Elimination of Selective Service & Conscription Bill

[MasterJedi]

Elimination of Selective Service & Conscription Act

1. The Selective Service is hereby eliminated.
2. No Atlasian citizen shall be involuntarily required to join the Atlasian Military.
________________________________________________________

Sponsor: Sen. MasterJedi

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Great bill.

[Jake]

Horrible legislation, not in the least because a draft can be supremely necessary if we need to raise large numbers of troops quickly. Resolving never to use a draft unless absolutely necessary is one thing, but removing our ability to even use one is just non-sensical.

[The Dowager Mod]

There are times of national emergency when the need to institute the draft is paramount and it should be kept as an option.

[MasterJedi]

Horrible Bill, I only introduced it because some people wanted me to. This would screw us over if there's ever some big war that if we'd lose we're gone. People are generally wusses and wouldn't want to fight and would hide. This would help us pretect our country if we were in extreme danger if it fails.

[nclib]

Great bill.

Agreed.

[Bono]

Horrible legislation, not in the least because a draft can be supremely necessary if we need to raise large numbers of troops quickly. Resolving never to use a draft unless absolutely necessary is one thing, but removing our ability to even use one is just non-sensical.

IF there's the need, the senate will just pass a new law saying it's allowed. It's not like they haven't done so before.

[Jake]

Yes, but the Senate will also lack the prior information Selective Service gives them. You think China or Russia or whoever else is going to pause a war for a month to allow us to collect information that allows us to have a draft?

[Bono]

Yes, but the Senate will also lack the prior information Selective Service gives them. You think China or Russia or whoever else is going to pause a war for a month to allow us to collect information that allows us to have a draft?

If we can't get volunteers in that kind of a war, we deserve to lose.

[Emsworth]

Conscription imposes involuntary servitude on individuals. It forces them to risk their lives, and to inflict death on others, against their wills. It is nothing more than the legalized abduction of free citizens, and is in my opinion entirely unjustified.

I strongly advocate the passage of this legislation.

[Ebowed]

I support this bill.

[Colin]

I am against this bill. Although I would never support a reinstating of the draft I feel that we should keep the option open for situations of paramount national security or when large numbers of troops are needed in a short period of time.

I completely agree with Senator Jake's position on this bill and I am currently not in favour of such a resolution.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

The question is tho, does the current Selective Service System really give us anything all that useful should a draft ever be necessary?  A list compiled from driver's licenses and income tax returns is likely to be much more complete than the current list we don't do anything with.

I can see making modifications to Selective Service, but tossing it out entirely is not a good idea in my opinion.

[CheeseWhiz]

Conscription imposes involuntary servitude on individuals. It forces them to risk their lives, and to inflict death on others, against their wills. It is nothing more than the legalized abduction of free citizens, and is in my opinion entirely unjustified.

I strongly advocate the passage of this legislation.

^^^^^

[Jake]

Conscription imposes involuntary servitude on individuals. It forces them to risk their lives, and to inflict death on others, against their wills. It is nothing more than the legalized abduction of free citizens, and is in my opinion entirely unjustified.

I strongly advocate the passage of this legislation.

Now kids, let's board the train to libertarian land where peace and justice reign and wars are never necessary.

[Emsworth]

Now kids, let's board the train to libertarian land where peace and justice reign and wars are never necessary.

I have never suggested that wars will never be necessary. I have merely claimed that if they are fought, they should be fought by volunteers alone.

I do not see how one can justify the theory that the government should be able to force one person to give up his life in order to defend another.

[Jake]

Because occasionally, it's necessary to preserve the government and most importantly, the nation. An all volunteer military sounds nice, but if we needed to fight a World War Two style war today, we wouldn't have the manpower to defend ourselves sufficiently without a draft. Blocking "involuntary servitude" seems like a nice idea, but it breaks down when you consider reality.

[Gabu]

In theory I would like to completely and totally abolish the draft, but the sad truth of the matter is that, very seldom, wars crop up that require a ton of manpower, and without the draft, you run into the free-rider problem: everyone agrees that the war is necessary and important, but everyone thinks that everyone else should be the one to go and fight it because they don't want to risk going themselves.

Therefore, I cannot support a full abolition of the draft.

[Democratic Hawk]

Elimination of Selective Service & Conscription Act

1. The Selective Service is hereby eliminated.
2. No Atlasian citizen shall be involuntarily required to join the Atlasian Military.
________________________________________________________

Sponsor: Sen. MasterJedi

Given some of the sentiments echoed so far, perhaps this Bill ought to be redrafted along the lines of Selective Service and Conscription Modification Act

1. The Selective Service is hereby modified
2. No Atlasian citizen shall be involuntary required to join the Atlasian Military unless in times of national emergency

I still see a problem with this, however, if we have insufficient numbers in the military (i.e. voluntary service men and women), should circumstances occur, which require compulsory conscription we risk being ill-prepared

I can't of course table this amendment, but, nevertheless, it might be a reasonable compromise

I'm a firm believer that one volunteer equals ten pressed men [sic]. There are, however, cases when the national interest must take precedence over the individual's right to choose whether to enlist or not. Sadly, there will be occasions when refusal to join our military is simply not an option

Dave

[MasterJedi]

I hereby open up the final vote on this bill. Please vote Aye, Nay or Abstain.

Elimination of Selective Service & Conscription Act

1. The Selective Service is hereby eliminated.
2. No Atlasian citizen shall be involuntarily required to join the Atlasian Military.

[MasterJedi]

Nay

[Colin]

Nay

[Peter]

Given some of the sentiments echoed so far, perhaps this Bill ought to be redrafted along the lines of Selective Service and Conscription Modification Act

1. The Selective Service is hereby modified
2. No Atlasian citizen shall be involuntary required to join the Atlasian Military unless in times of national emergency

I find this to be an unnecessary comprimise. Our Constitution already places limits on the use of the draft:

No person shall be compelled to serve the government outside of the Republic of Atlasia except in times of War so declared by the Senate, save in compliance with a contract to perform such services; And no person under the age of eighteen years shall be required to serve the government in the armed forces of the Republic of Atlasia., Article VI, Clause 7

Only those who have enlisted can be made to serve outside Atlasia, except in times of War so declared by the Senate. This means that the Vietnam draft would have been unconstitutional, and so would a draft for Iraq right now.

Also, "national emergency" could cover a lot or only a little, I think more specificity is needed so that the true intent of this body is conveyed.

I must however agree with many of my esteemed colleagues and state that full abolition of the draft is not desirable for the many reasons they state. I will however support the type of sensible modifications that the Senator for the Midwest Region suggests.
I vote:

Nay

[The Dowager Mod]

Nay.

[CheeseWhiz]

Yea.