Police want bullet from teen's forehead

[Queen Mum Inks.LWC]

[/size=5]Police want bullet from teen's forehead[/size]
POSTED: 0531 GMT (1331 HKT), December 22, 2006

Joshua Bush, 17, has a bullet in his forehead, about two inches above his eyes, that police consider evidence.

Story Highlights• Joshua Bush, 17, has a 9 mm bullet in his forehead
• Police say the bullet is evidence that implicates Bush in a robbery
• A judge has issued a search warrant to extract the bullet
• Bush's lawyer is fighting the removal, raising legal, ethical and medical issues


PORT ARTHUR, Texas (AP) -- In the middle of Joshua Bush's forehead, two inches above his eyes, lies the evidence that prosecutors say could send the teenager to prison for attempted murder: a 9 mm bullet, lodged just under the skin.

Prosecutors say it will prove that Bush, 17, tried to kill the owner of a used-car lot after a robbery in July. And they have obtained a search warrant to extract the slug.

But Bush and his lawyer are fighting the removal, in a legal and medical oddity that raises questions about patient privacy and how far the government can go to solve crimes without running afoul of the constitutional protection against unreasonable searches and seizures.

"It's unfortunate this arguably important piece of evidence is in a place where it can't be easily retrieved," said Seth Chandler, a professor at the University of Houston Law Center. "You have to balance our desire to convict the guilty against the government not poking around our bodies on a supposition."

Investigators say that Bush was part of a group of gang members who broke into a used car lot and tried to steal vehicles. According to police, Bush tried to shoot businessman Alan Olive, and when Olive returned fire, a bullet struck the teenager and burrowed into the soft, fatty tissue of his forehead.

Prosecutor Ramon Rodriguez said gang members who took part in the robbery identified Bush as one of those involved. When he was questioned about a week later, Bush admitted taking part in the robbery but not the shooting, police said.

"The officers noticed the guy looks like hell. One of his eyes is black and he has a big old knot on his forehead," Rodriguez said. "He tells police he got hurt playing basketball."

A few days later, Bush went to the hospital and told doctors he had been hit by a stray bullet as he sat on a couch in an apartment.

"Officers started putting events together," Rodriguez said.

A judge took the unusual step of issuing a search warrant to retrieve the bullet from Bush's head in October.

But a Beaumont doctor determined that small pieces of bone were growing around the slug, and he did not have the proper tools in the emergency room to do it. The doctor said that removal would require surgery under general anesthesia and that no operating rooms were available.

Police then obtained a second search warrant and scheduled the operation for last week at the University of Texas Medical Branch hospital in Galveston. It was postponed again, however, after the hospital decided not to participate for reasons it would not discuss.

Prosecutors said they continue to look for a doctor or hospital willing to remove the bullet.

All sides agree that removing the bullet would not be life-threatening. But Bush's family and attorney say it would be a violation of the teenager's civil rights and set a dangerous precedent.

"When the medical profession divorces itself from its own responsibility and makes itself an arm of the state, it's a dangerous path," said Rife Kimler, Bush's lawyer.

The used car lot owner, Olive, told police that after officers had left the scene following the robbery and he began cleaning up, a man appeared in a nearby alley and threatened to kill him if he helped authorities in their investigation. The man fired at Olive and a shootout followed.

"I just can't believe I missed him at that distance," Olive, a competitive pistol shooter, said in court papers. Olive told authorities he never saw the man's face in the dark alley.

Bush is in jail on charges related to the robbery, but not the shooting.

Tammie Bush, the teen's mother, disputed allegations her son is a gang member.

"We know he's not a criminal," she said. "He's a good kid."

Dr. Arthur Caplan, director of the Center for Bioethics at the University of Pennsylvania, predicted Bush's rights as a patient will trump the state's desire to get the bullet, and said authorities might have a hard time finding someone willing to extract the slug.

"It truly is a moral quandary," Caplan said. "Doctors are caught between wanting to help solve crimes and their responsibility to patients' rights to refuse a procedure."

[Gabu]

If he has a bullet in his forehead, couldn't they just get out a metal detector to prove its presence or something?

[Queen Mum Inks.LWC]

If he has a bullet in his forehead, couldn't they just get out a metal detector to prove its presence or something?

I'm guessing they have to prove it is the bullet--so look at the "stamp" that the gun put on it (or whatever the unique things that a gun imprints onto a bullet when fired).

[Gabu]

I'm guessing they have to prove it is the bullet--so look at the "stamp" that the gun put on it (or whatever the unique things that a gun imprints onto a bullet when fired).

I suppose, although you'd think that having a bullet in your forehead would kind of be a red flag that you did something.

[The Man From G.O.P.]

Hope he enjoys prision either way.

[Queen Mum Inks.LWC]

I'm guessing they have to prove it is the bullet--so look at the "stamp" that the gun put on it (or whatever the unique things that a gun imprints onto a bullet when fired).

I suppose, although you'd think that having a bullet in your forehead would kind of be a red flag that you did something.

Ya, but in court, that would be circumstantial evidence--and I don't think that'd be enough for a conviction.

[HardRCafé]

When did "yeah" become "ya"?

[Queen Mum Inks.LWC]

When did "yeah" become "ya"?

I switch back and forth.  So stop harassing me

[AkSaber]

How the hell can someone be shot in the head with a 9mm and still live?

Maybe the store owner will switch to hollow points now.

[Platypus]

How the hell can someone be shot in the head with a 9mm and still live?

Maybe the store owner will switch to hollow points now.

He's thick.

[AkSaber]

How the hell can someone be shot in the head with a 9mm and still live?

Maybe the store owner will switch to hollow points now.

He's thick.

Ah yes, the natural body armor.

[opebo]

Interesting that all the Republicans back the police, and all the Democrats back individual rights.  At least at this point.

[Tetro Kornbluth]

If there is no easier way to prove it's a bullet...

Hope he enjoys prision either way.

[minionofmidas]

How the hell can someone be shot in the head with a 9mm and still live?

So you think it might not be a 9mm bullet after all?

[7,052,770]

Surgically removing the bullet, which might kill him, is going way too far.

[Michael Z]

• Police say the bullet is evidence that implicates Bush in a robbery

That bit got me really excited for a moment, before I started reading the rest of the story.

[David S]

How the hell can someone be shot in the head with a 9mm and still live?

That actually is a really good question. A 9mm should have enough power to penetrate  the skull and possibly go completely through the head. Getting stuck in the skin seems unlikely unless the bullet bounced off, or went through, something else first. That would lend credibility to his claim that he was hit by a stray bullet while sitting in his apartment. But that claim should be easy enough to prove or disprove. There should be a bullet hole in the wall or window of the apartment.

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Hollow points are designed to expand after they hit something so they will make a larger hole. That makes them penetrate less than a full metal jacketed bullet. But maybe he should switch to a .45 or .357 magnum.

[minionofmidas]

How the hell can someone be shot in the head with a 9mm and still live?

That actually is a really good question. A 9mm should have enough power to penetrate  the skull and possibly go completely through the head. Getting stuck in the skin seems unlikely unless the bullet bounced off, or went through, something else first. That would lend credibility to his claim that he was hit by a stray bullet while sitting in his apartment. But that claim should be easy enough to prove or disprove. There should be a bullet hole in the wall or window of the apartment.

It might be that neither side is telling the full truth, and he was indeed hit by the storekeeper's gun but not under the conditions the storekeeper describes, which are likely be influenced by self-interest (ie, painting himself squarely as the victim).

[David S]

I think they should take the bullet out. The kid's story sounds hokey and removing the bullet is probably  a good idea for his health as well. Over a long period of time it might cause lead poisoning.  This way he gets it removed for free. The only reason for him not wanting it removed is that it might incriminate him.

[Queen Mum Inks.LWC]

I think they should take the bullet out. The kid's story sounds hokey and removing the bullet is probably  a good idea for his health as well. Over a long period of time it might cause lead poisoning.  This way he gets it removed for free. The only reason for him not wanting it removed is that it might incriminate him.

Lead poisoning would be minimal.

And AkSaber, a woman in Detroit was shot in the temple, called police and they didn't believer her (this was an incident before the 911 call where they thought the boy was lying about his mom dying).

[Ebowed]

He should be able to make his own medical decisions without state interference.  Just because the police want a medical procedure performed on a boy, he has to comply?  How interesting that so-called libertarians support the actions of the police state.

[Undisguised Sockpuppet]

Rule him guilty and be done with it. Save "justice" for the middle and upper classes an focus on enforcement ofr the rest.

[The Man From G.O.P.]

If there is no easier way to prove it's a bullet...

Hope he enjoys prision either way.

HAHAHA, I'd love to attack you or something but that's so terribly funny and clever that I like it

[opebo]

Rule him guilty and be done with it. Save "justice" for the middle and upper classes an focus on enforcement ofr the rest.

Now this is the sort of right-winger I can respect - one who is honest about his ideology.

However, I would like to point out that he is merely describing the status quo.

[Undisguised Sockpuppet]

Rule him guilty and be done with it. Save "justice" for the middle and upper classes an focus on enforcement ofr the rest.

Now this is the sort of right-winger I can respect - one who is honest about his ideology.

However, I would like to point out that he is merely describing the status quo.

I'm not a rightwinger. I simply am not a fan of urban blight, crime and the gangsta "Culture". We need to crack down on it hard.

Secondly... no I'm not. Basically I'd give the cops in urban areas( now only hiring middle class suburban peple as cops) high leeway to shoot troublemakers, expand usage of the death penalty, end the war on drugs( legalize soft drugs, make hard drugs be handled by treatment and shoot hard drug dealers) to free up prison space and establish singapore style enforement.