European Football Thread

[Tetro Kornbluth]

Not that it was unexpected but still...

Time for the FAI to evict Mr. Delaney and his "world class management team".

And replace them with Clueless Hack #1248 and John Aldridge.. as that is what would happen, sadly.

I still think we should never have sacked Kerr.. (or rather; we should have shot all the Keano-loving media which hounded Mick McCarthy out of the job in the first place.)

I can't believe it.. but it's six years since Jason McAteer scored against the Dutch.

[Јas]

Not that it was unexpected but still...

Time for the FAI to evict Mr. Delaney and his "world class management team".

And replace them with Clueless Hack #1248 and John Aldridge.. as that is what would happen, sadly.

You never know. The job isn't as unappealing as it was when Staunton took over. Reasonable group of young players coming through, and it looks fairly certain that we'll be 3rd seeds in the next World Cup qualification draw. Qualification and success should be easier.

But, if they're really stuck, I'd do it.

I still think we should never have sacked Kerr.. (or rather; we should have shot all the Keano-loving media which hounded Mick McCarthy out of the job in the first place.)

Kerr's sacking may have been premature. I thought at the time it was a bit of a 50-50 call, myself. That though was predicated on the belief that a reasonably good manager would be brought in...

And as to Irish Civil War II, from your comments, I suspect we would have been on different sides, so I'll leave that one alone.

[minionofmidas]

Id gladly hire you as Ireland manager.

[Tetro Kornbluth]

Not that it was unexpected but still...

Time for the FAI to evict Mr. Delaney and his "world class management team".

And replace them with Clueless Hack #1248 and John Aldridge.. as that is what would happen, sadly.

You never know. The job isn't as unappealing as it was when Staunton took over. Reasonable group of young players coming through, and it looks fairly certain that we'll be 3rd seeds in the next World Cup qualification draw. Qualification and success should be easier.

But, if they're really stuck, I'd do it.

I still think we should never have sacked Kerr.. (or rather; we should have shot all the Keano-loving media which hounded Mick McCarthy out of the job in the first place.)

Kerr's sacking may have been premature. I thought at the time it was a bit of a 50-50 call, myself. That though was predicated on the belief that a reasonably good manager would be brought in...

And as to Irish Civil War II, from your comments, I suspect we would have been on different sides, so I'll leave that one alone.

I don't really see how it's more appealing now.. How many of our players by 2009 really have a good record in big pressure games - by then how many will be WC2002 leftovers? Not many - will Damien Duff ever play well for Ireland again? Unlikely. Will we have a new strategy then will somehow create a forcefield around our goal during the 90th minute - because I think that's our best chance for WC2010?

And who the bloody hell in the whole of Ireland is actually competent enough to run the FAI?

As I don't correspond much with traitors; I'll leave the rest of our commentary alone.

[Јas]

I don't really see how it's more appealing now.. How many of our players by 2009 really have a good record in big pressure games - by then how many will be WC2002 leftovers? Not many - will Damien Duff ever play well for Ireland again? Unlikely. Will we have a new strategy then will somehow create a forcefield around our goal during the 90th minute - because I think that's our best chance for WC2010?

So I can put you down as an undecided then to be my assistant when I submit my application then?

Taking a look at the squad re:2009...
Given should still be there. At the back Finnan is now 31, so he'd be fit (and make the team) at least until 2010 - it's just a matter of making sure he doesn't retire from internationals. Kilbane at 30 is a similar concern but I suspect he'll keep playing as long as he can. Apart from that Dunne; McShane; O'Shea will be available for years. A back four of Finnan; Dunne; McShane and Kilbane should be competent.

In the middle the only realistic chance of a retirement is Carsley. The rest are all fairly young. In fact, their problem is largely lack of experience. Reid, Hunt and Duff are likely to be a part of things. Beyond that, we'll have to see how Ireland; McGeady; Douglas; Potter and Gibson develop. 4 good midfielders shouldn't be an unreasonable expectation.

Keane and Doyle will also be around for a while yet. I also have big hopes for Shane Long - i think he's potentially better than either of them.

This list contains some solid attacking players who can produce the necessary moments of flair to break a game open. I just don't think Steve Staunton is fit to lead them.

And who the bloody hell in the whole of Ireland is actually competent enough to run the FAI?

Good question. Unfortunately I've no answer to that one.

As I don't correspond much with traitors; I'll leave the rest of our commentary alone.

[Tetro Kornbluth]

I don't really see how it's more appealing now.. How many of our players by 2009 really have a good record in big pressure games - by then how many will be WC2002 leftovers? Not many - will Damien Duff ever play well for Ireland again? Unlikely. Will we have a new strategy then will somehow create a forcefield around our goal during the 90th minute - because I think that's our best chance for WC2010?

So I can put you down as an undecided then to be my assistant when I submit my application then?

Taking a look at the squad re:2009...
Given should still be there. At the back Finnan is now 31, so he'd be fit (and make the team) at least until 2010 - it's just a matter of making sure he doesn't retire from internationals. Kilbane at 30 is a similar concern but I suspect he'll keep playing as long as he can. Apart from that Dunne; McShane; O'Shea will be available for years. A back four of Finnan; Dunne; McShane and Kilbane should be competent.

In the middle the only realistic chance of a retirement is Carsley. The rest are all fairly young. In fact, their problem is largely lack of experience. Reid, Hunt and Duff are likely to be a part of things. Beyond that, we'll have to see how Ireland; McGeady; Douglas; Potter and Gibson develop. 4 good midfielders shouldn't be an unreasonable expectation.

Keane and Doyle will also be around for a while yet. I also have big hopes for Shane Long - i think he's potentially better than either of them.

This list contains some solid attacking players who can produce the necessary moments of flair to break a game open. I just don't think Steve Staunton is fit to lead them.

Ack... I'm sorry but we're in trouble if one of our most experienced players is Kevin Kilbane. (No doubt whoever is Irish Manager come late 2008 will continue to play him; due to the 2nd Commandment of Irish Football: "Thou Shall always Play Kevin "Zinedine" Kilbane".) Duff and Keane.. well.. their Ireland form has been patchy at best since McCarthy left and IIRC since then the best team we have beaten in a competitive game are Slovakia; then Georgia.. hardly an impressive list.

IYRC when Mick McCarthy took over after Jack Charlton we were utterly gash for the entire of France 98' Qualfying... Playing that Man U traitor as sweeper, drawing with Iceland, losing in Macedonia.. and we only managed to make the play-offs because our major rival for them in our group was Lithuania, and then we got fairly owned by Belgium. But over time McCarthy managed to dramatically improve the Irish squad, admittely he did have some of the old 94' base and that Man U playing guy in the centre of Midfield (He was quite good... I think.) but the only way we can have any success as if we stop pretending we are a big football nation and just accept that we're not likely to qualify much and that we appoint managers to last at least four years so that they and only they can build the team - The nature of International football is such that team soliditary is a huge part of success; much more than at Club level and you can't have that if you sack your manager after every game. Though perhaps I would have thought differently I hadn't been in Sligo the day we lost 5-2 to Cyprus.

But hey Given the nature of the FAI and the desirability of the Ireland Job right now, I'd say you have a good shot.

[Јas]

Ack... I'm sorry but we're in trouble if one of our most experienced players is Kevin Kilbane. (No doubt whoever is Irish Manager come late 2008 will continue to play him; due to the 2nd Commandment of Irish Football: "Thou Shall always Play Kevin "Zinedine" Kilbane".)

Well, goodness knows, it took a long time for me to forgive him after the '02 WC match v. Spain, but he's not that bad. Obviously, you can't expect miracles from him, and he's never going to be the star of the side, but he's a competent player and worthy of his place. Unless and until the next generation (mentioned above) come through, he's acceptable.

Duff and Keane.. well.. their Ireland form has been patchy at best since McCarthy left and IIRC since then the best team we have beaten in a competitive game are Slovakia; then Georgia.. hardly an impressive list.

I'll grant you that for Duff (though I think he hasn't performed to potential for his club(s) either in the same timeframe). Keane blows hot and cold, again, much like for his club, but again the potential is most definitely there.

IYRC when Mick McCarthy took over after Jack Charlton we were utterly gash for the entire of France 98' Qualfying... Playing that Man U traitor as sweeper, drawing with Iceland, losing in Macedonia.. and we only managed to make the play-offs because our major rival for them in our group was Lithuania, and then we got fairly owned by Belgium. But over time McCarthy managed to dramatically improve the Irish squad, admittely he did have some of the old 94' base and that Man U playing guy in the centre of Midfield (He was quite good... I think.) but the only way we can have any success as if we stop pretending we are a big football nation and just accept that we're not likely to qualify much and that we appoint managers to last at least four years so that they and only they can build the team - The nature of International football is such that team soliditary is a huge part of success; much more than at Club level and you can't have that if you sack your manager after every game. Though perhaps I would have thought differently I hadn't been in Sligo the day we lost 5-2 to Cyprus.

I agree that, in general, managers should be given time to develop their teams. However, Staunton should never have been appointed to begin with, by any football side, to manage things. He simply isn't up to it. Giving him time, IMO, only digs the hole deeper and drags out the mistake.

McCarthy, much as I blame him completely for Siapan, wasn't a brilliant manager, but he certainly had a level of competence, which I don't credit Staunton with. I don't accept that they are comparable.

I cringe every time I see/hear an interview with Staunton. It's reminiscent of George W, in his ability to convey a complete disengagment with the situation or pertinant issues. IMO he is clearly very far out of his depth and we can do better.

[Tetro Kornbluth]

No I don't think Kilbane is that bad; I just find it amusing that's almost never, ever dropped for such an average player.

Generally I actually agree with what you say; but unless we have a replacement for Staunton what can we do? (And again who would want the Job?)

[Gustaf]

Things are heating up for the final rounds coming later on. I'm rooting for France+Scotland, Finland+Serbia, Sweden+Denmark, Norway+Greece and England+Croatia in the still contested groups (I'm counting Romania+Holland and Germany+Czech Rep. as safe). I think Italy, Portugal, Spain and Turkey are gonna make it though, probably knocking out Finland Denmark, Norway and France/Scotland (can't make up my mind there).

[Јas]

Bye, Bye Stan!

"I'm the boss. I'm the gaffer. At the end of the day what I say goes. The buck stops with me."
So said Stan at his first press conference when he was unveiled by the FAI as the new Irish manager after they promised to bring in 'world-class' management.



This morning he is no more - hurrah!!

[Tetro Kornbluth]

So, how long till we appoint John Aldridge?

[Јas]

So, how long till we appoint John Aldridge?

We dare not even suggest such things!

[afleitch]

Scotland have moved to within two places of England in the FIFA world rankings, to 13th place behind England at 11th. While the rankings themselves are questionable, they do count when it comes to 'seeding' teams for future competitions.

[Јas]

Scotland have moved to within two places of England in the FIFA world rankings, to 13th place behind England at 11th. While the rankings themselves are questionable, they do count when it comes to 'seeding' teams for future competitions.

Which is why our game against Wales is still important. We're hanging onto a third seeding but if results go against us, then we'll face a heck of challenge qualifying for 2010.

[minionofmidas]

Anybody else seen the Scotland vs Italy game?

Pre-game situation: It's Scotland's last game. If Italy wins, Italy and France qualify. To get to my personally preferred outcome of Italy and Scotland qualifying, Scotland would need at least a draw and France would have to lose their last game against Ukraine on wednesday. (And Italy need to win their last match against Andorra wednesday, but that's a formality.) Scotland winning today and France at least drawing their last game gives us Scotland and France. I forget what happens if this game draws and France doesn't lose. Not that it matters as things turned out.

Synopsis of important situations during the game:
2nd minute: Italy go up 1-0.
17th or so minute: Scots want a penalty for hand play, which isn't granted, probably correctly all things told.
30th or so minute: Italy go up 2-0. The linesman claims to have seen an offside position somewhere. No one knows how he came up with that - at no point during the entire scene was any Italian behind the last Scottish defender. No goal.
65th minute: Scotland equalize. This was actually offside, though hard to see.
Injury time: Italy, who by now seem happy enough with the draw actually, get awarded a highly dubious free kick that leads to them going up 2-1.

Synopsis on German tv (three hours after the game), in chronological order:
Weeping Scotland fans.
Scottish players coming out again 15 minutes after the game.
Endless harping on the strange free kick.
Italian 2-1
More harping on the strange free kick, complete with short excerpts from interviews and a castaway remark about how Italy "always" seem to have that kind of luck.
Italian 1-0.
The handplay scene - they admitted it wasn't really a penalty, I'll grant 'em that.
The game's best chance besides the goals (for Scotland, in the 45th minute)
Scotland's 1-1, shown from an angle where you couldn't guess the offside unless you knew about it beforehand, with no mention of offside.
Italian 2-1 again.
Some sanctimonious words about how success might cool tempers in Italy - as if club tifosi cared about the national team. Especially when there's more important issues around. As if the police should be allowed to get away with murder (literally, in case you haven't heard). Now that's when I really blew my top.
(Notice they left out the incorrectly called off Italian goal entirely.)

I dunno if this is really just lazyness (and maybe disappointment that Scotland didn't make it. Something I can sympathize with 100%. They deserved it.) or still sour grapes about losing the World Cup semifinal or whatever, but either way I'd like to see some heads rolling. Which won't happen of course.

[afleitch]

It was the wierdest game I have seen in a long time.

[The Man From G.O.P.]

It was the wierdest game I have seen in a long time.

Ditto, sad news for Scotland, too bad.

[Silent Hunter]

Half-time in the England-Croatia game and we're losing 2-0. We are so lunchmeat...

[Јas]

Half-time in the England-Croatia game and we're losing 2-0. We are so lunchmeat...

Well you've just been given a penalty for no apparent reason.

[Lief 🗽]

Wow, looks like none of the four teams from the United Kingdom will be qualifying. Fun stuff.

[Јas]

Wow, looks like none of the four teams from the United Kingdom will be qualifying. Fun stuff.

Spoke about 1 minute to soon.

[Lief 🗽]

[Tetro Kornbluth]

And you were right all along (unless Andorra score in the next..oh.. 55 seconds.)

I don't that it has ever happened before that none of the British Isles nations qualified for a major tournie. In 1994 there was Ireland only; and that is last one England missed and I can't remember any before that...

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Well Wales (out already) drew with Germany. Which is good as it means people here (North Wales is actually a Football area) will be happy tomorrow.

Re; England... obviously Mr Dreadful Combover needs to be fired. From a cannon.

[Јas]

And you were right all along (unless Andorra score in the next..oh.. 55 seconds.)

I don't that it has ever happened before that none of the British Isles nations qualified for a major tournie. In 1994 there was Ireland only; and that is last one England missed and I can't remember any before that...

Euro '84 in France.