Is Scientology a criminal organization?
       |           

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
April 16, 2024, 04:33:13 AM
News: Election Simulator 2.0 Released. Senate/Gubernatorial maps, proportional electoral votes, and more - Read more

  Talk Elections
  General Politics
  Political Debate (Moderator: Torie)
  Is Scientology a criminal organization?
« previous next »
Pages: [1] 2
Poll
Question: Is Scientology a criminal organization?
#1
Yes
 
#2
No
 
Show Pie Chart
Partisan results

Total Voters: 29

Author Topic: Is Scientology a criminal organization?  (Read 3892 times)
they don't love you like i love you
BRTD
Atlas Prophet
*****
Posts: 112,913
Ukraine


Political Matrix
E: -6.50, S: -6.67

P P
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« on: June 22, 2007, 11:30:08 PM »

Yes it is. If I were in power I would have it banned and shut down, because it is not a religion, it is a criminal organization comparable to the mafia. I believe it is already outlawed in Germany.
Logged
John Dibble
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 18,732
Japan


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #1 on: June 23, 2007, 12:17:29 AM »
« Edited: June 23, 2007, 12:22:11 AM by SE Magistrate John Dibble »

In many ways it is. Harassment of critics, pseudo-scientific medicine that claims it's religious to avoid the law, things that would be considered child labor and child abuse under normal conditions, and a long list of other things that are criminal. Not to mention the other just plain crappy things like breaking up families with their SP policy.

Oh, and let's not forget Operation Snow White, Scientology's attempt to infiltrate the US government. Or how about Operation Freakout, where they tried to get critic Paulette Cooper imprisoned or commited to an institution.
Logged
Gabu
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 28,386
Canada


Political Matrix
E: -4.32, S: -6.52

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #2 on: June 23, 2007, 12:28:49 AM »

The sooner Scientology goes away, the better.  It's a truly evil organization.
Logged
Sensei
senseiofj324
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 11,532
Panama


Political Matrix
E: -2.45, S: -5.57

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #3 on: June 23, 2007, 12:30:50 AM »

It's really despicable that an organization such as this would call itself a religion. It's just a thinly veiled crime syndicate.
Logged
Robespierre's Jaw
Senator Conor Flynn
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 8,129
Political Matrix
E: -4.90, S: -8.35

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #4 on: June 23, 2007, 02:52:17 AM »

Yes it is. If I were in power I would have it banned and shut down, because it is not a religion, it is a criminal organization comparable to the mafia. I believe it is already outlawed in Germany.

I'd have to agree with you there. The high ranking members of the church are so shifty it's not funny. Just like that time that British reporter got pissed off at on of the heads of Scientology. I can't wait until Scientology is banned from the Planet. I shall be counting down the days!
Logged
MaC
Milk_and_cereal
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 9,787


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #5 on: June 23, 2007, 02:54:26 AM »

Xenu is my Homeboy
Logged
Citizen James
James42
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 2,540


Political Matrix
E: -3.87, S: -2.78

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #6 on: June 23, 2007, 02:54:13 PM »

It is at the very least a very dangerous cult.  (and rather large by dangerous cult standards.)  Far bigger than the branch davidians, heaven's gate, and the Jim Jones followers.

I consider it very likely that they have activily consipired to break the law in several situations (such as encouraging the harassment and murder of individuals in some situations).
Logged
they don't love you like i love you
BRTD
Atlas Prophet
*****
Posts: 112,913
Ukraine


Political Matrix
E: -6.50, S: -6.67

P P
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #7 on: June 23, 2007, 03:02:49 PM »

The Church of Scientology should given 90 days to disband, or else the military shall seize all their offices, and all their leaders shall be arrested and imprisoned.
Logged
AkSaber
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 6,315
United States


Political Matrix
E: 9.16, S: -8.00

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #8 on: June 23, 2007, 09:47:45 PM »

The sooner Scientology goes away, the better.  It's a truly evil organization.
Logged
CultureKing
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 3,249
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #9 on: June 24, 2007, 02:10:45 AM »

After researching Scientology for awhile I have found that for the most part it is not as radical as nearly anyone believes, remember, EVERY religion has its radicals who are just crazy...
Logged
John Dibble
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 18,732
Japan


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #10 on: June 24, 2007, 08:43:08 AM »

After researching Scientology for awhile I have found that for the most part it is not as radical as nearly anyone believes, remember, EVERY religion has its radicals who are just crazy...

Here's the problem though - in order to advance in the religion you pretty much have to become more radical. Sure, new recruits won't be radicals. (they'll still be having their time and money taken away from them through the scam though) Seeing as the whole point is to advance from a state of pre-clear to the highest levels possible, most members who stay will eventually become radicals. They don't make you a radical overnight, but the end goal is to make you a loyal Scientology drone who will do anything whatsoever for the benefit of Scientology.

And now a few quotes from the founder of Scientology:

Never discuss Scientology with the critic. Just discuss his or her crimes, known and unknown. - L. Ron Hubbard

"Scientology is the only specific (cure) for radiation (atomic bomb) burns." - L. Ron Hubbard, ALL ABOUT RADIATION, p. 109

"Radiation is apparently enormously water-soluble as well as water removable. According to researchers, one merely has to take a hose to a building surface or a road to wash the radiation off of it. This factor is well known to defense trained personnel." - L. Ron Hubbard, Clear Body, Clear Mind, page 47

"In any event, any person from 2.0 down on the Tone Scale should not have, in any thinking society, any civil rights of any kind, because by abusing those rights he brings into being arduous and strenuous laws which are oppressive to those who need no such restraints." - L. Ron Hubbard, SCIENCE OF SURVIVAL, 1989 Ed., p. 145 [The "Tone Scale" is Scientology's measure of mental and spiritual health.]  (note, anyone who criticizes Scientology is considered below a 2.0, also homosexuals are below a 2.0 IIRC)

"The sudden and abrupt deletion of all individuals occupying the lower bands of the Tone Scale from the social order would result in an almost instant rise in the cultural tone and would interrupt the dwindling spiral into which any society may have entered." - L. Ron Hubbard, SCIENCE OF SURVIVAL, p. 170

"A Venezuelan dictator once decided to stop leprosy. He saw that most lepers in his country were also beggars. By the simple expedient of collecting and destroying all the beggars in Venezuela an end was put to leprosy in that country." - L. Ron Hubbard, SCIENCE OF SURVIVAL, p. 171

"Unfortunately, it is all too often true that suppressors to a creative action must be removed before construction and creation takes place. Any person very high on the Tone Scale may level destruction toward a suppressor." - L. Ron Hubbard, SCIENCE OF SURVIVAL, p. 159

"Somebody some day will say 'this is illegal.' By then be sure the orgs [Scientology organizations] say what is legal or not." - L. Ron Hubbard, Hubbard Communications Office Policy Letter, 4 January 1966, "LRH Relationship to Orgs"

"If attacked on some vulnerable point by anyone or anything or any organization, always find or manufacture enough threat against them to cause them to sue for peace. Peace is bought with an exchange of advantage, so make the advantage and then settle. Don't ever defend. Always attack. Don't ever do nothing. Unexpected attacks in the rear of the enemy's front ranks work best." - L. Ron Hubbard, Hubbard Communications Office Policy Letter, "Department of Governmental Affairs", 15 Aug 1960

"The purpose of the suit is to harass and discourage rather than to win. The law can be used very easily to harass, and enough harassment on somebody who is simply on the thin edge anyway, well knowing that he is not authorized, will generally be sufficient to cause his professional decease. If possible, of course, ruin him utterly." - L. Ron Hubbard, A MANUAL ON THE DISSEMINATION OF MATERIAL, 1955

"In short a staff member can get away with murder so long as his statistic is up and can't sneeze without a chop if it's down. ... When people do start reporting a staff member with a high statistic, what you investigate is the person who turned in the report." - L. Ron Hubbard, HCO PL 1 September 1965, "Ethics Protection" (translation - if a member reports something bad about someone who makes a lot of money for Scientology, that person is against Scientology. Anyone high statistic person, the money makers, are considered above the law as far as Scientology is concerned)

"ENEMY SP Order. Fair game. May be deprived of property or injured by any means by any Scientologist without any discipline of the Scientologist. May be tricked, sued or lied to or destroyed." - L. Ron Hubbard, Hubbard Communications Office Policy Letter, 18 October 1967 [SP = Suppressive Person a.k.a. critic of Scientology]

"A truly Suppressive Person or group has no rights of any kind and actions taken against them are not punishable." - L. Ron Hubbard, Hubbard Communications Office Policy Letter, 1 March 1965,HCO (Division 1) "Ethics, Suppressive Acts, Suppression of Scientology and Scientologists"

"The practice of declaring people FAIR GAME will cease. FAIR GAME may not appear on any Ethics Order. It causes bad public relations. This P/L does not cancel any policy on the treatment or handling of an SP." - L. Ron Hubbard, Hubbard Communications Office Policy Letter, 21 October 1968, "Cancellation of Fair Game" (This is a lie - critics have continued to be harassed constantly and every attempt is made to ruin their lives)

"When you move off a point of power, pay all your obligations on the nail, empower all your friends completely and move off with your pockets full of artillery, potential blackmail on every erstwhile rival, unlimited funds in your private account and the addresses of experienced assassins and go live in Bulgravia [sic] and bribe the police." - L. Ron Hubbard, Hubbard Communications Office Policy Letter, 12 February 1967, "The Responsibilities of Leaders"

Here's a lark - "There is no more ethical group on this planet than ourselves." - L. Ron Hubbard, KEEPING SCIENTOLOGY WORKING. 7 February 1965, reissued 27 August 1980

"They smell of all the baths they didn't take. The trouble with China is, there are too many chinks here." - L. Ron Hubbard's diary, 1928. (via Jon Atack, A PIECE OF BLUE SKY: SCIENTOLOGY, DIANETICS AND L. RON HUBBARD EXPOSED. Lyle Stuart/Carol Publishing Group 1990)

"A psychiatrist today has the power to (1) take a fancy to a woman (2) lead her to take wild treatment as a joke (3) drug and shock her to temporary insanity (4) incarnate [sic] her (5) use her sexually (6) sterilise her to prevent conception (7) kill her by a brain operation to prevent disclosure. And all with no fear of reprisal. Yet it is rape and murder. We want at least one bad mark on every psychiatrist in England, a murder, an assault, or a rape or more than one. This is Project Psychiatry. We will remove them." - L. Ron Hubbard, Sec ED, Office of LRH, Confidential, 22 February 1966, "Project Psychiatry"

"Now, get this as a technical fact, not a hopeful idea. Every time we have investigated the background of a critic of Scientology, we have found crimes for which that person or group could be imprisoned under existing law. We do not find critics of Scientology who do not have criminal pasts." - L. Ron Hubbard, Hubbard Communications Office Bulletin, 5 November 1967, "Critics of Scientology"

"We're playing for blood, the stake is EARTH." - L. Ron Hubbard, Hubbard Communications Office Policy Letter, 7 November 1962

"THE ONLY WAY YOU CAN CONTROL PEOPLE IS TO LIE TO THEM. You can write that down in your book in great big letters. The only way you can control anybody is to lie to them." - L. Ron Hubbard, "Off the Time Track," lecture of June 1952, excerpted in JOURNAL OF SCIENTOLOGY issue 18-G, reprinted in TECHNICAL VOLUMES OF DIANETICS & SCIENTOLOGY, vol. 1, p. 418

"Scientology...is not a religion." - L. Ron Hubbard, CREATION OF HUMAN ABILITY, 1954, p. 251

"This [Scientology] is useful knowledge. With it the blind again see, the lame walk, the ill recover, the insane become sane and the sane become saner. By its use the thousand abilities Man has sought to recover become his once more." - L. Ron Hubbard, SCIENTOLOGY: A HISTORY OF MAN, 1952

"Leukaemia is evidently psychosomatic in origin and at least eight cases of leukaemia had been treated successfully by Dianetics after medicine had traditionally given up. The source of leukaemia has been reported to be an engram containing the phrase 'It turns my blood to water.'" - L. Ron Hubbard, "Journal of Scientology," Issue 15-G, 1953

"Don't break your back scrubbing floors. Get yourself a n, that's what they were born for." - L. Ron Hubbard, in a letter to his 2nd wife

Some more here: http://www.holysmoke.org/cos/quotes-by-and-about-hubbard.htm

Also, here's a good example of a family with kids raised in Scientology - their story is not unique, btw. http://www.xenutv.com/interviews/woodcrafts.htm

CultureKing, what you need to understand is that it's not the individuals who compose this organization that are bad - in fact most of them are good people who honestly think they're helping the world, even when they're doing terrible things. Rather, the real problem is that the organization itself is corrupt, with those at the top tricking decent people into doing terrible things and throwing away their lives and money.
Logged
opebo
Atlas Legend
*****
Posts: 47,009


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #11 on: June 24, 2007, 01:06:03 PM »

Typical religion, folks.  In fact more human than most because it only harrassed freedom fighters rather than torturing and/or killing them.
Logged
Middle-aged Europe
Old Europe
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 17,199
Ukraine


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #12 on: June 24, 2007, 01:17:37 PM »


It isn't outlawed in Germany.

However, numerous institutions and groups in Germany refuse to recognize it as a religion and are officially opposed to the ideology and activities of Scientology.

- A German court ruled in 1995 that Scientology does not constitute a religion. Instead it was defined by the court as a "profit-oriented organization".

- If I'm not mistaken, several political parties in Germany have opted to bar Scientologists from membership.

- Germany's domestic intelligence agency (the Verfassungsschutz) is monitoring the activities of Scientology, arguing that the organization is trying to establish an authoritarian order.

- A recent example how the German state is dealing with Scientology: Tom Cruise is currently set to portray WWII officer Claus Stauffenberg, who tried to assassinate Adolf Hitler in 1944, in his next movie. Because of Cruise's affiliation with Scientology, German defense minister Franz Josef Jung has refused to give the production the permission to shoot on the compund of the German Ministry of Defense (where Stauffenberg was executed in 1944).
Logged
Tetro Kornbluth
Gully Foyle
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 12,846
Ireland, Republic of


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #13 on: June 24, 2007, 02:15:17 PM »

Typical religion, folks.  In fact more human than most because it only harrassed freedom fighters rather than torturing and/or killing them.

You do know, presuming you're real which I doubt, that you are the most zealous and devout person on this forum....

And to answer the question:

Probably.
Logged
they don't love you like i love you
BRTD
Atlas Prophet
*****
Posts: 112,913
Ukraine


Political Matrix
E: -6.50, S: -6.67

P P
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #14 on: June 24, 2007, 02:31:56 PM »

You do know, presuming you're real which I doubt,

Opebo is real, this has been proven. All the mods have confirmed that his IP address is located in Thailand, and google "opebo". Take a look at the other message boards he posts on. Yes, I think it's safe to say he does hire prostitutes.
Logged
Tetro Kornbluth
Gully Foyle
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 12,846
Ireland, Republic of


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #15 on: June 24, 2007, 02:36:34 PM »

You do know, presuming you're real which I doubt,

Opebo is real, this has been proven. All the mods have confirmed that his IP address is located in Thailand, and google "opebo". Take a look at the other message boards he posts on. Yes, I think it's safe to say he does hire prostitutes.

I know about the IP search turning up positive but there's no way his actual opinions are real.. especially given his conversion in 2004.
Logged
they don't love you like i love you
BRTD
Atlas Prophet
*****
Posts: 112,913
Ukraine


Political Matrix
E: -6.50, S: -6.67

P P
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #16 on: June 24, 2007, 02:46:24 PM »

He hated religion even as a Republican.
Logged
afleitch
Moderators
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 29,847


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #17 on: June 24, 2007, 03:05:10 PM »

It's about to acquire tax exempt status here in the UK. It will also technically qualify for a state funded 'faith school' , most likely in London.
Logged
J. J.
Atlas Superstar
*****
Posts: 32,892
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #18 on: June 24, 2007, 03:06:55 PM »

Are some members engaging in criminal activities?  Probably.

Is it a "criminal" organization?  That's stretching it a bit.
Logged
John Dibble
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 18,732
Japan


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #19 on: June 24, 2007, 05:30:59 PM »

Are some members engaging in criminal activities?  Probably.

Is it a "criminal" organization?  That's stretching it a bit.

If the members at the top are the ones who are engaging in criminal/borderline criminal activities, it's a pretty good indicator.
Logged
Speed of Sound
LiberalPA
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 14,166
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #20 on: June 24, 2007, 07:47:07 PM »

Criminal? Maybe

Crazy? Definetly
Logged
DuEbrithil
Rookie
**
Posts: 121


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #21 on: June 25, 2007, 01:24:58 AM »

its a cult, its not the mafia.
Logged
Gustaf
Moderators
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 29,775


Political Matrix
E: 0.39, S: -0.70

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #22 on: June 25, 2007, 05:05:34 AM »

You do know, presuming you're real which I doubt,

Opebo is real, this has been proven. All the mods have confirmed that his IP address is located in Thailand, and google "opebo". Take a look at the other message boards he posts on. Yes, I think it's safe to say he does hire prostitutes.

Yes, I think it's safe to say you do obsess about him in an unhealthy way.

I agree with Lewis on both accounts, by teh way. And yes, it's a criminal organization.
Logged
Bono
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 11,699
United Kingdom


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #23 on: June 25, 2007, 05:08:18 AM »

You do know, presuming you're real which I doubt,

Opebo is real, this has been proven. All the mods have confirmed that his IP address is located in Thailand, and google "opebo". Take a look at the other message boards he posts on. Yes, I think it's safe to say he does hire prostitutes.

Yes, I think it's safe to say you do obsess about him in an unhealthy way.

I agree with Lewis on both accounts, by teh way. And yes, it's a criminal organization.

Gully Foyle isn't Lewis.
Logged
Gustaf
Moderators
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 29,775


Political Matrix
E: 0.39, S: -0.70

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #24 on: June 25, 2007, 05:11:59 AM »

You do know, presuming you're real which I doubt,

Opebo is real, this has been proven. All the mods have confirmed that his IP address is located in Thailand, and google "opebo". Take a look at the other message boards he posts on. Yes, I think it's safe to say he does hire prostitutes.

Yes, I think it's safe to say you do obsess about him in an unhealthy way.

I agree with Lewis on both accounts, by teh way. And yes, it's a criminal organization.

Gully Foyle isn't Lewis.

Are you sure?
Logged
Pages: [1] 2  
« previous next »
Jump to:  


Login with username, password and session length

Terms of Service - DMCA Agent and Policy - Privacy Policy and Cookies

Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines

Page created in 0.059 seconds with 14 queries.