European Football Thread

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England ties Isreal today


How long until McClaren is booted?

I haven't seen the press reaction today, but I'd suggest (despite the very poor results to date) that he will hold on until the end of this qualification run (or as long as England have a reasonable chance of qualification).

In Dublin, also under pressure Steve Staunton has managed to hold onto his job for another 4 days at least with a lacklustre 1-0 win over a really poor Welsh side, in the first ever soccer international at Croke Park. Going into this weekend, the general media consensus was that Staunton would need to beat both Wales and Slovakia (on Wednesday) to hold on.

[Јas]

England ties Isreal today

How long until McClaren is booted?

I haven't seen the press reaction today, but I'd suggest (despite the very poor results to date) that he will hold on until the end of this qualification run (or as long as England have a reasonable chance of qualification).

About three more games, then?

Well let's takes a look.

Next up, away to Andorra on Wednesday. Well, anything less than 3 points would almost certainly see McClaren resign - but I'll be generous and presume an away win.

Then away to Estonia on 6 June. Estonia are 0 for 4 at the minute so again 3 points to be expected. Again must win game, anything less may lead to a forced resignation.

Their third game isn't until 8 September, at home against Israel in Wembley. On paper should be a comfortable win. In practice, may be anything but. Anything less than a win, would make topping the group exceedingly difficult and coming second a real struggle.

So, McClaren will need at least win, win, draw to survive in the next three. Though if he makes if until the Israel game, I'd imagine he'll still be in charge for the Russia game on 12 September in Wembley. By which point, win, win, win may be enough to let him away with a draw against the Russians, but win, win, draw, would probably require a win against the Russians to hold on.

In Dublin, also under pressure Steve Staunton has managed to hold onto his job for another 4 days at least with a lacklustre 1-0 win over a really poor Welsh side, in the first ever soccer international at Croke Park. Going into this weekend, the general media consensus was that Staunton would need to beat both Wales and Slovakia (on Wednesday) to hold on.

I saw the last sixty minutes of that game, then I saw all of Lithuania vs France afterwards. Ireland vs Wales was several times more entertaining than that really lacklustre game.

Glad I missed it then.

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Ireland 1-0 Slovakia

Much better performance than the last few games. Keeps a tiny little bit of hope alive for qualification.

N Ireland 2-1 Sweden

Amazing first goal by Healy.
Amazing result.
NI top of the group with some serious teams in it.
Lawrie Sanchez is a miracle worker.

Andorra 0-3 England
As a result, in and of itself, no surprise. But the first half efforts of England were awful. Really awful. Luckily for them Mr. Gerrard played very well int he second half.

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Manchester United (SCO)

Chelsea (NIR)

Have there been major border redrawings that I missed?

With Scotland having Manchester and Northern Ireland taking London, does England still exist?

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When does NFL Europe start?

Its actually NFL Germany + Amsterdam ...

PS: It starts next Saturday, April 14.

Seriously though, how popular is it over there?

American football? Let me put it like this. I've never met, seen nor even heard of anyone who plays it anywhere in Europe.

Have you ever watched it yourself? The main problem that most Americans seem to have with soccer is that it doesn't have enough offense. Americans love high scoring games...maybe soccer should play with no goalie or one of the players drops back to goalie.

I've seen it on American movies...and I've played a little rugby. The problem is that it seems to one-dimensional. It's just people running into each other trying to get a ball a certain distance. Now, soccer is much more tactical and refined.

Actually the playbooks of both the defense and offense are very complicated with quite often hundreds of unique plays per side per team.

I've seen a few American football games (and made a few half hearted attempts to play). It's certainly one of the more enjoyable American sports to watch, but my biggest problem with it is the interminable number of pauses and breaks in play, which results in endless commercial breaks (ARGH!).

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Best Man U performance I've seen in a long time. Destroyed Roma after a fairly tame performance over 48 hours before in losing to Portsmouth.

By far the best Michael Carrick has ever played for them, very good effort by Alan Smith too. Wayne Rooney, though, still not playing at the level he can.

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Horrible, Horrible, Horrible, HORRIBLE events are occuring at this moment in time, Unspeakable really.

Surely not, United winning the title instead of Chelsea - good
Sunderland promoted under the guidance of the legend that is Roy Keane (who did turn around the awful work of the evil McCarthy) - excellent!

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AC Milan doesn't deserve to be in competition this year.

Strongly agree.

This year, despite all the star power, has been a poor year for English clubs (even if you're a Man Utd. fan) I think next year will be a million times better.

Strongly disagree.
Liverpool, Chelsea and Man United made the Semi Finals of the Champion's League. This can't be brushed off as poor.

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AC Milan doesn't deserve to be in competition this year.

Strongly agree.

This year, despite all the star power, has been a poor year for English clubs (even if you're a Man Utd. fan) I think next year will be a million times better.

Strongly disagree.
Liverpool, Chelsea and Man United made the Semi Finals of the Champion's League. This can't be brushed off as poor.

I agree that we did well in the Champions league, but we lost, and the Prem was boring this year, only two teams ever has a shot, Arsenal wasn't competitive, Liverpool stopped caring many weeks before the end (try Christmas) and West Ham cheated and no justice was done.

Performance of teams in the Champion's League is a reasonably objective (or at least about as objective as is possible) measure of how strong the top teams in any particular league are.

Yes, Milan won, but by brushing off the fact that 3 Premiership teams made the semis - in describing it as a poor year for English clubs - this implicitly means that every other league (bar Serie A) had a 'poor year'. What exactly would make it a 'good year'?

As to the internal Premiership competitive balance, it's probably not fair to say that only two teams ever have a chance, things change from year to year. This year, Arsenal suffered because of Henry's injury trouble - had that not been the case, they could have been  serious challengers.

As for Liverpool, they stopped playing in the Premiership only when they got to the Champion's League semi - due to the importance of the semi (and later the final); and because it was only around that stage that they were solid for a top 4 finish and so qualification again next season (To say they stopped at Christmas is hardly fair, considering they were four for four in January).

Finally, as to West Ham, sure there was some sort of malarchy over the transfers, but I'm actually glad that it was the results on the pitch that decided matters, not some technical flaw in the transfers.

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Beckham back in the England squad

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Basically confirming what we already know.. the leagues outside the big five or so in Western Europe continue to get shafted.

I don't really think it's right to blame the big leagues for their success. It certainly isn't their fault that... for example, the Irish leagues...are hopeless.

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Basically confirming what we already know.. the leagues outside the big five or so in Western Europe continue to get shafted.

I don't really think it's right to blame the big leagues for their success. It certainly isn't their fault that... for example, the Irish leagues...are hopeless.

I was really referring to Eastern Europe rather than Ireland.. Ireland's just too damn small to have anything other than a glorified version of twenty-two lads in the park for some Friday night kickabout.

Also what Lewis said was accurate. The Spanish League was awful in the 70s and 80s (Despite having more money than most other leagues.. but not THAT much more money, like now.)

Well, I don't really buy the argument that it's because we're too small. I actually think that it's due to the complete dominance of the GAA. Consider the number of guys playing week in, week out in Gaelic Football and Hurling.

So long as football is the 3rd (maybe even the 4th sport after rugby) here, then our clubs are likely to remain ultra-marginal in the European context, unless some form of major re-structuring took place...á la the Celtic League in Rugby.

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Any thoughts on the European qualifiers? 

I am, shall we say...less than pleased, with our draw with Slovakia. Shambolic.
And whose fault is it?


No need to check your watch Steve, it's time to go.


Elsewhere, the North were unfortunate against Latvia, they deserved better on the day. Hugely dents their changes at progressing, redeemed somewhat by the Spanish failure against Iceland.

Saw a bit of the England and Scotland games, both did fine against relatively poor opposition. Not sure if anything much can be read into either game.

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Not that it was unexpected but still...

Time for the FAI to evict Mr. Delaney and his "world class management team".

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Not that it was unexpected but still...

Time for the FAI to evict Mr. Delaney and his "world class management team".

And replace them with Clueless Hack #1248 and John Aldridge.. as that is what would happen, sadly.

You never know. The job isn't as unappealing as it was when Staunton took over. Reasonable group of young players coming through, and it looks fairly certain that we'll be 3rd seeds in the next World Cup qualification draw. Qualification and success should be easier.

But, if they're really stuck, I'd do it.

I still think we should never have sacked Kerr.. (or rather; we should have shot all the Keano-loving media which hounded Mick McCarthy out of the job in the first place.)

Kerr's sacking may have been premature. I thought at the time it was a bit of a 50-50 call, myself. That though was predicated on the belief that a reasonably good manager would be brought in...

And as to Irish Civil War II, from your comments, I suspect we would have been on different sides, so I'll leave that one alone.

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I don't really see how it's more appealing now.. How many of our players by 2009 really have a good record in big pressure games - by then how many will be WC2002 leftovers? Not many - will Damien Duff ever play well for Ireland again? Unlikely. Will we have a new strategy then will somehow create a forcefield around our goal during the 90th minute - because I think that's our best chance for WC2010?

So I can put you down as an undecided then to be my assistant when I submit my application then?

Taking a look at the squad re:2009...
Given should still be there. At the back Finnan is now 31, so he'd be fit (and make the team) at least until 2010 - it's just a matter of making sure he doesn't retire from internationals. Kilbane at 30 is a similar concern but I suspect he'll keep playing as long as he can. Apart from that Dunne; McShane; O'Shea will be available for years. A back four of Finnan; Dunne; McShane and Kilbane should be competent.

In the middle the only realistic chance of a retirement is Carsley. The rest are all fairly young. In fact, their problem is largely lack of experience. Reid, Hunt and Duff are likely to be a part of things. Beyond that, we'll have to see how Ireland; McGeady; Douglas; Potter and Gibson develop. 4 good midfielders shouldn't be an unreasonable expectation.

Keane and Doyle will also be around for a while yet. I also have big hopes for Shane Long - i think he's potentially better than either of them.

This list contains some solid attacking players who can produce the necessary moments of flair to break a game open. I just don't think Steve Staunton is fit to lead them.

And who the bloody hell in the whole of Ireland is actually competent enough to run the FAI?

Good question. Unfortunately I've no answer to that one.

As I don't correspond much with traitors; I'll leave the rest of our commentary alone.

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Ack... I'm sorry but we're in trouble if one of our most experienced players is Kevin Kilbane. (No doubt whoever is Irish Manager come late 2008 will continue to play him; due to the 2nd Commandment of Irish Football: "Thou Shall always Play Kevin "Zinedine" Kilbane".)

Well, goodness knows, it took a long time for me to forgive him after the '02 WC match v. Spain, but he's not that bad. Obviously, you can't expect miracles from him, and he's never going to be the star of the side, but he's a competent player and worthy of his place. Unless and until the next generation (mentioned above) come through, he's acceptable.

Duff and Keane.. well.. their Ireland form has been patchy at best since McCarthy left and IIRC since then the best team we have beaten in a competitive game are Slovakia; then Georgia.. hardly an impressive list.

I'll grant you that for Duff (though I think he hasn't performed to potential for his club(s) either in the same timeframe). Keane blows hot and cold, again, much like for his club, but again the potential is most definitely there.

IYRC when Mick McCarthy took over after Jack Charlton we were utterly gash for the entire of France 98' Qualfying... Playing that Man U traitor as sweeper, drawing with Iceland, losing in Macedonia.. and we only managed to make the play-offs because our major rival for them in our group was Lithuania, and then we got fairly owned by Belgium. But over time McCarthy managed to dramatically improve the Irish squad, admittely he did have some of the old 94' base and that Man U playing guy in the centre of Midfield (He was quite good... I think.) but the only way we can have any success as if we stop pretending we are a big football nation and just accept that we're not likely to qualify much and that we appoint managers to last at least four years so that they and only they can build the team - The nature of International football is such that team soliditary is a huge part of success; much more than at Club level and you can't have that if you sack your manager after every game. Though perhaps I would have thought differently I hadn't been in Sligo the day we lost 5-2 to Cyprus.

I agree that, in general, managers should be given time to develop their teams. However, Staunton should never have been appointed to begin with, by any football side, to manage things. He simply isn't up to it. Giving him time, IMO, only digs the hole deeper and drags out the mistake.

McCarthy, much as I blame him completely for Siapan, wasn't a brilliant manager, but he certainly had a level of competence, which I don't credit Staunton with. I don't accept that they are comparable.

I cringe every time I see/hear an interview with Staunton. It's reminiscent of George W, in his ability to convey a complete disengagment with the situation or pertinant issues. IMO he is clearly very far out of his depth and we can do better.

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Bye, Bye Stan!

"I'm the boss. I'm the gaffer. At the end of the day what I say goes. The buck stops with me."
So said Stan at his first press conference when he was unveiled by the FAI as the new Irish manager after they promised to bring in 'world-class' management.



This morning he is no more - hurrah!!

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So, how long till we appoint John Aldridge?

We dare not even suggest such things!

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Scotland have moved to within two places of England in the FIFA world rankings, to 13th place behind England at 11th. While the rankings themselves are questionable, they do count when it comes to 'seeding' teams for future competitions.

Which is why our game against Wales is still important. We're hanging onto a third seeding but if results go against us, then we'll face a heck of challenge qualifying for 2010.

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Half-time in the England-Croatia game and we're losing 2-0. We are so lunchmeat...

Well you've just been given a penalty for no apparent reason.

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Wow, looks like none of the four teams from the United Kingdom will be qualifying. Fun stuff.

Spoke about 1 minute to soon.

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And you were right all along (unless Andorra score in the next..oh.. 55 seconds.)

I don't that it has ever happened before that none of the British Isles nations qualified for a major tournie. In 1994 there was Ireland only; and that is last one England missed and I can't remember any before that...

Euro '84 in France.

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Group 8
Italy [ Worst Draw Possible, but then the last time we played competitively was one of our greatest sporting moments]
Bulgaria [Besides Berbatov and petrov in the Premiership, I don't know anything about them.]
Rep. Ireland
Cyprus [ 4th time in 5 consecutive draws that we've been drawn together. Lately we look like cowboys playing against them.]
Georgia [ Highest ranked of the 5th seeds, not sure how well we'll get on in sunny Tblisi]
Montenegro [Best of the 6th seeds, but if they start taking points off us, then this whole endeavour is fairly futile]

2nd place is possible. But then if we don't turn things around so is 4th.


Some of the others...

Group 6
Croatia
England
Ukraine
Belarus
Kazakhstan
Andorra

England should be very happy with this.

Got plum draws from almost all those seeding pots - including Croatia. Will give the England fans another chance to boo the Croatian anthem in Wembley - what was all that about? (In fact, what was really confusing was John Motson on the BBC saying that it was well received )

Group 9
Netherlands
Scotland
Norway
Macedonia
Iceland

Could have been better, but on current form Scotland would have to anticipate getting out of the group.

Group 4
Germany
Russia
Finland
Wales
Azerbaijan
Liechtenstein

Unlikely Wales will be able to do much damage here. Don't see any difficulty for Germany.

Group 3 
Czech Republic
Poland
Northern Ireland
Slovakia
Slovenia
San Marino

The North face tricky ties in Eastern Europe. I don't expect them to make the top 2, but they're just after doing very well in a much tougher group so who knows.

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All eyes on Group C, anything could happen.
Group D is also wide open but with lesser quality.

Looking forward to it.