Day 35: Chile

[they don't love you like i love you]

http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/ci.html

Discuss.

[Bono]

The only South american country where I would consider living.

[Cubby]

They keep electing socialists, because we illegally interfered with their soverignity due to that jerk Kissinger. Its the same thing that happened in Iran, the Republican party thinks it can just install whatever gov't it likes best. The failure of that policy can either be resolved peacefully (Chile since 1989) or violently (Iran 1979-1989, 2005-).

[ag]

The only South american country where I would consider living.

You might find out that it is a) fairly boring - unless you are very much into nature - and b) somewhat egalitarian (by Latin American standards), which, I guess, is not to your liking. While it is indeed in very good shape, I don't think it is the best place for an expat in search of interesting and/or comfortable experience (though, it might indeed be an improvement on South Carolina on both counts ).

Remember, when you are choosing a place to live, you are not choosing a country, but rather a smallish part of it. Nor you are choosing the life of an average citizen, but rather the life of your own. Even within a - dirty, chaotic, poor, ugly, dangerous, etc. - Mexico City, you can find a nice first-world city the size of Toronto.  Just last week I was showing off Mexico City to a job candidate, whose other options are to go to Michigan or to Prague (academic market is very international), and I am happy to say that we are still in contention even on the quality of life issue (of course, I cheated and chose the neighborhoods to show carefully - but then I would have enough of nice places to show to give a weeklong tour without showing any of the downside).

To sum up, when you are making statements like this you, mainly, show - let me put it nicely - lack of life experience.  Still, Chile is indeed a very nice country in good shape, both politically and economically, so anything I've said is not to be taken as disparaging it.

[??????????]

I'd be alright if Pinochet was still in charge.

[Bono]

The only South american country where I would consider living.

You might find out that it is a) fairly boring - unless you are very much into nature -

I'm a nice homeboy. I don't need much to entertain myself, and I'd prefer a quitet place, if any. That's why I set it apart of other lation americna countries, where the party spirit is much more prevalent.

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It's not like I go out of my way to promote inequality. That may be a good thing, less criminality. I don't care if equality happens to exist, I just don't like government enforced equality.

And I don't live in south Carolina, I live in Portugal.

[minionofmidas]

I occasionally hear news here about unrest in the Mapuche areas ... and sort of a grand coalition of all parties to keep the Mapuche down. Really quite a racist place by the sound of these reports, but can some South American fill me in with more details?

[they don't love you like i love you]

some South American

You might as well just say YoMartin, I think that's all we have.

[minionofmidas]

some South American

You might as well just say YoMartin, I think that's all we have.

ag?

(Hates flood control --- hates flood control --- hates flood control --- tears limbs of next door neighbor to relieve aggression --- doesn't particularly like flood control)

[they don't love you like i love you]

Mexico isn't in South America. Although there's a pretty good chance he knows more about it.

[minionofmidas]

Mexico isn't in South America. Although there's a pretty good chance he knows more about it.

Amend my previous statement to "Latin America".

[ag]

I'm a nice homeboy. I don't need much to entertain myself, and I'd prefer a quitet place, if any. That's why I set it apart of other lation americna countries, where the party spirit is much more prevalent.

In that case you should love Uruguay - by all accounts, the quietest place on the continent. Also stable, homogenous and fairly wealthy. Montevideo also has the reputation of being the most sedate and boring place on earth, leaving Santiago far behind on this count

And sorry for the SC/ Portugal mishap.

[ag]

I occasionally hear news here about unrest in the Mapuche areas ... and sort of a grand coalition of all parties to keep the Mapuche down. Really quite a racist place by the sound of these reports, but can some South American fill me in with more details?

Too far from my area of expertise . Wait for YoMartin

[YoMartin]

I occasionally hear news here about unrest in the Mapuche areas ... and sort of a grand coalition of all parties to keep the Mapuche down. Really quite a racist place by the sound of these reports, but can some South American fill me in with more details?

Too far from my area of expertise . Wait for YoMartin

Sorry, can´t help you either. It´s true that the political class in Chile is quite elitist (e.g., most of them attended the same private high schools, clubs, etc), even in the left. I don´t think there´s any mapuche in Congress. In any event, I don´t know what´s worse, that or the ideas of the new Bolivian (and aymara) foreign minister, who hasn´t read a book in 15 years (he says he prefers to read the wrinkles on old people´s faces...).

About where to live, for what I´ve heard Santiago is a modern, interesting city. Not really egalitarian, though. I think Buenos Aires and Montevideo are much more "democratic", in a way. Most Latin American capitol cities have informal but rigid boundaries between the rich and the poor (combined with ethnic differences too), with people in both worlds actually not having any connection at all. I wouldn´t like living in such places. About Mexico DF, I know many Argentines currently living there, and they are getting rich at incredible speed. Prosperity seems huge there. But they live surrounded by body guards, they avoid most parts of the city, etc. That´s just not for me.

[Bono]

I'm a nice homeboy. I don't need much to entertain myself, and I'd prefer a quitet place, if any. That's why I set it apart of other lation americna countries, where the party spirit is much more prevalent.

In that case you should love Uruguay - by all accounts, the quietest place on the continent. Also stable, homogenous and fairly wealthy. Montevideo also has the reputation of being the most sedate and boring place on earth, leaving Santiago far behind on this count

And sorry for the SC/ Portugal mishap.

I think I'd like the weather in Chile more.

[Platypus]

In my South American trip I hope to visit Chile, but for me the appeal is almost completely in the natural 'splendour'. It'll be nice to be in a more sedate country for a little bit after 5 or so months in Argentina and Brazil, but basically I'm planning on spending three or four days in Santiago, then winding my way up the Andes; primarily by car/bus, but also with some hiking, I hope. Anyway, I'm very much looking forward to the Chilean leg, but i'll only be able to do it if I have enough money after my time in Argentina and Brazil. If I don't, I might still head to Santiago on the way home.

[ag]

About Mexico DF, I know many Argentines currently living there, and they are getting rich at incredible speed. Prosperity seems huge there. But they live surrounded by body guards, they avoid most parts of the city, etc. That´s just not for me.

Mexico City always gets such a bad rap! The true problem is, that until 1995 it was a very safe city, however incredible this sounds. After 1995 the crime did indeed skyrocket, leading many of the long-term residents - though, by no means, all - to adopt an incredibly protected lifestyle, with bodyguards, gated communities, etc. A lot of - though, by no means, all - the expats have copied that. The fact is that crime levels in Mexico City, though high, are not that stratospheric - more like New York in the early 1990s, before the sharp improvements of the Giuliani era. It is true, that I haven't been to many of the poorer areas in this city - but that is not because I am avoiding them, but, rather, because it would take me hours to get there, and there isn't anything whatsoever for me to do there. That does not mean I am avoiding all the poor areas - I regularly go to the impoverished city center for tourist reasons, and I've never not gone anywhere that I wanted to go because I was afraid (though, there are areas where I would not go at night). Elsewhere in the city there are many neighborhoods with lively street life, very active past midnight every day. I do not have a car, I take public transit and cabs, I love walking and exploring the city, I don't have bodyguards - well, there is a doorman in my appartment building, but I doubt he can do much protectionwise - and I am still alive. Of course, there is always some risk, but there is risk involved in anything. You do have to be careful - as in most big cities - but you don't have to lock yourself up. 

[opebo]

...About Mexico DF, I know many Argentines currently living there, and they are getting rich at incredible speed.

I'm sure they were already rich.

As for Chile, it sounds better than the US of course, but I'm sure I'd much rather visit almost any other South American country first, particularly Brazil and Argentina.

[they don't love you like i love you]

As for Chile, it sounds better than the US of course

It's not. Abortion is completely illegal and they only legalized divorce less than 2 years ago.

[opebo]

As for Chile, it sounds better than the US of course

It's not. Abortion is completely illegal and they only legalized divorce less than 2 years ago.

Yes, but I'll bet the food is better..

[YoMartin]

Probably I wasn´t clear in my previous post. It´s not the people I know who have the body guards, but they live or go to places where some people do, or where people have armored cars, or live in a closed community within city limits, etc. They were quite schocked by that environment (and started asking: shouldn´t I get one of those things?). From an upper middle class perspective, I think there´s no better argument for an egalitarian income distribution than avoiding those security measures. BTW, the "explosion" of crime in Buenos Aires also happened in 1995. Another side effect of Tequila?

No, the people I know were middle class in Argentina, and, with that same qualifications and skills, they´re making five times as much money in DF (even when 1 argentine peso equaled 1 dollar), in much better jobs. Opportunities seem greater in DF than in most Latin American cities, at least for middle and upper classes.