What if Gore Won?
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  Election What-ifs? (Moderator: Dereich)
  What if Gore Won?
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Gustaf
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« Reply #25 on: January 17, 2004, 06:56:38 AM »

Lets say Al Gore won Florida and squeaked out a win in the election.  Who would the Republicans be running right now?  Would gore be popular?  What would be different?

I think Frist would be the republican frontrunner.

Hm, the question is whether the whole international situation would be different and that is very biased. I think Gore would have been under a lot of pressure initially and most likely would have attacked Afghanistan. But I'm not so sure on Iraq. And that could make the situation today rather different. I think Gore would be much less popular than Bush is right now, b/c he will either be hated by his own base or by centrist voters, regardless of what he does.

I don't think you can assume Gore would attack Afghanistan. Al Qaeda attacked us or planned to do so 6 times while Clinton was president and we never attacked Afghanistan {2/1993: Bombing of World Trade Center, 10/1993: Killing of U.S. soldiers in Somalia, 6/1996: Truck bombing at Khobar Towers barracks in Dhahran, Saudi Arabia, 9/1998: Bombing of U.S. embassies in East Africa, 12/1999: Plot to bomb millennium celebrations in Seattle foiled when customs agents arrest an Algerian smuggling explosives into the U.S., 10/2000: Bombing of the USS Cole in port in Yemen}.  Would Gore lob a missile or two? Probably. But that's not the same as what Bush did after 9/11.  

That is really biased. You can't compare any of the incidents you mention with 9/11, that is ridiculous. Do you think a Republican president would have invaded countries during the 90s, if they had been in Clinton's position? I strongly doubt that.

I do think that Bush would have responded differently to those events.

I think you're wrong. 9/11 hadn't happened. Bush was against nation building, he was essentially an isolationist before 9/11 and he wouldnät have done the things he did after that without that incident.
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Nym90
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« Reply #26 on: January 18, 2004, 02:22:50 AM »

Agreed. If the Republicans would have done things differently, then Dole in 1996 and Bush in 2000 would have both brought that up at some point during the campaign, criticizing Clinton's performance against Al Qaeda. This was not brought up by either as an issue.
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Gustaf
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« Reply #27 on: January 18, 2004, 07:06:51 AM »

Agreed. If the Republicans would have done things differently, then Dole in 1996 and Bush in 2000 would have both brought that up at some point during the campaign, criticizing Clinton's performance against Al Qaeda. This was not brought up by either as an issue.

That is actually a very good point. Times change, and that's that.
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Rococo4
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« Reply #28 on: April 01, 2004, 02:32:48 PM »

And good points I completely forgot about the ressesion which in my opinion started in the last year of the Clinton administration(Believe me I own stocks and mine started falling before Bush took office)



Stocks started to fall because of the posibility of a Bush presidency, which killed the economy 8 years before.

Thanks for the clarification, Angus.


thats crazy......the tech bubble had burst.  that didnt have anything to do with who was going to win in 2004.

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Rococo4
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« Reply #29 on: April 01, 2004, 02:33:31 PM »

I mean 2000
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opebo
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« Reply #30 on: April 01, 2004, 03:13:56 PM »

If Gore had won we'd have had a reluctant half-a----d response to terrorism, and the economy would be somewhat worse due to no tax cuts (or even tax increases).  
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Gustaf
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« Reply #31 on: April 01, 2004, 04:02:56 PM »

How come you know so much about military stuff? Just curious...
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Gustaf
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« Reply #32 on: April 01, 2004, 04:09:01 PM »

When I was about 11 or 12 I became interested in politics because I saw Clinton gut the military.  Military affairs came before even politics for me.  I still think national security is the most important issue America faces, and I've thought that since before 9/11.  So naturally, I try to know all that can be known about it.

OK.
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NHPolitico
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« Reply #33 on: April 01, 2004, 04:13:46 PM »

I scanned this and saw I never predicted a McCain butt-whipping of Gore in 2004 in the event of a Gore presidency. The GOP would have held control of Congress for all four years, there would have been furious attacks against Gore's handling of national security by the GOP in Congress and McCain would have been the spokesman and leader on that front.  People would say that McCain would make us safer than Gore would in this new era and it would be a November landslide. Jeffords would still be singing in the newly reformed Singing Senators-- Ashcroft would have beaten Carnahan in 2002. Rick Perry would be in the Senate and KBH would be governor of Texas.  Thune would be in the Senate. We'd be having serious discussions about realignment with the GOP having healthy control of the House, a near-veto-proof majorty in the Senate, and a President McCain.  I like Bush well enough, but that pseudo-reality might be tempting.
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ShapeShifter
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« Reply #34 on: April 02, 2004, 09:19:02 AM »

If Gore won - 9-11 would never had happen. Iraq would not have happen.

Assuming 9-11 had happen, Gore would be very popular because of the extreme unity the nation went through after the attacks.

I find the replies by fellow republicans to be funny in this thread. It only proves to me how partisan and polarized their mind is.
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Beefalow and the Consumer
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« Reply #35 on: April 02, 2004, 10:03:30 AM »

The idea of basing your war plan on Special Forces is discarded in favor of prolonged strategic bombing (Clark's hallmark)
(...)

I sketch out a similar scenario in the "An Al Gore Presidency" thread in this forum.  Basically,

1. Gore attemps strategic bombing in Afghanistan
2. Gore is forced to send in massive ground troops
3. US routs Taliban on ground (not difficult)
4. Peacekeeping (very difficult)  turned over to the UN
5. UN fails, Taliban returns to power
6. American weakness gives the green light to Hussein, Palestinians (and, come to think of it, Khadaffi)
7. Iraq builds up WMD and mid-range missile programs, Palesinians intensify suicide attacks on Israel
8. US and Israel discover Iraqi weapons programs, US launches Iraq invasion
9. Iraq engineers a region-wide war by drawing in Israel.
10. Rest of Gore administration is full-scale war in Middle East, collapsed US economy, and a Congress which can control all domestic policy through veto-override.

I think the Republicans, knowing that the Democrats are in complete disarray, knowing that the liberals have all flocked to the Green Party, run arch-Conservative John Ashcroft, who wins in a landslide.
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Ben.
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« Reply #36 on: April 02, 2004, 03:55:14 PM »

The idea of basing your war plan on Special Forces is discarded in favor of prolonged strategic bombing (Clark's hallmark)
(...)

I sketch out a similar scenario in the "An Al Gore Presidency" thread in this forum.  Basically,

1. Gore attemps strategic bombing in Afghanistan
2. Gore is forced to send in massive ground troops
3. US routs Taliban on ground (not difficult)
4. Peacekeeping (very difficult)  turned over to the UN
5. UN fails, Taliban returns to power
6. American weakness gives the green light to Hussein, Palestinians (and, come to think of it, Khadaffi)
7. Iraq builds up WMD and mid-range missile programs, Palesinians intensify suicide attacks on Israel
8. US and Israel discover Iraqi weapons programs, US launches Iraq invasion
9. Iraq engineers a region-wide war by drawing in Israel.
10. Rest of Gore administration is full-scale war in Middle East, collapsed US economy, and a Congress which can control all domestic policy through veto-override.

I think the Republicans, knowing that the Democrats are in complete disarray, knowing that the liberals have all flocked to the Green Party, run arch-Conservative John Ashcroft, who wins in a landslide.


Sorry but 2/3rds of the GOP think that Ashcroft is crazy!.... no no ... and i think your being way to pessimistic about what happens under gore
 
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Kghadial
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« Reply #37 on: April 02, 2004, 05:30:59 PM »

If Gore won (lets say by about 5000 votes in florida).

He would have established a congressional commision to look into possible illegal activities during the 2000 election.  In doing so they find irregularities in the "scrubbed" voter lists in Florida and eventually this leads to the jailing of Harris. When the commision reveals that their was widespread voter fraud that all connects back to Karl Rove, he is discredited and vows to completely leave politics for the Business World.

As his popularity decreases as the economy fizzles and his "jihad" against Republican voter fraud becomes silly, he fights for modest tax relief that largely goes to the middle class. As the Rs fight him to give for to the rich, he gains back a popularity ranking over fifty.

Over summer 2001, as Gore continues to notice Al Queda he sends numerous bombing runs in the country and increases aid to the Northern Alliance. Since Al Queda is taken far more seriously the FBI follows its leads and breaks up one of the four "cells" of plane crashing terrorists.

On September 11th since one of the cells in broken up, only three planes commit those attrocities.  Gore speak to the nation and explains that Al Queda is the perpertrator and that the FBI had succesfully foiled one-fourth of the plot. Gore's popularity reaches that lofy 90% like Bush's did. As the nation mourns he says that the main reason they hate us is our presence in their holy land, and our presence is caused by our need to protect our oil supply.  He calls on congress to sharply increase minimum mpg standards, and calls for a gas tax increase to pay for the war on terror.  As He goes into Afghanistan with widespread world support, he vows that they will not stop till they find osama.  

As Congress tries to stop VP Lieberman's push for a Department of Homeland Security 5 senators: Chafee, Snowe, Specter, Jeffords, and McCain all become independents to help Lieberman do so.

In the 2002 elections the Dems get a 53 seats in the senate, plus their five "independents", and control of the House. Gore's popularity stays up near 75% . An interesting outcome of the election is that half a dozen anti-war conservatives get elected to the house.

Osama is caught in late summer 2003. Gore declares "mission accomplished" .  Bush who had said that he would run again, decides to drop out of the race at this time, stating that even he thinks that president Gore is leading nobly and well, although he wishes Gore would attack Iraq.

The economy starts coming back on the rise after treading water for the first 3 years of the Gore presidency and the chorus of "me too" republican candidates is defening. Nominating Rudy Guilani the Republicans have Roy Moore thrown in their face as the Constitution party candidate.

End Result:
Gore:   50.1% of vote       413 EV
Rudy:   37% of vote       108 EV
Moore: 12% of vote       17 EV  ('bama, utah, wyoming)
Nader: minimal write in votes
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Beet
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« Reply #38 on: April 02, 2004, 05:38:00 PM »
« Edited: April 02, 2004, 06:11:49 PM by Beet »

Heres what happens under Gore. I don't have time to type a huge essay.

Jan. 20 2001... Gore begins his presidency dedicated to bipartisanship and uniting the country after the close election. He realizes he should do this because the Republicans control Congress, and he knows from the Clinton experience that he can be a more effective president by reaching out to them.

Jan. 21 2001... the counter-terrorism proposal developed at the end of the Clinton administration is implemented.

March 2001... A $1 trillion tax cut is passed. This includes incentives for corporations to develop technologies reducing America's dependence on foreign oil.

April 2001... After hearing out Congressional Republican objections to Kyoto, Gore submits a revised Kyoto protocol for re-negotiation. The plan provides for reduction of pollution emissions by G-77 nations in return for debt restructuring. This launches a new round of talks focused on the G-77 nations.

May 2001... Arafat decides to do a historic turnabout after U.S. offers new plan in the line of the Taba Egypt agreement of January 2001, plus $1bn in aid over 5 years. Sharon is still vacillating. A sharp crackdown on Hamas militants begins, throwing the West Bank into chaos. The volume of suicide bombings drops off precipitously.

July 2001... Arafat has consolidated control over the West Bank; secret meetings begin in Taba, Egypt. Suicide bombings have dropped off.

August 2001... intelligence leads to the arrests of five of the nineteen 9-11 hijackers. Five more are arrested while trying to flee the country. Evidence reveals Al-Qaida was behind yet another plot to try and attack American targets.

September 2001...The US produces evidence and testimony from 9-11 hijackers shocked to learn they were on a suicide mission. Faced with introvertible evidence, the U.N. demands the Taliban regime turn over Osama bin Laden and all members of Al Qaeda. As the scale of the planned event becomes apparent, the intelligence community goes through yet another shakeup, and counterintelligence spending continues its late-1990s surge. By the end of 2002, the counter-terror budget will have doubled.

Alan Greenspan has lowered the nominal interest rate to 3%, down 350 basis points from a year earlier. The economy begins to recover.

October 2001... After a massive manhunt, the remaining nine would-be hijackers are cornered in a Florida compound and are killed in a firefight with law enforcement. Faced with international pressure and a possible U.S.-India alliance, Musharaff withdraws support from the Taliban. Pro-taliban agents, including the military intelligence chief, are fired.

On the eve of a historic agreement between Israel's Likud government and the PA, polls show 62% of Israelis favor the Taba settlement. Likud fractures as the Nethanyahu branch of the party walks out over the deal.

November 2001... The Taliban agree to turn over Osama bin Laden and all Al Qaeda agents. OBL is given to the Pakistani army. He is immediately extradited to the U.S. The U.S. promised $3bn in reschedulement of Pakistani debt through the World Bank and mediation of the Kashmir issue.

December 2001... The arrest of OBL and hundreds of Al Qaida agents leads to the biggest intelligence bonanza since the fall of the Soviet Union. Excellent international cooperation leads to the shut-down of Al Qaida operations in over 50 countries over the next six months. The level of terrorist activity directed against the U.S. begins to fall.

Breakthrough in Kim Dae Jung's sunshine policy, supported by Gore. A special economic zone is set up near Pyongyang. 1,000 families are re-united after being separated for half a century. However, doubts soon begin to emerge on whether North Korea really dismantled its nuclear program.

Attack on the Indian parliament. The two countries come close to war until Musharaff agrees to shut down terror camps. Gore leans heavily against Musharaff here.

The collapse of Enron, shocking the nation. The Gore administration promises to vigorously pursue and prosecute corporate criminals and impose lengthy prison sentences. The SEC also begins a shake-up.

LOTR: The Fellowship of the Ring is a hit at the box office!

January 2002: It becomes apparent the Taliban regime did not provide all of the evidence, some incriminating itself. The U.S. pounds Taliban military installations and provides support to the Northern alliance. Pakistan switches support to the Northern Alliance after the Taliban call for Musharaff's overthrow. Iran, Uzbekistan, Tajikstan, and Pakistan are now all against the regime. Cut off and helpless except for humanitarian aid, this begins a long-term decline in the Taliban regime.

Israel completes withdrawal from 90% of the West Bank. Arafat's approval rating rises over 50% for the first time in years. Sharon's approval rating rises to 65%.

February 2002: Beginning of the Kashmir peace process. The PA formally recognizes Israel. A suicide bombing killing 15 outsize Sbarro's throws the entire process into doubt, but Arafat, recognizing a threat to his power, arrests and extradites those involved.

March 2002: U.S. interest rates bottom at 1.75%... the vigorous prosecution of Enron executives has been noted in other corrupt corporations such as Worldcom, Tyco, Global Crossing, etc... Gore pursues a strong dollar policy.

An internal poll shows 81% of Palestinians disapprove of suicide bombing.

May 2002: Alan Greenspan begins to raise interest rates.

June 2002: U.S. budget surplus narrows, drawing criticism from Congressional Republicans. Republicans hope to use the weak economy to help them in the November elections.

August 2002: 114 nations sign the revised Kyoto protocols, which exchanges debt reschuling and World Bank development loans for emissions reductions schedules. Thus addressing the major objection of G-77 exemption of the original agreement.

September 2002: India and Kashmir sign a historic, U.S.-brokered agreement dividing Jammu and Kashmir into predominantly Hindu Jammu and predominantly Muslim Kashmir. Musharraf and Vaypayee shake hands on the White House lawn. Kashmir, majority of the land, predominantly Muslim, will become an independent state or join with Pakistan as a de-militarized zone based on a referendum vote. Jammu will remain in India as a separate province.  

October 2002: Conservative commentator Barbara Olson published a vicious attack on the Gore administration in her new book, about how Gore didn't spend enough money on new missile defense systems. It's a hit among conservatives.

November 2002:
The U.S. economy is now accelerating quickly. Alan Greenspan has raised interest rates 350 basis points. That, combined with a strong dollar policy, sends billions of European and Asian investment dollars pouring into the U.S. Business investment surges to a 2-year high.

Gore's popularity, a solid 54%, takes Democrats into a solid lead in the Senate 53-47, and the closest House in decades, 219-214 Republican majority.

Polls reveal Gore is one of the least polarizing Presidents in 20 years. The difference in his approval between Republicans and Democrats is only 10%. 73% of Americans believe the country is "more united" and has overcome the divisiveness of the 2000 election.

December 2002: Gore, Vajpayee, and Musharaff share the Nobel Peace Prize.
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Beet
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« Reply #39 on: April 02, 2004, 05:38:19 PM »

The Dow rises to a record high at 11,900.

"Independent" commentator Bill O'Reilly is criticized by rightwing author Ann Coulter for being too liberal. O'Reilly, a noted liberal talk show host, was accused of pandering to the majority like a demagogue, but he brushed off the attacks, saying he just speaks his mind. O'Reilly recently moved from Fox to CNN. Coulter's book attacking the Gore administration fails to dent his popularity.

January 2003: In a last-minute bid to derail the peace process, Jewish extremist settlers massacre 14 Palestinian children at a local school. With the Hamas structure dismantled, there is no retaliation. The plan fails.

February 2003: A Palestinian state is declared and recognized by the U.N., achieving 56 years of dreams by Arabs living in the Levant. The Dow rises to 12,500.

North Korea admits to having a nuclear weapons program after being presented with evidence. But China and South Korea want to continue the sunshine policy. The Dow peaks at 13,000.

March 2003: With a weak European economy and competitive U.S interest rates, the dollar is now worth 1.80 euros, a record high. European investors have made a bonanza investing in wall street, and the money keeps pouring in. John Snow, however, criticized the policy, saying that the high value of the U.S. currency was hurting is trade balance. Meanwhile, the strength of the U.S. dollar is hurting China, whose currency, the yuan, is now widely seen as overvalued. While Southeast Asian exports to the U.S. surge as the dollar's value rises in relation to them, the China's exports stall.

April 2003: As China's export growth stalls, and with the U.S. looking like such an attractive investment spot, the country begins to lose foreign investment. Worldwide currency speculators begin to attack the Chinese currency. The People's Republic defends it yuan peg using its dollar reserves.

May 2003: Chinese dollar reserves have dwindled to dangerous lows, prompting a plea by Chinese premier Hu Jintao for the U.S. to act against currency speculators. However, the Gore administration replies that it requires Chinese cooperation against North Korea. In the diplomatic delay caused by this, George Soros launched a massive attack on the yuan.

June 2003: Yuan devaluation. The currency's value falls by 65% on the first day. In the subsequent months, several large banks fail, and a rush of capital flight ensues. The Dow initially falls to 11,500, but strong U.S. GDP growth sends it rocketing back up to 14,000 by the end of the year.

The U.S. Supreme Court strikes down Affirmative Action on a 5-4 vote. Writing for the majority, Sandra Day O'Connor says that the atmosphere of the country has changed enough over the last 25 years to justify overturning Bakke v. Board.

August 2003: Massive protests erupt in Chinese cities. Peter Jennings, Dan Rather, and Tom Brokaw fly to Beijing. Oil prices briefly rise, then plummet.

September 2003: With the economy collapsing, a military coup overthrows Chinese leaders. Within the next six months, Taiwan, Tibet, and Xinjiang will declare independence. Statues will fall. China will be declared a Republic.

October 2003: "flight to the dollar" mania begins to overtake world financial markets. The Dow surges to 15,000, then 16,000. Meanwhile, the strength of the U.S. dollar begins to provoke foreign envy. Fearing a bubble, Gore and Greenspan announce a plan to stabilize the value of the dollar. Over the next three months, coordinated action by world central banks will reduce the exchange rate from 1.9euros/$ to 1.4euros/$.

The US. Supreme Court rejects Osama bin Laden's appeal 9-0 in bin Laden vs. U.S. (2003). bin Laden has been convicted of ordering and conspiring for the execution of Americans and citizens of other countries. He is scheduled for execution.

November 2003: The collapse of the Chinese economy suddenly pulled the carpet out from under world oil demand. Oil prices plummet from $22/barrel to $14/barrel, cushoning a pullback in the Dow Jones industrial average, which ends the year at 14,500.

December 2003: Low oil prices and stagnant growth, as well as his heavy-handed dealings, cut into Russian President Vladimir Putin's popularity on the eve of the March 2004 presidential election. A new, liberal party, led by leading reformers of the early 1990's, begins to resurge. Saudi Arabia and other oil-producing nations also feel the pinch.

Without Chinese support, North Korea can no longer support is pathetic economy without U.S. aid. It agrees to dismantle its plutonium and uranium nuclear programs in exchange for U.S. aid. Gore demands that U.N. weapons inspectors be given access to North Korea.

January 2004: Iran is thrown into crisis as its elected prime minister, Khatami, resigns over a new vote-rigging law. The Gore administration praises Khatami, and plans by the Iranian government to support itself by stirring up anti-Americanism fail. As oil prices bottom at $13/barrel, the financial pinch sends Iranian students into the streets chanting pro-Khatami, and pro-AMERICAN messages. The world is shocked at this new, indigenious, Islamic movement.

North Korea reveals that Pakistan supplied it with nuclear arms. Musharaff, realizing his ass is once again on the line, rounds up and confines Pakistani nuclear scientist Qadeer Khan.

February 2004: Brutality by the ruling Iranian theocracy shocks the country, and students are joined by workers, professionals, farmers, and women, in a broad anti-government coalition. Oil prices briefly spike, but it's not enough to help Putin, who loses 46%-52% to Irina Khakmadov, in the following month's presidential elections. Khakmadov promises to institute greater autonomy and human rights in Chechnya and greater cooperation between Russia and NATO.

The U.S. and Pakistan are on talks about what to do with Qadeer Khan and about 100 other members of the Sharif government of the 1990's that supplied nuclear technology to North Korea and Libya. The extent of the ring is still going on. It is revealed that one of the Pakistani nuclear scientists was sympathetic to Al Qaeda, and was going to transfer a "briefcase nuke" to an Al Qaeda agent in Northwest Pakistan in April 2003. However, thanks to the arrest of Osama bin Laden and hundreds of his supporters, and the crackdown on the Al Qaeda network in Afghanistan, the transfer was never made. The plan had been the smuggle the bomb into New York City on September 11, 2004, and detonate it, killing about 10 million Americans.

Shocked at these discoveries, the U.S. intelligence community undergoes its largest overhaul since WW2 in order to improve its performance. Gore proposes $20 billion in spending for port security, which will come out of the $3 trillion budget surplus for FY 2004-05.

March 2004: The Iranian government collapses. The Ayatollah resigns. Jimmy Carter gloats. Shock waves are sent through the Islamic world.

April 2004: A worldwide poll shows that 72% of people in 45 different countries have a positive view of Americans, and view America as a world leader. British and Iranians have the most positive views of Americans.

May 2004: The U.S. unemployment rate falls to 3.9%, a three and half year low. Over 3 million jobs have been created in the Gore presidency.

June 2004: Osama bin Laden is executed. The Dow climbs to back to 16,000, where it hovers for the rest of the near. The Nasdaq hits 2,800. The S&P 500 hits 1650. Polls show 65% of Americans feel the country is headed in the right direction. Gore's approval rating hits an all-time high of 70%.

November 2004: With a booming economy and a President who worked with Congressional Republicans, and a dramatic improvement in America's position on the world stage during his Presidency, Americans are feeling more united and confident than at any time since the wake of the Second World War. Despite facing John McCain, Gore wins all but Utah, Wyoming, Idaho, South Dakota, North Dakota, Nebraska, Kansas, Oklahoma, Alaska, Alabama, and South Carolina. He comes the first Democrat to win over 50% of the popular vote since Jimmy Carter, and the first to win over 400 electoral votes since Lyndon Johnson. Democrats also take control of the House of Representatives. Republicans can take comfort, however, in that they still control the Supreme Court, where 7 of the 9 appointees are Republicans. Therefore, not all three branches of government are in the hands of the same party.

December 2004: Todd Beamer, Rachiel Corrie, and the 507th U.S. Army maintenance convoy spend celebrate Christmas at home, with their families.
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Beet
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« Reply #40 on: April 02, 2004, 05:47:11 PM »

Alright I guess I do.
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Bleeding heart conservative, HTMLdon
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« Reply #41 on: April 02, 2004, 06:44:07 PM »

Oh gag me.
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Beet
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« Reply #42 on: April 03, 2004, 01:40:58 AM »
« Edited: April 03, 2004, 01:42:48 AM by Beet »

1) Arafat is a politician above anything else and he goes with the flow. After the U.S.-Israeli position in early 2001 against Taba there was no way he could reach a settlement that he could find acceptable. So he fell back on basing his support as a "defiant figurehead" and let the Hamas/Al Aqsa martyrs with a free hand for fear of starting a civil war. If the U.S. had leaned heavily on Israel to keep Taba a politicial potentiality the benefits to crackdown and consolidation of his power in the West Bank would have been substantial.

2) This attack could have been prevented according to testimony before the 9-11 commission. Implementation of the original counter-terror plan by an experienced administration may have done that.

3) The Taliban immediately denounced the 9-11 attacks and offered to turn over Osama in September 2001 contingent on evidence OBL being provided he was behind the attacks. We did not want to provide this evidence for fear of compromising our security sources. Had some of the 9-11 hijackers been captured, we would not have had to compromise secret intelligence sources in order to provide information.

4) The Pakistanis give a hell of a lot more about Kashmir, a 50 year old national scar, than the Taliban, which they view as a hoodlum of kids they created in the 1990's for convenience. Yes they would prefer the Taliban ruling in Afghanistan but that doesn't mean they have to support them if it will cost them advantages/resolution of the Kashmir issue.

5) The P/E ratios of the Nasdaq at 2,800 would still be way lower than the 2000... and even in reality, P/E ratios never really returned to historical averages at the low point of 2002.
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dunn
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« Reply #43 on: April 03, 2004, 03:39:21 AM »

whishfull thinking
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opebo
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« Reply #44 on: April 03, 2004, 03:46:35 AM »


Yeah, definitely.  I don't care who's president militant islam (which is just a politically correct way of saying islam) is going to be making war on us for the rest of our lives.
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« Reply #45 on: April 04, 2004, 09:37:09 PM »

If Gore had won in 2000 then he would be in deep trouble now.  He wouldn't have spurred the recovery with tax cuts.  He probably would have bombed the hell out of the Taliban, but wouldn't have gone in on the ground.  He would probably have faced  a tough primary challenge from John Edwards.    I'm thinking that any number of Republicans would be chomping at the bit to challenge him:  Dubya, Jeb (if Dubya didn't), Frist, McCain, Guliani or Pataki.  The last two would be very tough considering 9/11.
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« Reply #46 on: April 04, 2004, 09:42:22 PM »

Remember that Gore would have to take the FULL brunt of blame for 9/11.  The 9/11 commision would be all over his ass right now and Clarke would be investigated for not taking the threat seriously.
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A-Max
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« Reply #47 on: April 04, 2004, 09:47:34 PM »

Good point!  9/11 and the recession both would be completely on his shoulders.  We would probably see another one of those Oval office speeches that say something like "I will not seek nor will I accept the nomination that won't be offered anyhow"
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OSR STANDS WITH PALESTINE
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« Reply #48 on: October 11, 2017, 05:53:38 AM »

We’d all be dead
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MAINEiac4434
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« Reply #49 on: October 11, 2017, 09:10:05 AM »

STOP REPLYING TO 13-YEAR-OLD THREADS
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