Ireland Election 2007

[Democratic Hawk]

Apparently, the 'Mullingar Accord' between FG and Labour is over

http://www.irishmedicalnews.ie/articles.asp?Category=news&ArticleID=19127

Dave

[Јas]

Apparently, the 'Mullingar Accord' between FG and Labour is over

http://www.irishmedicalnews.ie/articles.asp?Category=news&ArticleID=19127

Dave

Yep, technically I suppose it ended when the vote for Taoiseach took place. In any case the two parties can be expected to remain on solid terms while Enda and Pat remain the leaders. We'll just have to wait and see if Labour change their electoral strategy next time on foot of the Accord's failure to help them.


In other news, nominations for the Green Party leader close today.

The expected nominees are new Cabinet Minister John Gormley and former MEP Patricia McKenna (who opposed the government deal).

If no other names are added, Gormley should win easily enough.

Mary White is running to retain the Deputy Leadership. No challengers are expected here.

[Јas]

The leaderships of the Greens and PDs were decided today.

The result of the election for the Green leader was as follows:
John Gormley 478
Patricia McKenna 263
Spoiled Votes 34

Turnout of about 60%

That Gormley won is unsurprising. One of their cabinet ministers; second longest serving TD; a leading negotiator after the election; strongly backed the FF deal that was heavily endorsed by the membership.

Up against the anti-deal McKenna, what is surprising is that he came in at less than 2 to 1 ahead. To me this indicates that already the party are unhappy with the deal or that they would rather that the Green leader is in a position to see the wood for the trees when dealing with FF.

For the PDs, after each major player announced they wouldn't contest the position, Mary Harney will now stay on as party leader until 2009 (i.e. after the next locals/Europeans). Those elections will be vital for determinging whether the party has any future in Irish politics. Going in with a leader who is retiring at the end of this Dáil hardly seems a wise move - just goes to show the dearth of options they had.

[Tetro Kornbluth]

Somehow I managed to ignore this until now.. I spend too much time on the Internets. Anyway no real shock. I'm glad McKenna did better than the anti-dealers the last time the Greens voted.

Anyone now in doubt that the PeeDees are now finished? Every second day I keep hearing "OMG GREALISH REJOIN FF OMG!!11" and Harney is of course retiring. And Colm O' Gorman is based in Wexford (not and never was PD terriority) and most of their other 'big names' have retired back to their law library or cushy jobs working of that most unprivilidged segment of Irish society - Construction Firms...

[Јas]

Seanad Election Results

Administrative Panel (7 seats)
Daly, Mark (FF)
Donohoe, Paschal (FG)
Glynn, Camillus (FF)
Kett, Tony (FF)
McFadden, Nicky (FG)
Ryan, Brendan (Lab)
Wilson, Diarmuid (FF)

Result: 4 FF; 2 FG; 1 Lab
No change.

Agricultural Panel (11 seats)
Paul Bradford (FG)
Paddy Burke (FG)
Peter Callanan (FF)
John Carty (FF)
Pearse Doherty (SF)
Alan Kelly (Lab)
Pat Moylan (FF)
Francis O'Brien (FF)
John Paul Phelan (FG)
Eugene Regan (FG)
Jim Walsh (FF)

Result: 5 FF; 4 FG; 1 Lab; 1 SF
Sinn Féin gain from Fianna Fáil.
First SF Seanad seat (thanks to transfer pact with Labour).

Cultural & Education Panel (5 Seats)
Ann Ormound (FF)
Labhras O'Murchu (FF)
Cecilia Keaveney (FF)
Alex White (Lab)
Dr Liam Toomey (FG)

Result: 3 FF; 1 FG; 1 Lab
Labour gain here from Fine Gael - thanks to SF transfers.

Industrial and Commercial Panel (9 Seats)
Larry Butler (FF) 
Paudie Coffey (FG)
Paul Coughlan (FG)
Dominic Hannigan (Lab) 
Marc MacSharry (FF) 
Denis O'Donovan (FF)
Joe O'Reilly (FG) 
Kieran Phelan (FF) 
Mary M. White (FF)

Result: 5 FF; 3 FG; 1 Lab
No change.

Labour Panel (11 Seats)
Jerry Buttimer (FG) 
Donie Cassidy (FF)
Maurice Cummins (FG) 
Geraldine Feeney (FF)
Frances Fitzgerald (FG)   
John Gerard Hanafin (FF)
Fidelma Healy-Eames (FG)   
Terry Leyden (FF) 
Michael McCarthy (Lab)
Ned O'Sullivan (FF)
Phil Prendergast (Lab)

Result: 5 FF; 4 FG; 2 Lab
Labour gain from Fianna Fáil. The gain being McCarthy, who ran on the nomination of ICTU (the Irish Congress of Trade Unions) not the Labour Party. He is still a Labour Party member though, so I've counted him as Lab not Ind. He got in thanks to SF votes also.


National University of Ireland (3 Seats)
Mullen, Rónan (Ind)
O'Toole, Joe (Ind)
Quinn, Fergal (Ind)

Result: 3 Ind
Officially no change, though in my books it's an Ind gain from Lab. Brendan Ryan lost the seat to Mullen. Ryan was a Labour party memebr, though like all the Uni Senators, styled hmself an Independent.

University of Dublin (3 seats)
Norris, David (Ind)
Ross, Shane (Ind)
Bacik, Ivana (Lab)

Result: 2 Ind; 1 Lab
No change
Officially an Independent - but she's a member of the Labour party, and a former Labour candidate in the European elections. She may protest as to being an Independent but in the parlance of this forum she's an IINO - so I've re-classified her as she ought to be. Strictly speaking, this is absolutely no change, as her predecesor, Mary Henry, was also a Labour party memebr who styled herself as an Independent.


So then, I make that overall as follows:
FF 22 (-2)
FG 14 (-1)
Lab 7 (+1)
SF 1 (+1)
Ind 5 (+1)

Therefore:
Government 22
Opposition 27

Which makes 49 total. The remaining 11 seats are appointed at the discretion of the Taoiseach. Thus guaranteeing a governement majority in the chamber - this was in jeopardy, but FF made good running in this election as it was widely expected that the majority would end up very thin or indeed non-existent.

The lucky 11 should be announced shortly. It's anticipated that both the Greens and the Progressive Democrats will get 2 appointments. I'll post news when I get it.

[Hash]

11 appointed seats? Please. That's what makes this Senate, and other legislatures worldwide seem lousy and retarded in my eyes.

[Јas]

11 appointed seats? Please. That's what makes this Senate, and other legislatures worldwide seem lousy and retarded in my eyes.

Certainly it's a horrid system - but it's not necessarily what makes the house lousy. IMO it's problem is that it has always refused to attempt to exert any influence and fails to properly scrutinise legislation. (An opposition Senad would have been interesting to see what it would have done though.)

Whilest I disagree with the way the House of Lords is composed, it at least makes the occasional serious attempt at such scrutinisation and from time to time is willing to stand up to the government of the day.

[Hash]

Your Senate reminds me of the French Senate, which is basically a club for retired rightist politicians or failed rightist politicians, with some failed leftists too.

Reminds me of when Rachida Dati presented a program to the Senate- around 80% of Senators weren't even there and the President of the Senate didn't remember her name.

[Јas]

Your Senate reminds me of the French Senate, which is basically a club for retired rightist politicians or failed rightist politicians, with some failed leftists too.

Yeah, from the list above many were failed candidates in the Dáil elections. The Seanad usually contains a lot of people either on the way up (or the way down) in Irish politics. The job gives them an office to work from for the next Dáil elections - I think around a dozen or so candidates stepped up from the Seanad to the Dáil in the last election.

[Tetro Kornbluth]

Gotta love Trinity and it's complete dislike of voting for FF and Pseudo-Independent-FFers.

Protestants!

[Јas]

Gotta love Trinity and it's complete dislike of voting for FF and Pseudo-FFers.

Protestants!

lol

[Tetro Kornbluth]

Gotta love Trinity and it's complete dislike of voting for FF and Pseudo-FFers.

Protestants!

lol

OMG PAPIST!!111

[Јas]

[Tetro Kornbluth]

WHY DO U LIKE THE ANTICHRIST-POPE-WHORE JAS YOU ROME-LOVING FIANNA FAILER (HAHA LIKE 'FAIL' IN ENGLISH HAHA...) I HATE TEH CATHOLICS!!1111

[Јas]

WHY DO U LIKE THE ANTICHRIST-POPE-WHORE JAS YOU ROME-LOVING FIANNA FAILER (HAHA LIKE 'FAIL' IN ENGLISH HAHA...) I HATE TEH CATHOLICS!!1111

[Tetro Kornbluth]

Ok then.. Back to the Seanad.

Well the hopes of having an Govt minority were pretty much over once the first counts came in from the panels. Not that that was very likely. (I suspect this might be part of the reason to bring the Greens in Goverment.. Not the only reason obviously, the Seanad is still too irrelevant for that. But something no doubt swirling in the minds of the high rank FFers)

In other words, YAY! Five more years of Enda Kenny being leader of the opposition.. and given that Cowen is in the Gordon-Brown-In-Waiting I guess we'll have to wait until 2017 before seeing a non-FF goverment in this country. By which point I will have already emigrated.. Yay!   (Seriously can anyone see Kenny beating Cowen.. If you think the last debate was won by Bertie.. Well Jesus. Cowen is Articulate, and while he's not Bertie he still has a feel of "de Comman Man".. the guy at the back of the pub always looking into guinness wearing a battered suit and only ever looks up from his porter to shout "bollocks" for no apparent reason.

Can we convince Gay Mitchell to make a comeback to the Dail and run as FG Leader.. Pleeasssseee...... Had he won the leadership contest back in 2002 I've no doubt he'd be Taoiseach now.

[Јas]

In other words, YAY! Five more years of Enda Kenny being leader of the opposition.. and given that Cowen is in the Gordon-Brown-In-Waiting I guess we'll have to wait until 2017 before seeing a non-FF goverment in this country.

A week is still a long time in politics, grasshopper. () Anything could yet happen... especially with tribunals in play examining the dear leader. And, of course, who can tell what will be the future of the economy (not that I'm a begrudger or anything... ). And of course to stay in governemnt FF will need outside help - who can tell what the voters will make of the PDs and Greens next time out?

By which point I will have already emigrated.. Yay!  

Somewhere nice, I hope.

(Seriously can anyone see Kenny beating Cowen.. If you think the last debate was won by Bertie.. Well Jesus. Cowen is Articulate, and while he's not Bertie he still has a feel of "de Comman Man".. the guy at the back of the pub always looking into guinness wearing a battered suit and only ever looks up from his porter to shout "bollocks" for no apparent reason.

Kenny is no debater, to be sure, but I don't think any election will be won or lost there. Cowen should play well outside Dublin ... but inside the city - not so sure, will have to wait and see on that.

Can we convince Gay Mitchell to make a comeback to the Dail and run as FG Leader.. Pleeasssseee...... Had he won the leadership contest back in 2002 I've no doubt he'd back Taoiseach now.

Oh goodness no - are you trying to get me to emigrate?
Mr. why not have the British monarch as some sort of co-head of state figure/why not abandon all this neutrality malarchy and start getting involved in the action?

Mitchell may have helped FG in Dublin, well south of the Liffey anyway... but I don't think he could compete with Enda beyond the Pale. Kenny seemed to go down quite well, as it happened, in the rural parts. He may have done better in the debates - but 'tis hardly the be all and end all of Irish politics.

For my money, Richard Bruton was/is their best bet, btw.

[Tetro Kornbluth]

In other words, YAY! Five more years of Enda Kenny being leader of the opposition.. and given that Cowen is in the Gordon-Brown-In-Waiting I guess we'll have to wait until 2017 before seeing a non-FF goverment in this country.

A week is still a long time in politics, grasshopper. () Anything could yet happen... especially with tribunals in play examining the dear leader. And, of course, who can tell what will be the future of the economy (not that I'm a begrudger or anything... ). And of course to stay in governemnt FF will need outside help - who can tell what the voters will make of the PDs and Greens next time out?

By which point I will have already emigrated.. Yay!  

Somewhere nice, I hope.

(Seriously can anyone see Kenny beating Cowen.. If you think the last debate was won by Bertie.. Well Jesus. Cowen is Articulate, and while he's not Bertie he still has a feel of "de Comman Man".. the guy at the back of the pub always looking into guinness wearing a battered suit and only ever looks up from his porter to shout "bollocks" for no apparent reason.

Kenny is no debater, to be sure, but I don't think any election will be won or lost there. Cowen should play well outside Dublin ... but inside the city - not so sure, will have to wait and see on that.

Can we convince Gay Mitchell to make a comeback to the Dail and run as FG Leader.. Pleeasssseee...... Had he won the leadership contest back in 2002 I've no doubt he'd back Taoiseach now.

Oh goodness no - are you trying to get me to emigrate?
Mr. why not have the British monarch as some sort of co-head of state figure/why not abandon all this neutrality malarchy and start getting involved in the action?

Mitchell may have helped FG in Dublin, well south of the Liffey anyway... but I don't think he could compete with Enda beyond the Pale. Kenny seemed to go down quite well, as it happened, in the rural parts. He may have done better in the debates - but 'tis hardly the be all and end all of Irish politics.

For my money, Richard Bruton was/is their best bet, btw.

Actually I agree that the importance of the debates was somewhat overstated (Then again I didn't watch them.. ) I can continue to have this theory that part of the reason Bertie won was due to the Brendan Behan-F**k the Begrudgers\anti-Dublin Meeja vote. As the job of the opposition is make everything crap.. and Irish people have a strange aversion to truth. . They only like to complain themselves, listen to others complain though.. (I'm not sure whether I should put a here or not)

Anyway by 2012 even if the housing bubble has burst so bad that houses in Ballsbridge only cost roughly 2.5million euro the country would have been so desensitivied to it thanks to Oh-so-Anti-FF Dublin Meeja (OMG I BLAME TEH DUBS FOR EVERYTHING!!111).. Seriously the consensus is here shocking, why are FF "The Guardians of the Irish Economy, yadda, yadda, yadda" when they just inherited the boom after stealing cheating strongarming the 1997 General election - then spent the first five years cutting tax for the rich and working mothers and then the next five in their typical gombeenery way. What have they achieved again?

The Problem is with Kenny is that he's not a Taoiseach, now Gay Mitchell or Richard Bruton.. they are potential Taoisi (I'm too damn lazy to look up the plural properly).. And assuming nothing dramatic changes by 2012 then we will have two rural men fighting it out.. and just from a look things look better for FF... The last seat in Cork SW due to PJ Sheehan being about a million years old and Jim O' Keefee being an idiot (not that that is a particular impediment to an Irish Political career), Kerry due to O'Donahogue being CC.. Mayo=Local Taoiseach won't be as strong. Obviously to use the old cliches of hacks and wise men "a week is a long time in politics".

And Yeah, Gay Mitchell would have smoked the Tory-South Dublin vote, things would have been even worse for the PDs then. Though perhaps a bit better for SF. I don't see Richard Bruton having much appeal outside the Pale either though being on de Northsoide must help him a bit. But either of them would be good for me, they're articulate for one thing - even if they would have to put with Celtic jersey wearing crowd.

And why not have the British monarch as head of the state. The Queen is better than the Invisible woman imo. (not my actual opinion; actual opinion = don't really care)

I hope to go somewhere nice aswell.

RANT OVER.

[Tetro Kornbluth]

It's assuming how absolutely no-one else on this forum apart from us could actually have a clue what we're talking about.. I wish there was an Irish Politics forum like this one. Instead of ones which involve 15 year old hipsters constantly arguing whether communism works or not (To save you reading 100 pages of thread and hours of your life: no, no it does not) and constant posts celebrating the hunger strikes and the 'Ra from people who live in Clondalkin arguing about what the glorious armed struggle actually achieved for Irish Unity, blah, blah, blah (and again to shorten your life, the answer is nothing, nothing at all) And then there's the Sunday Independent reading crowd....

[Јas]

It's assuming how absolutely no-one else on this forum apart from us could actually have a clue what we're talking about..

I wouldn't write them off just yet.

I wish there was an Irish Politics forum like this one.

What little is out there, seems to be dominated by people who are...special.
Sorta like dealing with Craggy Islanders instead of normal Irish folk... they comprise the radical fringe of all sides and don't take kindly to outsiders. Best left alone, I find.

[Tetro Kornbluth]

It's assuming how absolutely no-one else on this forum apart from us could actually have a clue what we're talking about..

I wouldn't write them off just yet.

I wish there was an Irish Politics forum like this one.

What little is out there, seems to be dominated by people who are...special.
Sorta like dealing with Craggy Islanders instead of normal Irish folk... they comprise the radical fringe of all sides and don't take kindly to outsiders. Best left alone, I find.

I think we're the special ones - this entire nation is nothing but a bunch of Craggy Islanders. Just you wait, very soon we will have the magical stone of Clonrickart in every town in country (Of course we already have lots of magic roads, though strangely all of them seem to lead to Bray.)

[Јas]

It's assuming how absolutely no-one else on this forum apart from us could actually have a clue what we're talking about..

I wouldn't write them off just yet.

I wish there was an Irish Politics forum like this one.

What little is out there, seems to be dominated by people who are...special.
Sorta like dealing with Craggy Islanders instead of normal Irish folk... they comprise the radical fringe of all sides and don't take kindly to outsiders. Best left alone, I find.

I think we're the special one - this entire nation is nothing but a bunch of Craggy Islanders. Just you wait, very soon we will have the magical stone of Clonrickart in every town in country (Of course we already have lots of magic roads, though strangely all of them seem to lead to Bray.)

We've now certainly reached the point where everyone else will surely have been lost.

[Tetro Kornbluth]

It's assuming how absolutely no-one else on this forum apart from us could actually have a clue what we're talking about..

I wouldn't write them off just yet.

I wish there was an Irish Politics forum like this one.

What little is out there, seems to be dominated by people who are...special.
Sorta like dealing with Craggy Islanders instead of normal Irish folk... they comprise the radical fringe of all sides and don't take kindly to outsiders. Best left alone, I find.

I think we're the special one - this entire nation is nothing but a bunch of Craggy Islanders. Just you wait, very soon we will have the magical stone of Clonrickart in every town in country (Of course we already have lots of magic roads, though strangely all of them seem to lead to Bray.)

We've now certainly reached the point where everyone else will surely have been lost.

Only people without a sense of humour or without a childhood... Father Ted having poisoned a mind of a generation you know..

[Јas]

Reported today that Taoiseach will nominate Ciaran Cannon and Fiona O'Malley (both PDs) as 2 of his 11 appointment Senators - thus doubling the PD parliamentary party. No word yet on the other 9, though it's expected that there will be 2 Greens (my money being on Dan Boyle & Deirdre deBurca for those positions btw).

During their recent who'll be our leader debacle, Colm O'Gorman, Tom Morrissey and Fiona O'Malley all indicated interest. The efforts were as likely pitching for these Senate seat nominations as anything else.

Though there will be disgruntlement in PD circles at the choices, both O'Malley and Cannon have much more election potential than O'Gorman or Morrissey - or indeed both combined IMO. (Cannon put in a very creditable performance in Galway East in the context of national meltdown and the fact that he was but a County Councillor.) The drawback though is that neither would seem to have great leadership potential.

[Јas]

The 11 nominees of An Taoiseach to the Seanad have been announced.
They are as follows:

Greens (2)
Dan Boyle (ex-TD, Cork South Central)
Deirdre deBurca (Cllr and Dáil candidate, Wicklow)

Progressive Democrats (2)
Ciaran Cannon (Cllr and Dáil candidate, Galway East)
Fiona O'Malley (ex-TD, Dún Laoghaire)

Fianna Fáil (6)
Martin Brady (ex-TD, Dublin North East)
Ivor Callely (ex-TD and Minister of State, Dublin North Central)
John Ellis (ex-TD, Roscommon-South Leitrim)
Maria Corrigan (Cllr and Dáil candiate, Dublin South)
Lisa McDonald (Cllr and Dáil candiate, Wexford)
Brian Ó Domhnaill (Cllr, Donegal)

Other/???/Beyond Classification (though recently Bertie-ite extraordinaire) (1)
Eoghan Harris, Sunday Independent columnist