Does Corzine deserve to get re-elected?

[minionofmidas]

Given that he'll likely be up against a typical New Jersey Republican - yes, obviously. I can't decide whether he deserves to be primaried... although anyone who could actually beat him in a primary would probably also be worse.

He'll be going up against Christopher Christie, it looks like, and he doesn't exactly qualify as a typical New Jersey Republican.

From a cursory glance at Wiki and a few random links... I fail to see any phrase that might describe him equally well.

[Small Business Owner of Any Repute]

Given that he'll likely be up against a typical New Jersey Republican - yes, obviously. I can't decide whether he deserves to be primaried... although anyone who could actually beat him in a primary would probably also be worse.

He'll be going up against Christopher Christie, it looks like, and he doesn't exactly qualify as a typical New Jersey Republican.

From a cursory glance at Wiki and a few random links... I fail to see any phrase that might describe him equally well.

How's this for starters: unlike the typical New Jersey Republican, Christopher Christie actually has some accomplishments?

[minionofmidas]

Given that he'll likely be up against a typical New Jersey Republican - yes, obviously. I can't decide whether he deserves to be primaried... although anyone who could actually beat him in a primary would probably also be worse.

He'll be going up against Christopher Christie, it looks like, and he doesn't exactly qualify as a typical New Jersey Republican.

From a cursory glance at Wiki and a few random links... I fail to see any phrase that might describe him equally well.

How's this for starters: unlike the typical New Jersey Republican, Christopher Christie actually has some accomplishments?

I basically noted that he looked posh and was from Morris County. That should be enough to sink him. And then there's his whole involvement into the apparently rather bogus (as far as NJ politicians go. ) corruption charges against Menendez. That's not going to help either.

[Small Business Owner of Any Repute]

I basically noted that he looked posh and was from Morris County. That should be enough to sink him. And then there's his whole involvement into the apparently rather bogus (as far as NJ politicians go. ) corruption charges against Menendez. That's not going to help either.

Oh, I think Christie had good reason to dig into Menendez's past.  The 'Blue Jersey' charge of him being a partisan prosecutor just doesn't add up: don't forget, this is a guy that the Bush administration wanted to axe in 2006.

[DownWithTheLeft]

Here are some of his accomplishments:

Civil Unions, expect gay marriage within a year.
First budget in 6 years with no new taxes, tax increase
$2,300,000,000  in tax relief
20% reduction in property taxes in new budget
Ban on dual office holding
Strongest global warming bill in the country
Government transparency, "christmas tree" gifts (earmarks) available to view online
Stem Cell research referendum
Significant tax cut for low income families, described as "a double tax cut"

The ones in bold are certainly not accomplishments by my standards.  Aside from, the dual office ban has not taken effect, my property taxes are going up 24%, so really he does nothing according to your list

The ones in bold also happen to be supported by the overwhelming majority of New Jerseyans except for gay marriage which is just a majority. Those are only for this year so far. Also the ban on dual office holding was just signed into law or will be before the 30th. As for your property taxes, I doubt they went up 24% and you should expect your tax cut soon.
Since 1996, my property taxes have gone up by 50%, which is ridiculous. So I doubt yours have gone up by 24% in just one year.

I strongly advise you ask someone you know that lives in this area, because my taxes are going up 24%, although I doubt there is an article about it online.

Thats about as likely to be true as you being a libertarian. 

Finally you acknowledge!  However, my property taxes are going up 24%, which I guess is not really a state issue, however, I don't need any new state taxes when my property taxes are like that.  Are the town's reassesment last year we have gone through the roof.  When my parents moved in in the late 80s, the taxes were about $4,000 and next year they will be about $14,000

[Small Business Owner of Any Repute]

Here are some of his accomplishments:

Civil Unions, expect gay marriage within a year.
First budget in 6 years with no new taxes, tax increase
$2,300,000,000  in tax relief
20% reduction in property taxes in new budget
Ban on dual office holding
Strongest global warming bill in the country
Government transparency, "christmas tree" gifts (earmarks) available to view online
Stem Cell research referendum
Significant tax cut for low income families, described as "a double tax cut"

The ones in bold are certainly not accomplishments by my standards.  Aside from, the dual office ban has not taken effect, my property taxes are going up 24%, so really he does nothing according to your list

The ones in bold also happen to be supported by the overwhelming majority of New Jerseyans except for gay marriage which is just a majority. Those are only for this year so far. Also the ban on dual office holding was just signed into law or will be before the 30th. As for your property taxes, I doubt they went up 24% and you should expect your tax cut soon.
Since 1996, my property taxes have gone up by 50%, which is ridiculous. So I doubt yours have gone up by 24% in just one year.

I strongly advise you ask someone you know that lives in this area, because my taxes are going up 24%, although I doubt there is an article about it online.

Thats about as likely to be true as you being a libertarian. 

Finally you acknowledge!  However, my property taxes are going up 24%, which I guess is not really a state issue, however, I don't need any new state taxes when my property taxes are like that.  Are the town's reassesment last year we have gone through the roof.  When my parents moved in in the late 80s, the taxes were about $4,000 and next year they will be about $14,000

Dude, your property taxes?  Aren't you sixteen?

[DownWithTheLeft]

Here are some of his accomplishments:

Civil Unions, expect gay marriage within a year.
First budget in 6 years with no new taxes, tax increase
$2,300,000,000  in tax relief
20% reduction in property taxes in new budget
Ban on dual office holding
Strongest global warming bill in the country
Government transparency, "christmas tree" gifts (earmarks) available to view online
Stem Cell research referendum
Significant tax cut for low income families, described as "a double tax cut"

The ones in bold are certainly not accomplishments by my standards.  Aside from, the dual office ban has not taken effect, my property taxes are going up 24%, so really he does nothing according to your list

The ones in bold also happen to be supported by the overwhelming majority of New Jerseyans except for gay marriage which is just a majority. Those are only for this year so far. Also the ban on dual office holding was just signed into law or will be before the 30th. As for your property taxes, I doubt they went up 24% and you should expect your tax cut soon.
Since 1996, my property taxes have gone up by 50%, which is ridiculous. So I doubt yours have gone up by 24% in just one year.

I strongly advise you ask someone you know that lives in this area, because my taxes are going up 24%, although I doubt there is an article about it online.

Thats about as likely to be true as you being a libertarian. 

Finally you acknowledge!  However, my property taxes are going up 24%, which I guess is not really a state issue, however, I don't need any new state taxes when my property taxes are like that.  Are the town's reassesment last year we have gone through the roof.  When my parents moved in in the late 80s, the taxes were about $4,000 and next year they will be about $14,000

Dude, your property taxes?  Aren't you sixteen?

Yeah, so?  How much disposable income my family has effects things like what kind of car I will get next year when I drive and what things I can afford to buy without having to get a job. 

[Small Business Owner of Any Repute]

Here are some of his accomplishments:

Civil Unions, expect gay marriage within a year.
First budget in 6 years with no new taxes, tax increase
$2,300,000,000  in tax relief
20% reduction in property taxes in new budget
Ban on dual office holding
Strongest global warming bill in the country
Government transparency, "christmas tree" gifts (earmarks) available to view online
Stem Cell research referendum
Significant tax cut for low income families, described as "a double tax cut"

The ones in bold are certainly not accomplishments by my standards.  Aside from, the dual office ban has not taken effect, my property taxes are going up 24%, so really he does nothing according to your list

The ones in bold also happen to be supported by the overwhelming majority of New Jerseyans except for gay marriage which is just a majority. Those are only for this year so far. Also the ban on dual office holding was just signed into law or will be before the 30th. As for your property taxes, I doubt they went up 24% and you should expect your tax cut soon.
Since 1996, my property taxes have gone up by 50%, which is ridiculous. So I doubt yours have gone up by 24% in just one year.

I strongly advise you ask someone you know that lives in this area, because my taxes are going up 24%, although I doubt there is an article about it online.

Thats about as likely to be true as you being a libertarian. 

Finally you acknowledge!  However, my property taxes are going up 24%, which I guess is not really a state issue, however, I don't need any new state taxes when my property taxes are like that.  Are the town's reassesment last year we have gone through the roof.  When my parents moved in in the late 80s, the taxes were about $4,000 and next year they will be about $14,000

Dude, your property taxes?  Aren't you sixteen?

Yeah, so?  How much disposable income my family has effects things like what kind of car I will get next year when I drive and what things I can afford to buy without having to get a job. 

If you're so into getting money for nothing, why aren't you a Democrat?

[DownWithTheLeft]

Here are some of his accomplishments:

Civil Unions, expect gay marriage within a year.
First budget in 6 years with no new taxes, tax increase
$2,300,000,000  in tax relief
20% reduction in property taxes in new budget
Ban on dual office holding
Strongest global warming bill in the country
Government transparency, "christmas tree" gifts (earmarks) available to view online
Stem Cell research referendum
Significant tax cut for low income families, described as "a double tax cut"

The ones in bold are certainly not accomplishments by my standards.  Aside from, the dual office ban has not taken effect, my property taxes are going up 24%, so really he does nothing according to your list

The ones in bold also happen to be supported by the overwhelming majority of New Jerseyans except for gay marriage which is just a majority. Those are only for this year so far. Also the ban on dual office holding was just signed into law or will be before the 30th. As for your property taxes, I doubt they went up 24% and you should expect your tax cut soon.
Since 1996, my property taxes have gone up by 50%, which is ridiculous. So I doubt yours have gone up by 24% in just one year.

I strongly advise you ask someone you know that lives in this area, because my taxes are going up 24%, although I doubt there is an article about it online.

Thats about as likely to be true as you being a libertarian. 

Finally you acknowledge!  However, my property taxes are going up 24%, which I guess is not really a state issue, however, I don't need any new state taxes when my property taxes are like that.  Are the town's reassesment last year we have gone through the roof.  When my parents moved in in the late 80s, the taxes were about $4,000 and next year they will be about $14,000

Dude, your property taxes?  Aren't you sixteen?

Yeah, so?  How much disposable income my family has effects things like what kind of car I will get next year when I drive and what things I can afford to buy without having to get a job. 

If you're so into getting money for nothing, why aren't you a Democrat?

I'll guess it was sarcasm, but I am looking for help with money my family earned that I hope to in turn return some day by working hard when the time is right.

[Verily]

Here are some of his accomplishments:

Civil Unions, expect gay marriage within a year.
First budget in 6 years with no new taxes, tax increase
$2,300,000,000  in tax relief
20% reduction in property taxes in new budget
Ban on dual office holding
Strongest global warming bill in the country
Government transparency, "christmas tree" gifts (earmarks) available to view online
Stem Cell research referendum
Significant tax cut for low income families, described as "a double tax cut"

The ones in bold are certainly not accomplishments by my standards.  Aside from, the dual office ban has not taken effect, my property taxes are going up 24%, so really he does nothing according to your list

The ones in bold also happen to be supported by the overwhelming majority of New Jerseyans except for gay marriage which is just a majority. Those are only for this year so far. Also the ban on dual office holding was just signed into law or will be before the 30th. As for your property taxes, I doubt they went up 24% and you should expect your tax cut soon.
Since 1996, my property taxes have gone up by 50%, which is ridiculous. So I doubt yours have gone up by 24% in just one year.

I strongly advise you ask someone you know that lives in this area, because my taxes are going up 24%, although I doubt there is an article about it online.

Thats about as likely to be true as you being a libertarian. 

Finally you acknowledge!  However, my property taxes are going up 24%, which I guess is not really a state issue, however, I don't need any new state taxes when my property taxes are like that.  Are the town's reassesment last year we have gone through the roof.  When my parents moved in in the late 80s, the taxes were about $4,000 and next year they will be about $14,000

So, taxes doubled (because $4000 in late 1980s dollars is about $7300 today) while local property values jumped around 400%. Sounds like your parents got a really good deal.

[Small Business Owner of Any Repute]

For most families, home appreciation is a mere paper gain that they won't be able to tap into until well into retirement.  It's unfair to say that a family could well afford a tripling of the tax rate because of a quadrupling of their home's value.

I do feel for Bergen County families right now: every dollar that goes to Ferriero's cronies (and there's lots of money changing hands -- Ferriero wouldn't be powerful if there weren't) comes straight from the taxpayers.

[Queen Mum Inks.LWC]

Heck NO!

[Joe Biden 2020]

I'll say that he does deserve re-election, as I am more than willing to give people second chances.  He made a horrible mistake, but he apologized, and I'm taking his word for it and giving him the benefit of the doubt.

[DownWithTheLeft]

I'll say that he does deserve re-election, as I am more than willing to give people second chances.  He made a horrible mistake, but he apologized, and I'm taking his word for it and giving him the benefit of the doubt.

That just means we don't run him out of the state, it doesn't mean we give him another term.  That's like if you are given the choice between a good human being a murderer who has apoligized.  You don't have to pick the murderer just because he has made good.

[Small Business Owner of Any Repute]

I'll say that he does deserve re-election, as I am more than willing to give people second chances.  He made a horrible mistake, but he apologized, and I'm taking his word for it and giving him the benefit of the doubt.

That just means we don't run him out of the state, it doesn't mean we give him another term.  That's like if you are given the choice between a good human being a murderer who has apoligized.  You don't have to pick the murderer just because he has made good.

For the record, if Corzine is found guilty of murder, I will officially endorse his Republican opponent in 2009.

[Smash255]

Here are some of his accomplishments:

Civil Unions, expect gay marriage within a year.
First budget in 6 years with no new taxes, tax increase
$2,300,000,000  in tax relief
20% reduction in property taxes in new budget
Ban on dual office holding
Strongest global warming bill in the country
Government transparency, "christmas tree" gifts (earmarks) available to view online
Stem Cell research referendum
Significant tax cut for low income families, described as "a double tax cut"

The ones in bold are certainly not accomplishments by my standards.  Aside from, the dual office ban has not taken effect, my property taxes are going up 24%, so really he does nothing according to your list

The ones in bold also happen to be supported by the overwhelming majority of New Jerseyans except for gay marriage which is just a majority. Those are only for this year so far. Also the ban on dual office holding was just signed into law or will be before the 30th. As for your property taxes, I doubt they went up 24% and you should expect your tax cut soon.
Since 1996, my property taxes have gone up by 50%, which is ridiculous. So I doubt yours have gone up by 24% in just one year.

I strongly advise you ask someone you know that lives in this area, because my taxes are going up 24%, although I doubt there is an article about it online.

Thats about as likely to be true as you being a libertarian. 

Finally you acknowledge!  However, my property taxes are going up 24%, which I guess is not really a state issue, however, I don't need any new state taxes when my property taxes are like that.  Are the town's reassesment last year we have gone through the roof.  When my parents moved in in the late 80s, the taxes were about $4,000 and next year they will be about $14,000

Dude, your property taxes?  Aren't you sixteen?

Yeah, so?  How much disposable income my family has effects things like what kind of car I will get next year when I drive and what things I can afford to buy without having to get a job. 

1.  If they are paying $14,000 in property taxes the home is worth close to $1,000,000 if not more

2.  Its not as much of a state issue as town and county issue, or school tax issue.  Even so a 24% increase makes no sense, unless they did some major renovation you are not telling us about.

3.  Their is property tax relief.  However that relief is towards the middle and working class, those who need the relief not geared so some spoiled ass rich can get have his parents by him a nice car, and for him to be able to get what he wants without working.

[Small Business Owner of Any Repute]

1.  If they are paying $14,000 in property taxes the home is worth close to $1,000,000 if not more

Not necessarily.  My parents pay slightly less in property taxes ($12k+), and have a home valued at slightly more than $500,000.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Doug Forrester was attacked in 2002 and 2005 for a similar single year tax hike when he was mayor of West Windsor -- it had to do with an emergency capital expense.  Agreed: 24% tax increases (and that's a MASSIVE increase) are almost exclusively caused by major -- and urgent -- issues where the township's hands are often tied.

Though honestly, through my research, I can't find a Bergen County town whose property taxes have jumped 24% in the last year.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Being rich through home appreciation is not really being rich.

[DownWithTheLeft]

1.  If they are paying $14,000 in property taxes the home is worth close to $1,000,000 if not more

Not necessarily.  My parents pay slightly less in property taxes ($12k+), and have a home valued at slightly more than $500,000.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Doug Forrester was attacked in 2002 and 2005 for a similar single year tax hike when he was mayor of West Windsor -- it had to do with an emergency capital expense.  Agreed: 24% tax increases (and that's a MASSIVE increase) are almost exclusively caused by major -- and urgent -- issues where the township's hands are often tied.

Though honestly, through my research, I can't find a Bergen County town whose property taxes have jumped 24% in the last year.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Being rich through home appreciation is not really being rich.

Mr. Moderate, the increase is for next year and BTW as Verily mentioned my town is Rutherford.  We do not have any pressing school needs, however, due to the failures of EnCap our town has to pick up the tab which accounts for the increase.  My home is also valued at about $850,000, not a million

[Conan]

1.  If they are paying $14,000 in property taxes the home is worth close to $1,000,000 if not more

Not necessarily.  My parents pay slightly less in property taxes ($12k+), and have a home valued at slightly more than $500,000.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Doug Forrester was attacked in 2002 and 2005 for a similar single year tax hike when he was mayor of West Windsor -- it had to do with an emergency capital expense.  Agreed: 24% tax increases (and that's a MASSIVE increase) are almost exclusively caused by major -- and urgent -- issues where the township's hands are often tied.

Though honestly, through my research, I can't find a Bergen County town whose property taxes have jumped 24% in the last year.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Being rich through home appreciation is not really being rich.

He has said previously that his home is worth more than $1,000,000.... even though in NJ standards, depending on where you live, you can be anywhere from lower to middle, middle class still. Not saying that it's better if they'd move, but NJ has places, within reasonable commute, to where he currently lives, where he can trade his $1,000,000 home for a home of greater size with more land, for at a minimum of $400,000. And it would be possible to move to this home with taxes at $6-8,000 in taxes.

[Small Business Owner of Any Repute]

When Kerry Healey (essentially) suggested such a thing, she was run out of town on a rail.

[Smash255]

1.  If they are paying $14,000 in property taxes the home is worth close to $1,000,000 if not more

Not necessarily.  My parents pay slightly less in property taxes ($12k+), and have a home valued at slightly more than $500,000.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Doug Forrester was attacked in 2002 and 2005 for a similar single year tax hike when he was mayor of West Windsor -- it had to do with an emergency capital expense.  Agreed: 24% tax increases (and that's a MASSIVE increase) are almost exclusively caused by major -- and urgent -- issues where the township's hands are often tied.

Though honestly, through my research, I can't find a Bergen County town whose property taxes have jumped 24% in the last year.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Being rich through home appreciation is not really being rich.

Not 100% sure of how exactly the NJ relief went into effect, but I believe its similar to the Star Program in NY, which is based off income.

[Verily]

1.  If they are paying $14,000 in property taxes the home is worth close to $1,000,000 if not more

Not necessarily.  My parents pay slightly less in property taxes ($12k+), and have a home valued at slightly more than $500,000.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Doug Forrester was attacked in 2002 and 2005 for a similar single year tax hike when he was mayor of West Windsor -- it had to do with an emergency capital expense.  Agreed: 24% tax increases (and that's a MASSIVE increase) are almost exclusively caused by major -- and urgent -- issues where the township's hands are often tied.

Though honestly, through my research, I can't find a Bergen County town whose property taxes have jumped 24% in the last year.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Being rich through home appreciation is not really being rich.

He has said previously that his home is worth more than $1,000,000.... even though in NJ standards, depending on where you live, you can be anywhere from lower to middle, middle class still. Not saying that it's better if they'd move, but NJ has places, within reasonable commute, to where he currently lives, where he can trade his $1,000,000 home for a home of greater size with more land, for at a minimum of $400,000. And it would be possible to move to this home with taxes at $6-8,000 in taxes.

No, $1,000,000 is never lower class, not even in the most expensive parts of Bergen and Somerset. Of course, I'd be mildly surprised to learn that where he lives has any houses at all valued at $1,000,000 or higher simply because they're all fairly small and very tightly packed in Rutherford.

I don't know exactly what the property values should be, but my middle-class house is worth around $600,000 (estimating by recent local sales; my parents actually own the house, though they don't live here, and they bought it for $100,000 in the 80s), and is probably in an area of higher property values than most of Rutherford.

[Small Business Owner of Any Repute]

I agree: ownership of a $800,000 to 1,000,000 house, regardless of location in New Jersey, puts you firmly in the upper class.  Once you dip down closer to $500,000 or $600,000, you're now talking middle class—often upper middle class—because a lot of families just got to that point through decades of appreciation.

If a family got to $1,000,000 through decades of appreciation, well—they were rich to get that house in the first place.

[Small Business Owner of Any Repute]

Want to see what $750,000 buys you in Rutherford?

http://homes.realtor.com/prop/1082424562

That same place would probably go for $250,000 where I used to live in Pennsylvania.

[Conan]

1.  If they are paying $14,000 in property taxes the home is worth close to $1,000,000 if not more

Not necessarily.  My parents pay slightly less in property taxes ($12k+), and have a home valued at slightly more than $500,000.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Doug Forrester was attacked in 2002 and 2005 for a similar single year tax hike when he was mayor of West Windsor -- it had to do with an emergency capital expense.  Agreed: 24% tax increases (and that's a MASSIVE increase) are almost exclusively caused by major -- and urgent -- issues where the township's hands are often tied.

Though honestly, through my research, I can't find a Bergen County town whose property taxes have jumped 24% in the last year.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Being rich through home appreciation is not really being rich.

He has said previously that his home is worth more than $1,000,000.... even though in NJ standards, depending on where you live, you can be anywhere from lower to middle, middle class still. Not saying that it's better if they'd move, but NJ has places, within reasonable commute, to where he currently lives, where he can trade his $1,000,000 home for a home of greater size with more land, for at a minimum of $400,000. And it would be possible to move to this home with taxes at $6-8,000 in taxes.

No, $1,000,000 is never lower class, not even in the most expensive parts of Bergen and Somerset. Of course, I'd be mildly surprised to learn that where he lives has any houses at all valued at $1,000,000 or higher simply because they're all fairly small and very tightly packed in Rutherford.

I don't know exactly what the property values should be, but my middle-class house is worth around $600,000 (estimating by recent local sales; my parents actually own the house, though they don't live here, and they bought it for $100,000 in the 80s), and is probably in an area of higher property values than most of Rutherford.

First I said lower middle class, even though it's worded poorly. Secondly one can be in the lower middle class with your home still worth $1,000,000. Home appreciation has skyrocketed. Someone could have moved to Rutherford in the late 80s and bought a house for $100-200,000. Now that house can be worth 1-1.2 million and they are struggling to pay the bills. Of course someone can just move out and cash the equity. It still doesnt mean someone can be living in a home worth over a million and not making a lot of cash. It would be different however, if someone were to pay the million for the house. Then you would be correct.