Term Limits Amendment

[MasterJedi]

Term Limits Amendment

Section 1
Subsection 1
1. No person shall be elected to the office of Senator more than two consecutive terms, or during the four months after reaching his term limit, whether for the same District or Region, or for different ones.

2. No person shall be elected to the office of President or Vice-President twice in any two consecutive general elections, or during the six months after reaching his term limit

Subsection 2
1. On Clause One, Section One, Article Two of the Atlasian Constitution shall read as follows:
"The executive power shall be vested in the President of the Republic of Atlasia. He shall be elected with a Vice President for a term of approximately six months.

Section Two
1. Persons currently holding office shall be affected by this Amendment with respect to the number of consecutive terms already completed insofar as it shall affect their candidacy at the next scheduled election.

Section Three
1. In case a Senator is elected by special election, or appointed by a Governor, if the length of time from his swearing in to his ceasing of functions shall be longer than half of the term, it shall count as one term for effects of this amendment. If the length of time from his swearing in to his ceasing of functions shall be shorter than half of the term, it shall not count for the purposes of this amendment.

2. In case someone is selected to the office of Vice President by the Senate in case of a Vacancy, if the length of time from his swearing in to his ceasing of functions shall be longer than half of the term, it shall count as one term for effects of this amendment. If the length of time from his swearing in to his ceasing of functions shall be shorter than half of the term, it shall not count for the purposes of this amendment.

3. In case someone arises to the office of President by means of a vacancy,  if the length of time from his swearing in to his ceasing of functions shall be longer than half of the term, it shall count as one term for effects of this amendment. If the length of time from his swearing in to his ceasing of functions shall be shorter than half of the term, it shall not count for the purposes of this amendment.
____________________________________________________________

Sponsor: Sen. Bono

[TomC]

Question: It's covered if it's less than half or more than half the term, but what if is exactly half of the term? For example, Bono and HAwk's half-terms: one term for the purposes of term limits or not one term?

[© tweed]

I oppose this confusing fascism.

[Bono]

Question: It's covered if it's less than half or more than half the term, but what if is exactly half of the term? For example, Bono and HAwk's half-terms: one term for the purposes of term limits or not one term?

Good thinking. I'll can carve an amendment to fix that up, but could someone with more experience writing laws(m,ine comes out a bit cumsy, I think Peter Bell for helping me write this) give me a hand.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

I'm not in favor of addressing Senate and Presidential term limits in the same amendment, especially given the lack of reelected Presidents so far.  I'm even less in favor of changing the length of the Presidential term in the same amendment.  So I'm going to propose the following amendment to the Term Limits Amendment to dump what Bono proposed and replace it with:

Senate Term Limits Amendment

The following shall be added as Article I Section 9 of the Constitution:

Section 9: Term Limits

1. No person shall be elected or appointed to the office of Senator after the adoption of this section who will have served in the Senate 238 or more days in the year prior to the date of his taking office.

2. A Senator who resigns his seat or is expelled from his seat shall for purposes of clause 1 of this section, be deemed to be serving in the Senate until what would have been the end of his term absent such resignation or expulsion.

I've reworded the provisions that apply to the Senate to avoid some potential chicanery involving resignations to avoid being tagged by term limits.  The reason for 238 days is that full Senate terms are 17 to 19 weeks depending on how the timing goes and two 17 week terms would be 238 days.

[MasterJedi]

I'll just say now I'll be voting against this whole bill so I'll just vote against Ernest's amendment as well (no offense) just so the whole thing fails easier.

[Colin]

I would like to state that I am opposed to this bill. The main reason is not that I want to stay in the Senate forever or I'm just a silly elitist who sees the Senate as his own private club. I am opposed because of the derth of good candidates in Atlasia.

We currently have trouble finding good people for cabinet positions, Justices, Governors, and even the Senate. In regions like the Pacific and my own region, the Northeast, there are maybe 10 active participants in Atlasia. Out of those most are currently either holding office or do not want to run for Senate.

In the Pacific their were so few people available to run for the Senate for several weeks I thought that it would be a completely open race with now officially declared candidates running thankfully though two highly skilled, intellegent and active candidates have been found to run for the seat.

Much as with calls to enlarge the Senate or to convene an upper house of congress term limits for Senators cannot come about until we have a much more active populace and one were there will be more candidates willing to step up to run for the Senate.

[The Duke]

As representative of my Region, I must say that it is against our interests to see this bill pass.  We have a small population, and have a hard time fielding candidates.  We don't need that process made any harder.

[Bono]

I would like to state that I am opposed to this bill. The main reason is not that I want to stay in the Senate forever or I'm just a silly elitist who sees the Senate as his own private club. I am opposed because of the derth of good candidates in Atlasia.

We currently have trouble finding good people for cabinet positions, Justices, Governors, and even the Senate. In regions like the Pacific and my own region, the Northeast, there are maybe 10 active participants in Atlasia. Out of those most are currently either holding office or do not want to run for Senate.

In the Pacific their were so few people available to run for the Senate for several weeks I thought that it would be a completely open race with now officially declared candidates running thankfully though two highly skilled, intellegent and active candidates have been found to run for the seat.

Much as with calls to enlarge the Senate or to convene an upper house of congress term limits for Senators cannot come about until we have a much more active populace and one were there will be more candidates willing to step up to run for the Senate.

Colin, as long as the same old gang (to use a portugese expression, the Reumatic Brigade) keeps running again and again to the same positions, no new faces are ever going to try and run because it would be a sacrificial lamb against a powerful incumbent.

[MasterJedi]

I would like to state that I am opposed to this bill. The main reason is not that I want to stay in the Senate forever or I'm just a silly elitist who sees the Senate as his own private club. I am opposed because of the derth of good candidates in Atlasia.

We currently have trouble finding good people for cabinet positions, Justices, Governors, and even the Senate. In regions like the Pacific and my own region, the Northeast, there are maybe 10 active participants in Atlasia. Out of those most are currently either holding office or do not want to run for Senate.

In the Pacific their were so few people available to run for the Senate for several weeks I thought that it would be a completely open race with now officially declared candidates running thankfully though two highly skilled, intellegent and active candidates have been found to run for the seat.

Much as with calls to enlarge the Senate or to convene an upper house of congress term limits for Senators cannot come about until we have a much more active populace and one were there will be more candidates willing to step up to run for the Senate.

Colin, as long as the same old gang (to use a portugese expression, the Reumatic Brigade) keeps running again and again to the same positions, no new faces are ever going to try and run because it would be a sacrificial lamb against a powerful incumbent.

So you'd rather have nobody in the Senate in the Pacific and possibly the Northeast?

[Gabu]

Colin, as long as the same old gang (to use a portugese expression, the Reumatic Brigade) keeps running again and again to the same positions, no new faces are ever going to try and run because it would be a sacrificial lamb against a powerful incumbent.

I think a bigger problem is that we don't even really have any new faces, let alone new faces who would want to run.  This might be a good idea if we had a constant influx of bright and talented people and maybe five hundred or a thousand or so active members, but I'm not really sure that this is a good idea as it is right now.

[jokerman]

I must concur with Gabu.  This bill is not feasable with our level of membership.

[Democratic Hawk]

I most vehemenently disagree with this Term Limit Amendment. Personally, I think the idea of term limits is coercive and goes against the grain of our democratic ideals. I certainly think that it would be a loss to Atlasia if any good and effective President or Senator was prohibited from seeking another term of office by any statutory or consitutional term limit. It is for the electorate to decide whether or not any incumbent President or Senator running for re-election continues to hold office

Not to mention it's unfeasibility given the number of active members. And on that, I'm in agreement with the sentiments already expressesd

I'm in agreement with the PPT MasterJedi. I urge the Senate to reject this bill, and any proposed amendments to it, to give it one hell of a 'Nay'

Dave 'Hawk'

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

I'm not in favor of the sentiment that says one should refuse to improve a bad bill because then it might pass.  Besides, it's counterproductive. since there is absolutely nothing that prevents the improved legislation from being offered as a separate bill.  That is why I urge fellow Senators who are against the idea of term limits at all to support my amendment to limit the proposed amendment to the single narrow topic of Senatorial term limits instead of the melange of Senatorial term limits, Presidential term limits and change in the length of a Presidential term that it now is.

[MasterJedi]

I'm not in favor of the sentiment that says one should refuse to improve a bad bill because then it might pass.  Besides, it's counterproductive. since there is absolutely nothing that prevents the improved legislation from being offered as a separate bill.  That is why I urge fellow Senators who are against the idea of term limits at all to support my amendment to limit the proposed amendment to the single narrow topic of Senatorial term limits instead of the melange of Senatorial term limits, Presidential term limits and change in the length of a Presidential term that it now is.

That's not the reason I wasn't planning on voting for it. I don't think it'll pass anyway it's just that voting Nay twice is fine anyway.

[CheeseWhiz]

Colin, as long as the same old gang (to use a portugese expression, the Reumatic Brigade) keeps running again and again to the same positions, no new faces are ever going to try and run because it would be a sacrificial lamb against a powerful incumbent.

I think a bigger problem is that we don't even really have any new faces, let alone new faces who would want to run.  This might be a good idea if we had a constant influx of bright and talented people and maybe five hundred or a thousand or so active members, but I'm not really sure that this is a good idea as it is right now.

Gabu, I definitely agree.  Besides, everyone gets tired of being in their position after awhile.  I mean, I don't even know if this job is interesting enough to try for a second term

[MasterJedi]

I hereby open up the vote on this amendment to the amendment. Please vote Aye, Nay or Abstain.

Senate Term Limits Amendment

The following shall be added as Article I Section 9 of the Constitution:

Section 9: Term Limits

1. No person shall be elected or appointed to the office of Senator after the adoption of this section who will have served in the Senate 238 or more days in the year prior to the date of his taking office.

2. A Senator who resigns his seat or is expelled from his seat shall for purposes of clause 1 of this section, be deemed to be serving in the Senate until what would have been the end of his term absent such resignation or expulsion.

[CheeseWhiz]

Abstain.

[MasterJedi]

Nay

This is just because I don't feel like changing something I'll vote against anyway which I'm pretty sure will fail.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

Aye

[Jake]

Nay

[Gabu]

EDIT: Abstain.

[Colin]

Aye

[Bono]

Aye
It's a good compromise.

[The Dowager Mod]

Aye.