McCain's funk
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Author Topic: McCain's funk  (Read 1831 times)
sethm0
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« on: January 03, 2007, 09:36:33 PM »


 I used to think that McCain would be almost unbeatable in 08. Now I'm really starting to wonder. I don't know if it's age or health or what, but it seems like McCain is just sort of going though the motions. He doesn't have the same vigor that he did in 2000.
   
 I'm starting to think that even if he runs, he won't project the right kind of energy and vitality, especially since all of his potential Democratic opponents are quite a bit more youthful than he.
   
 Does anyone else see this or is it just me?
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Democratic Hawk
LucysBeau
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« Reply #1 on: January 03, 2007, 09:40:22 PM »

   
Does anyone else see this or is it just me?

No it isn't just you. McCain is 70 years old and looks it. Doesn't seem to have much vigor at all nowadays

Dave
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TheresNoMoney
Scoonie
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« Reply #2 on: January 03, 2007, 10:21:36 PM »

His stance on the Iraq war is a huge strike against him. And I think Americans will be looking for a fresh face in 2008.
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Moooooo
nickshepDEM
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« Reply #3 on: January 03, 2007, 10:24:07 PM »

How often does he vote with George Bush?
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jfern
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« Reply #4 on: January 03, 2007, 10:40:36 PM »

The problem for the Republicans is that their other possibilities are less attractive to the Republican command structure.
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Democratic Hawk
LucysBeau
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« Reply #5 on: January 03, 2007, 10:43:06 PM »

His stance on the Iraq war is a huge strike against him.

You hope Wink. Voters will be looking for more in presidential candidates as to whether they support the Iraq war or not. One issue of many for them to consider in 2008, albeit an immensely important one

A word of caution, which I elaborated on in another thread, an overwhelming majority of Connecticut voters opposed the Iraq war, as of November 2006, yet they still re-elected Joe Lieberman. Only those who strongly opposed it broke heavily in Lamont's favor

Democrats should do their best to tie McCain, as a Republican senator, in with aiding and abetting Bush's incompetence

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Maybe Wink

Dave
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Deano963
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« Reply #6 on: January 03, 2007, 10:56:29 PM »


No, he knows. McCain's stance of sending more troops in to Iraq is already hurting him in the polls. It is exactly why Hillary has actually lead him in three seperate polls.
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Democratic Hawk
LucysBeau
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« Reply #7 on: January 03, 2007, 11:00:23 PM »


No, he knows. McCain's stance of sending more troops in to Iraq is already hurting him in the polls. It is exactly why Hillary has actually lead him in three seperate polls.

As of now , indeed

Dave
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Rob
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« Reply #8 on: January 03, 2007, 11:13:07 PM »


And what makes you think that the situation in Iraq will be any better in two years?

Nominating an antiwar candidate doesn't ensure defeat, and nominating a prowar candidate doesn't ensure victory (see: John Kerry). The Democrats would have to be insane to take one of their best issues- the war- off the table, for the sake of appearing "tough on national security" (whatever that means).

The really gung-ho hawks that constantly bring up McGovern will never vote for any Democrat, anyway.
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adam
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« Reply #9 on: January 03, 2007, 11:22:34 PM »

McCain isn't what he used to be. He is now nothing more than an old, senile, pandering pseudo-centrist with the electability of day old dog sh**t (and that is being kind).

McCain used to be a figure I would trust to win, but these days...he is a sure loser.
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Democratic Hawk
LucysBeau
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« Reply #10 on: January 03, 2007, 11:36:53 PM »


And what makes you think that the situation in Iraq will be any better in two years?

I don't but one's allowed to be optimistic aren't they?

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I would Smiley. I wouldn't have voted for McGovern in 1972. I'd have cast a pro-Nixon vote rather than a pro-Republican vote. Just like in 1987, my first vote wasn't so much pro-Labour, more anti-Thatcher

Dave
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jfern
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« Reply #11 on: January 04, 2007, 12:02:19 AM »

His stance on the Iraq war is a huge strike against him.

You hope Wink. Voters will be looking for more in presidential candidates as to whether they support the Iraq war or not. One issue of many for them to consider in 2008, albeit an immensely important one

A word of caution, which I elaborated on in another thread, an overwhelming majority of Connecticut voters opposed the Iraq war, as of November 2006, yet they still re-elected Joe Lieberman. Only those who strongly opposed it broke heavily in Lamont's favor

Democrats should do their best to tie McCain, as a Republican senator, in with aiding and abetting Bush's incompetence

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Maybe Wink

Dave

Only warmongers write off the Iraq war as "just one issue".
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Politico
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« Reply #12 on: January 04, 2007, 12:16:23 AM »

In 1966, many people thought Johnson/Humphrey would be unstoppable in '69. Look at what Vietnam ended up doing to both Johnson and Humphrey instead. Just like Vietnam did in Humphrey, Iraq will do in McCain if he wins the Republican nomination.

McCain is going to look like a Bob Dole/Hubert Humphrey hybrid in another year and a half.
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Rob
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« Reply #13 on: January 04, 2007, 09:41:57 AM »

I don't but one's allowed to be optimistic aren't they?

Sure, but you're telling the Democrats to downplay their position on the war simply because of this optimism. There are other issues, of course, but Iraq is huge... and it's going to weigh down the GOP nominee.
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Democratic Hawk
LucysBeau
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« Reply #14 on: January 04, 2007, 10:05:03 AM »

Only warmongers write off the Iraq war as "just one issue".

Well, it is, and as I've said, albeit an immensely important one. I'm just saying there are other factors, in addition to Iraq, to take into account

Dave
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Democratic Hawk
LucysBeau
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« Reply #15 on: January 04, 2007, 10:07:13 AM »

In 1966, many people thought Johnson/Humphrey would be unstoppable in '69. Look at what Vietnam ended up doing to both Johnson and Humphrey instead. Just like Vietnam did in Humphrey, Iraq will do in McCain if he wins the Republican nomination.


The Vietnam War continued through Richard Nixon's first term and we all know how it sank his re-election bid in 1972

Dave
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Democratic Hawk
LucysBeau
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« Reply #16 on: January 04, 2007, 10:39:33 AM »

I don't but one's allowed to be optimistic aren't they?

There are other issues, of course, but Iraq is huge... and it's going to weigh down the GOP nominee.

And so it should. While, broadly, supportive of the Iraq war as I am, I'm hardly enamored with the way it has been prosecuted. And just about all the blame for that can be levelled at Rumsfeld and, ultimately, Bush. So why shouldn't that rub off on the likes of McCain? As a pro-war Republican, he's aided and abetted that incompetence to some degree or another. But will it, ultimately, matter? Perhaps McCain sees sending more troops in the short-term as a means of rectifying past strategic inadequacies

After all, in 2006, anti-Iraq war as Connecticut is, it still relected Lieberman. And using that logic, does such a strong anti-Iraq war feeling nationally necessarily bode ill for McCain? That's all I'm saying

Dave
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Reaganfan
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« Reply #17 on: January 04, 2007, 11:26:59 AM »

I think in the end, people will be looking for a leader. McCain does have a leadership persona about him...and we will have to wait and see if it pays off.
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Verily
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« Reply #18 on: January 04, 2007, 11:36:10 AM »

In 1966, many people thought Johnson/Humphrey would be unstoppable in '69. Look at what Vietnam ended up doing to both Johnson and Humphrey instead. Just like Vietnam did in Humphrey, Iraq will do in McCain if he wins the Republican nomination.


The Vietnam War continued through Richard Nixon's first term and we all know how it sank his re-election bid in 1972

Dave

Nixon gave the public the impression that the war was ending, something Johnson and Humphrey, and now Bush & co., failed to do.
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Bay Ridge, Bklyn! Born and Bred
MikeyCNY
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« Reply #19 on: January 04, 2007, 01:14:37 PM »

The War in Iraq will not weigh down McCain at all, especially if he runs against Edwards or Hillary, both of whom voted for the war.

Pro-war hawks have always fared well in national elections even if the war in question was hugely unpopular (Korea, Vietnam, Iraq). 

Any Republican presidential candidate will not be hurt in any way for his/her continued support for the Iraq war
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TheresNoMoney
Scoonie
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« Reply #20 on: January 04, 2007, 01:19:27 PM »

Any Republican presidential candidate will not be hurt in any way for his/her continued support for the Iraq war

Futher evidence that this guy is a Republican troll.
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jfern
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« Reply #21 on: January 04, 2007, 01:21:23 PM »

Any Republican presidential candidate will not be hurt in any way for his/her continued support for the Iraq war

Futher evidence that this guy is a Republican troll.

Maybe another account from DWTL?
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Rob
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« Reply #22 on: January 04, 2007, 01:31:41 PM »

After all, in 2006, anti-Iraq war as Connecticut is, it still relected Lieberman. And using that logic, does such a strong anti-Iraq war feeling nationally necessarily bode ill for McCain?

That's one way to spin it. But the only reason he was ever in any kind of danger was his support for the war. Anger at the war was so powerful that Lieberman- a national figure who had run for Vice President on the Democratic ticket- lost his own party's primary to a political novice. He then had to fight for his political life in the general.

Clearly, Iraq is no normal issue, and it will drag down the Republican nominee. Does it guarantee victory for the Democrats? Of course not. But it does greatly help them. It's rather astonishing that you won't admit this.
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #23 on: January 04, 2007, 01:48:08 PM »

But the only reason he was ever in any kind of danger was his support for the war.

I think it wasn't so much his support for the invasion that landed him in a wee bit of trouble, it was the way he supported it and his apparent support for the way things have been (mis)managed in Iraq since summer 2003 or so.

Not that that's exactly good news for McCain.
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