Results of the 1964 election if Kennedy was never assassinated?

[Eleden]

If John F. Kennedy was never assassinated what would've been the results of the 1964 election?

Honestly it's really difficult for me to figure this one out.  Obviously Johnson got a lot of sympathy support from the fact that Kennedy was killed.  It also helped that Barry Goldwater was insane.  Would Goldwater have still been the nominee?  Also would Kennedy have faired better than Johnson or would the results have favored the Republicans a little more?  The Civil Rights legislation hurt the Democrats standings in the south, but would Kennedy have been able to win them anyways?

It's obvious that he would've won though.

2nd Question:

What would've been the results of the 1968 election after Kennedy second term expired?  Johnson would probably have been the nominee since it's likely his popularity wouldn't have been low.  Kennedy would have gotten us out of Vietnam so that would've have plagued Johnson during the primary.  RFK only jumped in because McCarthy came close to winning the NH primary.  So Johnson is the nominee and Nixon is most likely the challenger.  What are the results?

[Dr. Cynic]

Given that you only have ten posts here, I suggest you read around a bit... You won't have to go far to find the answers you're looking for.

[Gustaf]

A few points: Kennedy wouldn't necessarily have avoided Vietnam. He may have, but it's far from a certainty.

Goldwater would probably have been the nominee anyway.

Kennedy would have beaten him anyway.

[Eleden]

Somebody asked my question already but nobody answered it.  That's why I'm asking again.  I'm just curious has to what you think the results might be.  

[CARLHAYDEN]

If John F. Kennedy was never assassinated what would've been the results of the 1964 election?

Honestly it's really difficult for me to figure this one out.  Obviously Johnson got a lot of sympathy support from the fact that Kennedy was killed.  It also helped that Barry Goldwater was insane.  Would Goldwater have still been the nominee?  Also would Kennedy have faired better than Johnson or would the results have favored the Republicans a little more?  The Civil Rights legislation hurt the Democrats standings in the south, but would Kennedy have been able to win them anyways?

It's obvious that he would've won though.

2nd Question:

What would've been the results of the 1968 election after Kennedy second term expired?  Johnson would probably have been the nominee since it's likely his popularity wouldn't have been low.  Kennedy would have gotten us out of Vietnam so that would've have plagued Johnson during the primary.  RFK only jumped in because Muskie came close to winning the NH primary.  So Johnson is the nominee and Nixon is most likely the challenger.  What are the results?

First, let me welcome you to the forum.

Second, posting statements like "Barry Goldwater was insane" will tend to cause many here to question your understanding.

Third, it was McCarthy who came close to winning the New Hampshire "beauty" contest, NOT Muskie (who ran unsucessfully in 1972).

[Dr. Cynic]

Somebody asked my question already but nobody answered it.  That's why I'm asking again.  I'm just curious has to what you think the results might be.  

Check out the History section... gporter asked about 1964 Election... Read either my or Capt. MikeyMike's answers... Or anyone else who answered the questions, I dunno if there was anyone else.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Kennedy would have gotten us out of Vietnam so that would've have plagued Johnson during the primary.

Rubbish; always remember that it was St Kennedy of Brookline's appointees that led LBJ (who was, and this should never be forgotton, a foreign policy ignorant) to escalate the war in Vietnam.
People only think that JFK would have gotten the U.S out of Vietnam because they want to think that he would have done...

[Eleden]

If John F. Kennedy was never assassinated what would've been the results of the 1964 election?

Honestly it's really difficult for me to figure this one out.  Obviously Johnson got a lot of sympathy support from the fact that Kennedy was killed.  It also helped that Barry Goldwater was insane.  Would Goldwater have still been the nominee?  Also would Kennedy have faired better than Johnson or would the results have favored the Republicans a little more?  The Civil Rights legislation hurt the Democrats standings in the south, but would Kennedy have been able to win them anyways?

It's obvious that he would've won though.

2nd Question:

What would've been the results of the 1968 election after Kennedy second term expired?  Johnson would probably have been the nominee since it's likely his popularity wouldn't have been low.  Kennedy would have gotten us out of Vietnam so that would've have plagued Johnson during the primary.  RFK only jumped in because Muskie came close to winning the NH primary.  So Johnson is the nominee and Nixon is most likely the challenger.  What are the results?

First, let me welcome you to the forum.

Second, posting statements like "Barry Goldwater was insane" will tend to cause many here to question your understanding.

Third, it was McCarthy who came close to winning the New Hampshire "beauty" contest, NOT Muskie (who ran unsucessfully in 1972).

Thank you for pointing that out, I didn't realize I made that mistake.  It doesn't seem to matter though since nobody is going to answer my question.

[Gustaf]

Kennedy would have gotten us out of Vietnam so that would've have plagued Johnson during the primary.

Rubbish; always remember that it was St Kennedy of Brookline's appointees that led LBJ (who was, and this should never be forgotton, a foreign policy ignorant) to escalate the war in Vietnam.
People only think that JFK would have gotten the U.S out of Vietnam because they want to think that he would have done...

My point exactly. Though, as you say yourself, Johnson didn't actively run foreign policy himself. Kennedy may have overruled these appointees. But that is a maybe only.

[Dr. Cynic]

Kennedy would have gotten us out of Vietnam so that would've have plagued Johnson during the primary.

Rubbish; always remember that it was St Kennedy of Brookline's appointees that led LBJ (who was, and this should never be forgotton, a foreign policy ignorant) to escalate the war in Vietnam.
People only think that JFK would have gotten the U.S out of Vietnam because they want to think that he would have done...

My point exactly. Though, as you say yourself, Johnson didn't actively run foreign policy himself. Kennedy may have overruled these appointees. But that is a maybe only.

It's impossible to know what Kennedy would've done... He was alot less stubborn and much more concerned with public opinion than bullish LBJ. Kennedy could've entered, realized it was unwinnable and withdrawn... We will never know.

[TommyC1776]

Actually I got a question for this post.  Would there have been debates in 1964 if Kennedy had lived?  I heard that there might've been.

[CARLHAYDEN]

Actually I got a question for this post.  Would there have been debates in 1964 if Kennedy had lived?  I heard that there might've been.

Probably.

Barry would have loved to debate Kennedy (they actually were good friends.  Kennedy would have been in an embarrasing situtation if he declined to debate Goldwater, as he had debated Nixon in 1960.

[Reignman]

JFK would've been re-elected in '64 by a comfortable margin.

[gorkay]

There probably would have been debates in 1964 had Kennedy lived, because he and Goldwater, who was a good friend (and was not "insane"), had already discussed the possibility. There was even an idea floated that they would tour the country on the same bus and stop to hold a series of debates along the way. I doubt that really would've happened, though.

I'm sure JFK would have won in '64... he was pretty popular, the economy was healthy, and a candidate with Goldwater's views simply wasn't electable back then. JFK may not have won by as wide a margin as Johnson did, though, because some of Johnson's margin came from a sympathy vote for JFK.

The assumption that LBJ would then have run in '68 assumes that he would have been on the ticket in '64, which is not a sure thing. He probably would have, especially if the election looked to be in the bag, but he wasn't the most popular man in the administration-- especially not with brother Bobby, who was JFK's closest and most trusted advisor. But-- suppose LBJ stayed on the ticket, and then Bobby decided to run for President in '68? It may well have happened.

I also think it's dangerous to assume that JFK wouldn't have taken a similar course on the war as LBJ. When LBJ escalated the war with the Gulf of Tonkin resolution, he did so on the advice of the same "best and brightest" who had advised JFK (and who, with incredible cowardice, abandoned Johnson when the war began to go sour). So presumably they would have told JFK to do the same thing. Whether or not he would have listened can be debated, though; as I said, his closest adviser was Bobby, and Bobby may have been able to talk some sense into him. But then again, maybe not.

[wdecker1]

Kennedy would have won.

[Robespierre's Jaw]

Kennedy would have won re-election by a landslide over Barry Goldwater. Kennedy's landslide over Goldwater wouldn't have been as big as the one in RL. However, Goldwater probably would have picked up Utah, Wyoming, North and South Dakota, Nebraska all those plains states. So Goldwater would probably have won something between 80 to 100 Electoral College votes. Whilst President Kennedy would have got the rest.

[AndrewTX]

Maybe something like this, but I'd say that would be the max for Goldwater.

[Undisguised Sockpuppet]

JFK would win but the GOP would run someone more credible so the GOP loses by a smaller margin.

[DanielX]

JFK would win but the GOP would run someone more credible so the GOP loses by a smaller margin.

Goldwater is very much credible. OTOH, he isn't exactly the most electable candidate, especially not in 1964.... (BTW Straha, don't presume Goldwater is that bad of a dude in your book. For one thing, he was both pro-legal-abortion and pro-gays-in-the-military... not traditional conservative positions).

JFK still wins. He's more charismatic than Goldwater, Vietnam wouldn't be biting him in the rear yet, and he will be perceived as being more moderate than Goldwater (a claim with some merit but not entirely true).

It will be a smaller margin, however. Goldwater and JFK were friends, so there won't be as much vicious rhetoric (I don't see the daisy commercial - Karl Rove has nothing on LBJ's canniness or ruthlessness! - coming in this alt-history). Also, no assassination-sympathy vote.

Goldwater wins most of the traditional-republican states that went for Johnson in our '64 election (like the Plains), plus most of the South. He loses about as badly as Bob Dole in 1996, I'd say.