as the "real Social Democratic” party, quite a turnaround but not impossible with their constant chasing of the leftwing and leftwing middle class vote.  


Most of them aren't too keen on "Big State" from what I've seen... hell they want to abolish the DTI... but social liberalism is about right...
Kennedy is waaaaaay to the left of most of his party mind.
---
As far as the progressive yuppy vote goes, that's a local thing I think... almost a hangover from the old SDP really...
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Ben.
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« Reply #108 on: June 17, 2004, 01:14:38 AM »

Well the LibDems are unlikely ever to develop into a radical leftist party... unless you mean social issues...


I say radical... I really mean the "Guardian Party"... "Big State, Social Liberals" (pretty similar to what Kennedy thinks is about right now)... basically a leftwing party positioned as the "real Social Democratic” party, quite a turnaround but not impossible with their constant chasing of the leftwing and leftwing middle class vote.  


Most of them aren't too keen on "Big State" from what I've seen... hell they want to abolish the DTI... but social liberalism is about right...
Kennedy is waaaaaay to the left of most of his party mind.
---
As far as the progressive yuppy vote goes, that's a local thing I think... almost a hangover from the old SDP really...

Yeah, with Kennedy there is a definite sense that his politics are shaped by the facts that he’s a former Labour Party Member and an SDP MP.

But I just don’t understand how the Liberals suffer no hit to their credibility as they turn around and take stands to the left of all of Labour’s Domestic agenda. As I say though after the next election (by which time it is likely that Iraq will be subsiding as an issue) and shortly after that (probably) Blair will be gone and Borwn will probably be leader and while polices will not change much, the style of leadership and that leaderships concern for cementing its grassroots  support will be very different.

This will all leave Kennedy will loses on the right where traditional LibDem supporters could gravitate to the Conservatives and at the same time he will probably witness much of the Leftwing Middle Class and Antiwar vote behind a Brown lead “LABOUR” Party.    
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #109 on: June 17, 2004, 11:07:55 AM »

What ever happened to Michael Meadowcroft and the remnants of the Liberal Party? You know, the Liberals who refused to see how a merger with the Social Democrats would benefit true liberalism.

They've got the odd counciller here and there, and come second in Liverpool-West Derby every General Election.
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