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Poll
Question: Would you consider votting which independent candiates?
Wyatt Chesney   -6 (25%)
Daniel Imperato   -0 (0%)
Aaron Russo   -0 (0%)
Jim Gilchrist   -4 (16.7%)
None   -14 (58.3%)
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Total Voters: 24

Author Topic: Viable Centrist Third Option in 2008  (Read 2623 times)
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« on: May 15, 2006, 03:41:32 pm »
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There has not been a viable third option since Ross Perot ran in 1996. Now there are a number of campaigns, such as Wyatt Chesney http://www.chesney2008.tz4.com, who is seeking the REform Party nomination http://www.reformparty.org/phpbb, as well as Daniel Imperato http://www.imperatobrooks.com/imperatobrooks/
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« Reply #1 on: May 15, 2006, 03:54:51 pm »
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http://www.radicalmiddle.com/x_avlon_2008.htm
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« Reply #2 on: May 15, 2006, 07:35:56 pm »
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Jim Gilchrist is not a viable "centrist" option. First of all he's not a centrist. He's as far right as they come. I supported him in the D48 special election so he'd be a good voice in Congress for border/immigration issues. He didn't win but ran a good third party campagin.
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« Reply #3 on: May 15, 2006, 07:41:36 pm »
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Russo and Gilchrist are certainly not mdoerates.  Chesney is, and he's an interesting fellow.  I am not sure who Imperato is.
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« Reply #4 on: May 15, 2006, 08:13:28 pm »
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Jim Gilchrist is not a viable "centrist" option. First of all he's not a centrist. He's as far right as they come. I supported him in the D48 special election so he'd be a good voice in Congress for border/immigration issues. He didn't win but ran a good third party campagin.

Gilchrist is an interesting figure.  Very conservative on border issues, but also very protectionist and into class warfare politics. 

Sort of like Scoonie from a Republican angle.
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« Reply #5 on: May 15, 2006, 10:19:24 pm »
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Chesney:
- Supports cracking down a illegal immigration through the economic pressuring of Mexico.  I agree, as long as the pressure includes pushing US companies further into Mexico to create a job base in their country while increasing US profits through cheaper labor.
- Supports giving businesses that do not outsource jobs a 10% tax benefit. I disagree.  We should not reward nor punish companies for being international.
- Supports a 10% tax penalty on all companies that make a profit from the exploitation of fossil fuels. How do they define explotation?  In general, I would have to disagree since like all commodities, oil should be market driven.
- Supports large scale funding and research for renewable energy production and environmental protection. I agree in principal, but it would have to depend on what their proposal is.  We need to have a Manhattan Project style for hydrogen development.
- Though he is openly pro-choice and pro-gay, Wyatt strongly opposes all federal intervention in such social issues implying that they are for the states to decide.  I agree to a point.  There should be a national minimum standard, and then the states can expand on those any way they wish.
- Wyatt supports protection of the Second Ammendment and opposes gun control other than that of background checks.  I disagree, but it's not a major issue.
- Supports installing a PAYGO government spending system to replace the "Borrow and Spend".  I have no problem with that.  Throw in Presidential Line Item Veto, and you've got a deal.
- Supports cutting taxes for the middle and lower classes.  I disagree.  Cut taxes for everyone.
- Opposes NAFTA as well as CAFTA. He sees them as "tools for outsourcing" that ultimently hurt American employment.  One of my biggest gripes with Perot.  We should have free trade with most nations in the world.  Anything short of that is borderline isolationism.


Imperato (he has a lot of issues on his website, so I will post the first item and then discuss the whole group):
- Increase trade agreements with other foreign nations and trade organizations.  I agree with most of his positions on foreign trade.
- Government subsidized pre-fab housing developments.  I'm fairly neutral on government housing.  If the government is to provide housing when the time calls for it, pre-fab houses are a much better option compared to trailers or custom-built houses.
- Institute mandatory labor unions provisions within our trade agreements (NAFTA, CAFTA, etc.) with other nations ( Mexico, Central & South American countries). I disagree.  We do not need to empower such a tiny group of the US labor pool over the majority.  Large unions are a dying breed and are woefully inefficient.
- Establish better relations with foreign nations so that the United States is seen as an ally of the world.  I agree with most of this.  It basically mirrors Bush's agenda.
- Fostering a culture that provides for religious tolerance.  Again I agree, and that this mirrors Bush's policies.
- Institute a disciplined plan to balance the budget.  I am all for a balanced budget and accounting reform.  He talks about manipulating the trade level, which goes against my free-trade beliefs.  I do agree that better education and protections for the public in regards to credit cards are important.
- Government Jobs program that promotes American jobs, consumer safety, and environmental protection. I have no real issues with his proposals.  I'm just curious what his views on free trade are.
- Developing the use of alternative energy resources. I agree with these.
- Leading the world towards democracy by example not by force.  I agree with all except for his "exit strategy" comment.  It sounds as if he wants to cut and run. He would need to explain this one to me.

(Ok, I can keep going on, but it's getting late.  Look here for additional comments tomorrow.)



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« Reply #6 on: May 16, 2006, 10:37:01 am »
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I won't be voting for them.
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« Reply #7 on: May 16, 2006, 10:57:03 am »
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I'd rather not elect a centrist. We already have one (if not a leftist) in George W Bush.

Now, I'm certainly open to a more libertarian candidate who supports less government.
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« Reply #8 on: May 16, 2006, 11:36:01 am »
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I'd rather not elect a centrist. We already have one (if not a leftist) in George W Bush.

Now, I'm certainly open to a more libertarian candidate who supports less government.

This is true. Anyone who calls Bush a 'conservative', at least on economics, needs to have their eyes checked.

What we need is a candidate who combines an aggressive foreign policy with true fiscal responsibility (cutting where needed, disapproving of pork, etc) on the domestic side, who leaves social issues for the most part to the states. Too bad such a person would be unelectable even if nominated.
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« Reply #9 on: May 16, 2006, 11:45:58 am »
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There is always a viable centrist option in every presidential election - the nominee of the Democratic Party.
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« Reply #10 on: May 16, 2006, 02:52:37 pm »
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Russo and Gilchrist are certainly not mdoerates.  Chesney is, and he's an interesting fellow.  I am not sure who Imperato is.

I support Wyatt Chesney, but I am certainly familiar with Daniel Imperato. He's got a pretty unique background as well. He has been an international businessman for the last 30 years and is the owner of the Palm Beach Imperials of the ABA. His VP, Webster Brooks was behind the Draft Powell campaign in 1996 I believe.

Imperato/Brooks seems to be ahead of Chesney's campaign thus far in terms of publicity and I would assume fundraising and name recognition(on a non internet political junkie level they're both nobodies still). Hopefully Wyatt will get a new website up soon. If you guys have any questions for him, I'm sure he'd be willing to come over on here.
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« Reply #11 on: May 16, 2006, 04:48:02 pm »
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None of them.  I want a right-winger in 2008, like Allen.
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« Reply #12 on: May 16, 2006, 05:01:46 pm »
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Russo and Gilchrist are certainly not mdoerates.  Chesney is, and he's an interesting fellow.  I am not sure who Imperato is.

I support Wyatt Chesney, but I am certainly familiar with Daniel Imperato. He's got a pretty unique background as well. He has been an international businessman for the last 30 years and is the owner of the Palm Beach Imperials of the ABA. His VP, Webster Brooks was behind the Draft Powell campaign in 1996 I believe.

Imperato/Brooks seems to be ahead of Chesney's campaign thus far in terms of publicity and I would assume fundraising and name recognition(on a non internet political junkie level they're both nobodies still). Hopefully Wyatt will get a new website up soon. If you guys have any questions for him, I'm sure he'd be willing to come over on here.

I would love it if he'd consider dropping by.  I'm certainly looking for a viable third-party vote if the 2008 candidates turn out as badly as in 2004.  Besides, it's always nice to have politicians around.
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« Reply #13 on: May 16, 2006, 07:09:30 pm »
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I'll try to have him post here, but you might is well just talk to him on the Reform Party Forum. http://www.reformparty.org/phpbb
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« Reply #14 on: May 16, 2006, 07:21:28 pm »
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I'll try to have him post here, but you might is well just talk to him on the Reform Party Forum. http://www.reformparty.org/phpbb

For some reason, that does not load on my machine.
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« Reply #15 on: May 16, 2006, 07:34:55 pm »
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Try this one:
http://reformparty.org/phpbb/index.php?sid=733bc2680cc41eb88d7b3804dfda7fb0

If neither works, hopefully he'll come over here!
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« Reply #16 on: May 18, 2006, 04:21:21 pm »
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Heya Everybody!

I got  a message from a friend on the Reform Party board and decided that I would drop in and see what's going on.

I'm glad to know that there are more independent thinkers out and around the web. I would be glad to answer any questions you might have about my platform and campaign.
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« Reply #17 on: May 18, 2006, 06:26:05 pm »
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Wyatt,

Welcome to the forum, first of all.  Glad to see some third-party representation here. Smiley

First off, I love the Mo Udall quote.  I had that in my signature a few months back, in fact.

I have a few questions based on your "on the issues" page.  You may have to forgive my only basic knowledge of some issues; I am a high school student who has not yet had the pleasure of filling out income tax forms or dealing with social security.

First of all, I see that you are a deficit hawk (if this would be an accurate description).  Your page says that we should re-evaluate some programs and replace them to reduce the load.  Certainly, with a deficit of this size, that would constitute some significant cuts.  What specific types of cuts would you first consider?

Secondly, I see that you support banning PAC groups.  I personally disagree with this, but that's a Constitutional issue.  I assume this ban would also include 527 groups?  What is your position on corporate donations?

Thanks. Smiley
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« Reply #18 on: May 18, 2006, 08:53:50 pm »
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Wyatt,

Welcome to the forum, first of all.  Glad to see some third-party representation here. Smiley

First off, I love the Mo Udall quote.  I had that in my signature a few months back, in fact.

I have a few questions based on your "on the issues" page.  You may have to forgive my only basic knowledge of some issues; I am a high school student who has not yet had the pleasure of filling out income tax forms or dealing with social security.

First of all, I see that you are a deficit hawk (if this would be an accurate description).  Your page says that we should re-evaluate some programs and replace them to reduce the load.  Certainly, with a deficit of this size, that would constitute some significant cuts.  What specific types of cuts would you first consider?

Secondly, I see that you support banning PAC groups.  I personally disagree with this, but that's a Constitutional issue.  I assume this ban would also include 527 groups?  What is your position on corporate donations?

Thanks. Smiley

Yeah Udall was an awesome guy, I had the pleasure of growing up in his district. =) Anywho, to answer your questions...

The my main focus as far as budget cuts are to eliminate the pork and to scale back programs that hold little function andlittle purpose to the average american. Such things include...

- Corporate Welfare
- The War on Drugs (rather than fighting it with money, I intend to fight it with border security. Did you know that our neighbors to the south are accountable for over 80% of illegal drugs circulating within the United States?)
- Space Exploration Programs
- National Missle Defense (Star Wars)
- Special Intrest Subsides

Also to fight the debt I suggest we privatize a portion of the social security system. The truth is that we spend too much money into the trust fund and discourage fiscal integrity by doing so.

Secondly, the main reason I support the aboliton of PACs is because they usually swing the elections away from the intrests of the American people and and right into the intrests of pocket stuffing...the doing away with PACs and 527 groups would definitely clean up elections.

Finally, I feel like we really need to put campaign donations back into the hands of individuals and the little guy. When corporations dominate the donation process, it's their intrests that will be attended too. I suggest a drastic but effective measure to even the playing feild. Restrict corporations to the same donation limits as an individual.

I hope this answers your questions, and thank you for the welcome.
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« Reply #19 on: May 18, 2006, 09:52:48 pm »
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Wyatt, if Hillary Clinton is the nominee for my party (which means she would have no chance winning in Arkansas) and you get on the ballot there's a very good chance I would vote for you.

I disagree with you somewhat on funding for NASA and aid to Isreal, but the rest of your platform looks good.
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« Reply #20 on: May 18, 2006, 10:53:46 pm »
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Wyatt, if Hillary Clinton is the nominee for my party (which means she would have no chance winning in Arkansas) and you get on the ballot there's a very good chance I would vote for you.

I disagree with you somewhat on funding for NASA and aid to Isreal, but the rest of your platform looks good.

Thanks, I'm glad to know I have your support.
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« Reply #21 on: May 19, 2006, 08:14:18 am »

Welcom Wyatt!
Here are some questions:

- how would you address the issue of earmarks?  Today, congress is able to pass funding for projects in home districts with apparent impunity... borrowing ever more money from abroad to funnel to spend on projects that may not have great value.

- with regard to budgetary issues, if we paredo (corporate term) the items, Social Security, Medicare, and Military are the top three - can you be more specific with regard to "re-evaluate" medicare?  How do you approach the coming fiscal tidal wave of benefits recipients for medicare and social security?  What is you position with regard to military spending? 

- do you have an opinion with regard to linking any new programs with revenue sources to pay for the programs?

- in 1992, one of the issues which I liked about the Perot platform was the 50 cent per gallon gasoline tax - his motivation was to use the tax as a method for paying down debt - and having a multiplier to also reduce interest payments.   However, this tax would have created a secondary benefit - reducing demand (consumption) of gasoline in the US, therfore reducing the trade deficit, reducing the dependence of the US on foreign oil, and the power of nations that have oil (and particularly those that are not friendly to the US).  I belive that there is also solid economic arguments that gasoline is still far too cheap relative to the external costs associated with consumption (i.e. those costs incurred by parties not involved in the transaction - such as the cost of defense of the Persion Gulf, cost of respiratory ailments due to smog created by exhaust, present-discounted value cost to future generations not able to access the resource, the potential cost - call it probabalistic cost - of world-wide climate change, etc.).  Ok, after that long-winded introduction, where do you stand on the issue/s?

- I tend to agree with Preston with regard to Nasa - economic multipliers can be enormous with funding of scientific research and development.  Although there are many examples, the Nasa Apollo program provided the funding for the integrated circuit development, and in conjunction with the Minuteman missle project, reduced the IC production cost by 97.5% between 1960 and 1963 - sparking the revolution of electronics we enjoy today.  Although there may be more cost-effective ways of funding such projects - a good example is the recent DARPA Grand Challenge race of autonomous vehicles.

- what do you consider the nations top three priorities?

Many thanks,
Dave
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« Reply #22 on: May 19, 2006, 10:51:44 am »
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- The War on Drugs (rather than fighting it with money, I intend to fight it with border security. Did you know that our neighbors to the south are accountable for over 80% of illegal drugs circulating within the United States?)
Uh...not really. Cocaine's imported of course, but meth, moonshine alcohol, and a lot of the marijuana consumed in the US is not.
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« Reply #23 on: May 19, 2006, 12:13:52 pm »
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Howdy Dave, some good questions.

1) I would work with congress to pass legislation replacing the current "Borrow and Spend" policy with a more benefitial "PAYGO" system. In 2000, the Federal government had a budget surplus of $236 billion, because this common-sense approach to managing federal spending was in place.

2) For medicare we need to take some worth while initiatives to simplify the system. I think that the plans need to be thouroughly explained to the American people. Also, before we rush a plan into action we need to test and make sure that it is going to work as expected. Finally, we need to keep these programs flexible so that they can be reformed as our knowledge of the problems increse.

The upcoming benefit cash in will be hard to deal with on a fiscal level but I suggest we cut certain pork barrel programs in order to compensate.

I do not feel that we necessarily spend too much on the military more so than I feel that we spend quite inefficently. While we are busy funding "Star Wars" programs to greater flash our global ego - we are sending our guys into battle with supply shortages and sub par equipment. I would retool the spending bracket to raise pay for active duty personel, troop readiness, and train programs.

3) Yes, I feel that between 90-95% of revenue should go to reducing the national debt. Leaving the additional 5% for programs of the upmost importance.

4) To very honest, I'm still doing the research on the gas tax. While the benefits of raising it are evident and very convincing, so are the issues regarding the American pocket book with the state, local, and federal gas taxes now representing up to 65 cents a gallon in certain places. I am definitely for reducing the demand for oil, but when looking at the big picture we need to first  have to reduce the cost of being energy efficent. i believe that we need to lower business taxes on businesses that produce cars that run on alternative energy as well as alternative energy it's self. As it stands, there just isn't a plentiful source for us to work with. Before we lower demand, we would have to give them an alternative. Not everyone has a hydrogen station around the corner...they should, but sadly enough don't.

As I said, I am still talking to people...researching this issue and trying to formulate a posistion with the people in mind. I'd like to know exactly what I am dealing with before I go off and throwing out these platform planks just for the sake of having a platform.

5) Don't get wrong, I understand that Space Exploration is benefitial. But the debt/deficit situation we deal with now requires us to keep the most important programs while putting smaller things on the backburner.

6) #1 - Immigration reform. We need to crack down on illegal immigration and install assisted assimilation that teaches immigrants to speak english and live in American culture.

#2 - Environmental Protection and Alternative Energies. I would propose to strengthen the clean air/water acts and increase funding to protect the environment in a more efficent manor. I would also fund programs designed to research renewable enrgy sources to assist America in becoming energy independent.

#3 - Regaining Control of our Runaway Economy. - Since Bush took office in 2001, spending has increased by nearly 60%...in coordination with lopsided tax breaks that shift the budget to the average Americans in the middle classes. Fighting the debt via economci responsiblity should be a very high priority for our government.
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« Reply #24 on: May 19, 2006, 04:09:40 pm »
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Howdy Dave, some good questions.

1) I would work with congress to pass legislation replacing the current "Borrow and Spend" policy with a more benefitial "PAYGO" system. In 2000, the Federal government had a budget surplus of $236 billion, because this common-sense approach to managing federal spending was in place.

2) For medicare we need to take some worth while initiatives to simplify the system. I think that the plans need to be thouroughly explained to the American people. Also, before we rush a plan into action we need to test and make sure that it is going to work as expected. Finally, we need to keep these programs flexible so that they can be reformed as our knowledge of the problems increse.

The upcoming benefit cash in will be hard to deal with on a fiscal level but I suggest we cut certain pork barrel programs in order to compensate.

I do not feel that we necessarily spend too much on the military more so than I feel that we spend quite inefficently. While we are busy funding "Star Wars" programs to greater flash our global ego - we are sending our guys into battle with supply shortages and sub par equipment. I would retool the spending bracket to raise pay for active duty personel, troop readiness, and train programs.

3) Yes, I feel that between 90-95% of revenue should go to reducing the national debt. Leaving the additional 5% for programs of the upmost importance.

4) To very honest, I'm still doing the research on the gas tax. While the benefits of raising it are evident and very convincing, so are the issues regarding the American pocket book with the state, local, and federal gas taxes now representing up to 65 cents a gallon in certain places. I am definitely for reducing the demand for oil, but when looking at the big picture we need to first  have to reduce the cost of being energy efficent. i believe that we need to lower business taxes on businesses that produce cars that run on alternative energy as well as alternative energy it's self. As it stands, there just isn't a plentiful source for us to work with. Before we lower demand, we would have to give them an alternative. Not everyone has a hydrogen station around the corner...they should, but sadly enough don't.

As I said, I am still talking to people...researching this issue and trying to formulate a posistion with the people in mind. I'd like to know exactly what I am dealing with before I go off and throwing out these platform planks just for the sake of having a platform.

5) Don't get wrong, I understand that Space Exploration is benefitial. But the debt/deficit situation we deal with now requires us to keep the most important programs while putting smaller things on the backburner.

6) #1 - Immigration reform. We need to crack down on illegal immigration and install assisted assimilation that teaches immigrants to speak english and live in American culture.

#2 - Environmental Protection and Alternative Energies. I would propose to strengthen the clean air/water acts and increase funding to protect the environment in a more efficent manor. I would also fund programs designed to research renewable enrgy sources to assist America in becoming energy independent.

#3 - Regaining Control of our Runaway Economy. - Since Bush took office in 2001, spending has increased by nearly 60%...in coordination with lopsided tax breaks that shift the budget to the average Americans in the middle classes. Fighting the debt via economci responsiblity should be a very high priority for our government.

You're a Democrat. You're not right-wing enough to be what is called a "centrist" in America.
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