NJ Senate Debate

[Smash255]

Menendez is a political animal.....the Republicans are used to Democrats being wusses who won't fight back and Menendez is just the opposite. He goes on the attack and has no fear.

We need more like him to fight the Republican smear machine.

DeLay was a fighter but I didn't center my views on him around that. I have admitted that he is scummy and you should do the same, whether or not you think Menendez is a "political animal."

Are you honestly trying to compare Menendez to Delay??  Menendez is a bit of a fighter as was Delay, but to compare someone who really hasn't run into ethical issues, no matter what you think of him personally to someone who has had his hands have never left the cookie jar is a bit over the top.

[Keystone Phil]

Santorum has absolutely no chance of winning. He also didn't do so well in 2000. (I don't think 53% is good) He is very extreme and has very low poll numbers.

Just like how he had no chance in 1990 and 1992. Harris Wofford had no shot in the 1991 Special election. He was down forty points at one point and went on to win by ten.

Are you honestly trying to compare Menendez to Delay??  Menendez is a bit of a fighter as was Delay, but to compare someone who really hasn't run into ethical issues, no matter what you think of him personally to someone who has had his hands have never left the cookie jar is a bit over the top.

Clearly, idiot, I was saying that I could make a case that DeLay was a fighter but was also corrupt. Someone could say the same for Menendez. You're stupidity never ceases to amaze me.

Santorum has absolutely no chance of winning. He also didn't do so well in 2000. (I don't think 53% is good) He is very extreme and has very low poll numbers.

I don't think he has "no chance" but it's a very small one.

Yeah, we can have a lot of fun with a lot of people actually but that's not what this is about to me. Just having them shocked will be enough.

[Smash255]

Santorum has absolutely no chance of winning. He also didn't do so well in 2000. (I don't think 53% is good) He is very extreme and has very low poll numbers.

Just like how he had no chance in 1990 and 1992. Harris Wofford had no shot in the 1991 Special election. He was down forty points at one point and went on to win by ten.

Are you honestly trying to compare Menendez to Delay??  Menendez is a bit of a fighter as was Delay, but to compare someone who really hasn't run into ethical issues, no matter what you think of him personally to someone who has had his hands have never left the cookie jar is a bit over the top.

Clearly, idiot, I was saying that I could make a case that DeLay was a fighter but was also corrupt. Someone could say the same for Menendez. You're stupidity never ceases to amaze me.


[

Exactly how is Menendez corrupt?  How can an argument even be made that Menendez is corrupt???

[Keystone Phil]

Exactly how is Menendez corrupt?  How can an argument even be made that Menendez is corrupt???

You are that much of a hack, Smash? How can an argument even be made? Are you blind? So many people in your party even admit it. If you don't think he is, you are being your usual idiotic self but to ask how the argument can even be made is beyond your usual stupidity. The man is the head of a North Jersey political machine and we know how machine politics still operates in NJ.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

As Lewis said before, all the attacks on Menendez are basically just guilt by association, and that's all I'm still seeing.

[Virginian87]

Exactly how is Menendez corrupt?  How can an argument even be made that Menendez is corrupt???

You are that much of a hack, Smash? How can an argument even be made? Are you blind? So many people in your party even admit it. If you don't think he is, you are being your usual idiotic self but to ask how the argument can even be made is beyond your usual stupidity. The man is the head of a North Jersey political machine and we know how machine politics still operates in NJ.

I have to agree with Phil on this one.  Menendez is extremely corrupt.  As I've pointed out on more than one occasion, this guy is a product of the North Jersey (specifically Hudson County) Democratic machine.  Corzine made a big mistake in appointing this guy.

[ag]

Exactly how is Menendez corrupt?  How can an argument even be made that Menendez is corrupt???

You are that much of a hack, Smash? How can an argument even be made? Are you blind? So many people in your party even admit it. If you don't think he is, you are being your usual idiotic self but to ask how the argument can even be made is beyond your usual stupidity. The man is the head of a North Jersey political machine and we know how machine politics still operates in NJ.

I have to agree with Phil on this one.  Menendez is extremely corrupt.  As I've pointed out on more than one occasion, this guy is a product of the North Jersey (specifically Hudson County) Democratic machine.  Corzine made a big mistake in appointing this guy.

Since I don't know anything in particular (neither good, nor bad) about Sen. Menendez, could we get any examples of actual corrupt or, at least, unethical behavior by the guy? Preferably, the example should be fairly recent, at least dating from his first campaign for elected office or later (I am not sure it is relevant if he was a precinct volunteer distributing campaign cash left and right when he was 20). If he is so obviously rotten, such examples shouldn't be hard to come by.

On a different note, coming from a machine does not by itself mean being a bad candidate or office holder. Al Smith came straight from the Tammany Hall, didn't he?

[Kevin]

Menendez is going to lose that is my gut feeling. However I expected better from Kean during that debate, the stuttering killed him. What harmed Menendez was the fact he came accross as slimy ,and the fact he is not very attractive as a canidate he just doesn't have that message that makes you crazy about his canidacy. 

[Smash255]

Exactly how is Menendez corrupt?  How can an argument even be made that Menendez is corrupt???

You are that much of a hack, Smash? How can an argument even be made? Are you blind? So many people in your party even admit it. If you don't think he is, you are being your usual idiotic self but to ask how the argument can even be made is beyond your usual stupidity. The man is the head of a North Jersey political machine and we know how machine politics still operates in NJ.

I have to agree with Phil on this one.  Menendez is extremely corrupt.  As I've pointed out on more than one occasion, this guy is a product of the North Jersey (specifically Hudson County) Democratic machine.  Corzine made a big mistake in appointing this guy.

Since I don't know anything in particular (neither good, nor bad) about Sen. Menendez, could we get any examples of actual corrupt or, at least, unethical behavior by the guy? Preferably, the example should be fairly recent, at least dating from his first campaign for elected office or later (I am not sure it is relevant if he was a precinct volunteer distributing campaign cash left and right when he was 20). If he is so obviously rotten, such examples shouldn't be hard to come by.

On a different note, coming from a machine does not by itself mean being a bad candidate or office holder. Al Smith came straight from the Tammany Hall, didn't he?

Thats exactly the point I was trying to make.  Some of those are so quick to label Menendez as corrupt by saying he is part of the North jersey political machine, but they fail to offer any examoples or any evidence of any corrupt behavior or actions from Menendez.

So again I will ask, what examples cann you give of corrupt behavior from Menendez, and just being part of a Political Machine dosn't exactly mean corrupt behavior.  So some examples please???

[Flying Dog]

My prediction:


Menendez 50%

Kean Jr 48%

[Virginian87]

I still think Menendez is going to win, given New Jersey's voting record, but Kean also has a solid chance to beat him.  However, he's going to lose that chance if he performs at subsequent debates the way he performed in this one.

[Kevin]

1. He needs to relax during those debates 2. He needs to work on the stuttering. He he does this he should be ok.

[Conan]

Menendez won't be looked at as corrupt. While anyone can make what they want with his past, while he is a "boss", he has never done anything illegal. However, he is a fighter and will deliver in his job. Plus he votes right, except for on the flag amendment. You can't compare Menendez to Tom Delay. Tom Delay is way more corrupt and pretty much doesn't hide it. While Tom Kean is probably more ethical, he won't be a republican reformer and will only add a vote for Republican leadership in Washington which enables a party full of corruption.

Here is why Menendez will win:

1)He represents the views of NJ in his voting.
2)His ethics is disputed but nothing could be proven that is illegal and will make him branded as corrupt, plus people may view him as being smeared.
3)George Bush
4)Democratic vote in congress, contributes to majority
5)He will demand and deliver things for NJ
6)He will have tons more campaign cash
7)Tom Kean could be smeared to also look unethical

Prediction:

Menendez 54-56%
Kean 44-45%

[YRABNNRM]

If Menendez starts to smear Kean to look "unethical", Menendez won't see what's coming.

[Conan]

Menendez really has nothing to worry about in that department. If its true that he is unethical, it will be a he said she said.

To say that Menendez won't see whats coming is high hoping. Nothing will come of it. I am curious as to what you think will happen.

[Kevin]

Menendez really has nothing to worry about in that department. If its true that he is unethical, it will be a he said she said.

To say that Menendez won't see whats coming is high hoping. Nothing will come of it. I am curious as to what you think will happen.

Are you kidding, are you high, have you done any crack-cocaine today, but in all do seriousness what makes you think the Menendez is uncorroupt?

[YRABNNRM]

Menendez really has nothing to worry about in that department. If its true that he is unethical, it will be a he said she said.

To say that Menendez won't see whats coming is high hoping. Nothing will come of it. I am curious as to what you think will happen.

But you just said that they could smear Kean to look unethical...if they can do it to him, Kean would have an easier time doing it to them. I can see the ads featuring Menendez and McGreevey together with some of the Torch thrown in there as we speak.

[Conan]

What has been said of Menendez regarding if he is corrupt has already been tossed at him. This election will be just like all NJ elections since 2002. Candidates say one or the other is corrupt and the voters vote for who reflects their views. Menendez has no ethics probe investigating him, he isnt in jail, he has never been on trial, what has been said of him could be said of anyone in politics, and he hasnt done anything illegal. What can you say of him that would make him corrupt by law? He will win the election. Kean could be made to look unethical too. These ads you talk about with McGreevey would back fire. No one cares about McGreevey. That would backfire because it has nothing to do with him. Picture an add with George Bush, Dick Cheney, Carl Rove, or Tom Delay with Tom Kean. That is national. This race is a federal one. Menendez won't take shots sitting back. Plus Kean has oil ties which would make for a good ad with Bush and Cheney.

[YRABNNRM]

Ok. You say this...

Menendez has no ethics probe investigating him, he isnt in jail, he has never been on trial, what has been said of him could be said of anyone in politics, and he hasnt done anything illegal. What can you say of him that would make him corrupt by law?

and then you say this...

Kean could be made to look unethical too

But I'll respond to this with what you say above...

...has no ethics probe investigating him, he isnt in jail, he has never been on trial, what has been said of him could be said of anyone in politics, and he hasnt done anything illegal. What can you say of him that would make him corrupt by law?

[Conan]

Exactly my point. He said she said. Thats what is gonna be made of the accusations. Now you see. I am just telling the truth, thats how everything will be seen. I am not excusing anything shady Menendez may or may not have done. He wouldnt have been my first choice but he wont be a bad senator either.

Also:

Rasmussen:
June 27th 2006, after the debates

Menendez 46% (+9 from last poll)
Kean 40% (+-0 from last poll)

[Smash255]

Menendez really has nothing to worry about in that department. If its true that he is unethical, it will be a he said she said.

To say that Menendez won't see whats coming is high hoping. Nothing will come of it. I am curious as to what you think will happen.

Are you kidding, are you hight, have you done any crack-cocaine today, but in all do seriousness what makes you think the Menendez is uncorroupt?

What has Menendez actually done that is unethical??

[Smash255]

What has Menendez actually done that is unethical??

http://www.getnj.com/onlygameintown/messages/1754.shtml

Yeah thats a legit news source................

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Appearantly the Kean campaign plans to swiftboat (attack with very negative lies) Menendez. However, unlike Bush and Kerry, they aren't distancing this attack from the Kean campaign.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

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http://www.nytimes.com/2006/06/30/nyregion/30kean.html


I didn't really like Menedez before, but now I really hope he destroys Kean and all Kean stands for.  Kean is total garbage.

If Kean wasn't a complete ass, he'd be dealing with the flooding situation (NJ is in a state of emergency) instead of making of lying attacks.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Since the 2004 election showed that taking the upper road, and  not immediately responding to negative lying attacks, no matter how absurd, causes you to lose, here's Menendez's response. Time to hit back hard on this waste of DNA.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

http://www.menendez2006.com/news/headlines/20060630_swiftboat/

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/6/30/03523/1139

Yeah thats a legit news source................

It links to the NY Times, you moron.