Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
October 20, 2014, 10:48:43 pm
HomePredMockPollEVCalcAFEWIKIHelpLogin Register
News: Don't forget to get your 2013 Gubernatorial Endorsements and Predictions in!

+  Atlas Forum
|-+  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion
| |-+  International Elections (Moderator: PASOK Leader Hashemite)
| | |-+  French Demographic Maps
« previous next »
Pages: 1 2 3 [4] Print
Author Topic: French Demographic Maps  (Read 16394 times)
PASOK Leader Hashemite
Hashemite
Moderator
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 31469
South Africa


Political Matrix
E: -1.29, S: -7.30

P P P

View Profile WWW
« Reply #75 on: March 01, 2012, 07:54:44 am »

Dordogne, Correze, Vendee, Ariege, Hautes-Pyrenees, Creuse, Haute-Vienne, Indre, Haute-Saone, Var (to an extent), Aveyron, Lozere (to an extent), Ardennes, Vaucluse, Herault, Gard (both to a limited extent), Lot; even Cantal, Puy-de-Dome, Pyrenees-Atlantiques, Pyrenees-Orientales and Charente don't exist guys? I'm not saying this is the cause of anything or that it explains all much or that the correlation is even strong; but denying that there's just no connection is stupid. And I hope you're just denying the link in a modern context; because if you're denying the existence of any link, ever; you don't understand French history. Certainly the connection is much, much weaker now and isn't a good explanation for modern stuff, but...
« Last Edit: March 01, 2012, 08:03:56 am by Believe in America »Logged

Colbert
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 360
France


View Profile
« Reply #76 on: March 01, 2012, 06:29:18 pm »
Ignore

For once, I agree with Colbert.

As for Armorican mountains, well, there are absolutely no muntains there Tongue
As for Jura, it's not an agricultural mountain.
Larzac is more surprising.


I said "moutains" but, indeed, I would better had speak about hills. (I come from Finistère, and it's not the germano-polish plain^^)


Logged
Colbert
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 360
France


View Profile
« Reply #77 on: March 01, 2012, 06:33:38 pm »
Ignore

Dordogne, Correze, Vendee, Ariege, Hautes-Pyrenees, Creuse, Haute-Vienne, Indre, Haute-Saone, Var (to an extent), Aveyron, Lozere (to an extent), Ardennes, Vaucluse, Herault, Gard (both to a limited extent), Lot; even Cantal, Puy-de-Dome, Pyrenees-Atlantiques, Pyrenees-Orientales and Charente don't exist guys? I'm not saying this is the cause of anything or that it explains all much or that the correlation is even strong; but denying that there's just no connection is stupid. And I hope you're just denying the link in a modern context; because if you're denying the existence of any link, ever; you don't understand French history. Certainly the connection is much, much weaker now and isn't a good explanation for modern stuff, but...



But what political correlation are you talking about ? What's connexion between normandy, Alpes, Pyrenees, Ardenne, Dordogne, Corse, Upper Languedoc ?
leftism ? no (normandy, Alpes)
rightism ? no (upper languedoc, dordogne, pyrenees)
catholicism ? no (normandy, dordogne, upper languedoc)
protestantism ? no (corse, alpes, ardennes)

centrism ? communism ? far-right ?


I search this relation, but I don't find it anywere
Logged
PASOK Leader Hashemite
Hashemite
Moderator
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 31469
South Africa


Political Matrix
E: -1.29, S: -7.30

P P P

View Profile WWW
« Reply #78 on: March 01, 2012, 11:18:58 pm »

Ugh, people. I never said the correlation was perfect; it is partial. There is a partial link, in some places, between small property and leftist tradition. It is not universal, but anybody with half a brain understands that voting patterns and their determinants differ from region to region and that an identical type of makeup in two regions doesn't mean that they vote identically - far from it. And even if I recognize that it is not the only cause, it certainly informs a political tradition.
« Last Edit: March 01, 2012, 11:21:34 pm by Believe in America »Logged

bgwah
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 13745
United States


Political Matrix
E: -1.03, S: -6.96

View Profile
« Reply #79 on: March 02, 2012, 01:05:59 am »
Ignore

Epic map time, demographic version



can't read the keys Sad
Logged

big bad fab
filliatre
Moderators
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 13946
Ukraine


Political Matrix
E: 1.42, S: 4.87

P

View Profile
« Reply #80 on: March 02, 2012, 03:45:17 am »
Ignore

Ugh, people. I never said the correlation was perfect; it is partial. There is a partial link, in some places, between small property and leftist tradition. It is not universal, but anybody with half a brain understands that voting patterns and their determinants differ from region to region and that an identical type of makeup in two regions doesn't mean that they vote identically - far from it. And even if I recognize that it is not the only cause, it certainly informs a political tradition.

Of course, there is still a partial link, I agree. My answer to Colbert was just quickly typed between two meetings Tongue

You're right for south of Berry, Languedoc, inner Var (though south of Var and Alpes-Maritimes have small farms statistically because they are hugely urbanized and so, the lands left aren't very big).

But Ariège, Hautes Pyrénées, Pyrénées Atlantiques and Pyrénées Orientales, it's about Pyrenees.
Haute-Saône, it's only the part in Vosges, so not exactly the strongest area for the left.
You're right for south of Berry and for Limousin, though the Massif Central is widespread.
Charente-Maritime, the south is orange in your map, while it's rgithist territory; while the north is blue, while it's leftist territory.

There are also counter-examples to what you say: Savoies, Brittany in a way, Manche, Cher, even the "red" Allier, Meurthe-et-Moselle in a way, which are all counter-intuitive base on modern electoral results. The same for Cantal which is really a "blue" departement.
The same for south of Var, Alpes-Maritimes, but also the heart of Champagne (the NW corner of Marne: slight orange while it's UMP-fascist wing of FN territory), just because big wine farms are small ones even if hugely rich ones (see also the ousth of Saône-et-Loire and the north of Rhône).

My comment was really too short: you're globally right, but what I wanted to say is that the first explanation, the first link is geography, which explains far better in details this map. And, after that, as a possible corollary in many areas, there are of course political consequences.

Maybe a better (in the meaning of more correlated in each area) link with other maps would be the rural unionism; results of MODEF and then Confédération paysanne in Agriculture Chambers' elections.

Sorry if my "I agree with Colbert" put just after his "there is no political conection" made you collapse... Grin I can perfectly understand your reaction ! It was unintended and my comment was really trop rapide, dans les deux sens de l'expression Smiley.
Logged

Enjoy the French elections !
Enjoy polling analysis !
Enjoy my tracker !

http://sondages2012.wordpress.com/
PASOK Leader Hashemite
Hashemite
Moderator
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 31469
South Africa


Political Matrix
E: -1.29, S: -7.30

P P P

View Profile WWW
« Reply #81 on: March 02, 2012, 08:55:19 am »

Epic map time, demographic version



can't read the keys Sad

Map 1
red: ouvriers, manual workers
purple: employees
cyan: professions intermediaires, middle-level employees/lower management/teachers
green: agriculteurs; farmers who own their farms
yellow: artisans, commercants - shopkeepers, artisans
blue: CPIS, managers/professional-scientific-tech

Map 2
All the same, except orange for prof. intermediaires

Details here: http://www.insee.fr/fr/methodes/default.asp?page=nomenclatures/pcs2003/liste_n1.htm
Logged

only back for the worldcup
Lewis Trondheim
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 58778
India


View Profile
« Reply #82 on: March 02, 2012, 09:10:40 am »
Ignore

I don't think "individually exploited" is English. We're talking of farms worked by a single person (or maybe nuclear family) without any employees, I assume.
Logged

"The secret to having a rewarding work-life balance is to have no life. Then it's easy to keep things balanced by doing no work." Wally



"Our party do not have any ideology... Our main aim is to grab power ... Every one is doing so but I say it openly." Keshav Dev Maurya
Sibboleth
Realpolitik
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 56811
Saint Helena


View Profile WWW
« Reply #83 on: March 02, 2012, 04:55:35 pm »
Ignore

I don't think "individually exploited" is English. We're talking of farms worked by a single person (or maybe nuclear family) without any employees, I assume.

I think the word looked for is smallholding.
Logged

"I have become entangled in my own data, and my conclusion stands in direct contradiction to the initial idea from which I started. Proceeding from unlimited freedom, I end with unlimited despotism. I will add, however, that there can be no solution of the social formula except mine."
Colbert
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 360
France


View Profile
« Reply #84 on: March 02, 2012, 11:16:28 pm »
Ignore

Big bad fab let me down, but s'il n'en reste qu'un seul, je serais celui-là, as Victor Hugo said. For me, the correlation of this map is geographical and not political, EVEN globally

seeing some left-wing patterns on red zones, even globally, is simply false. (or, at least, uncorrect)
Logged
Sibboleth
Realpolitik
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 56811
Saint Helena


View Profile WWW
« Reply #85 on: March 10, 2012, 02:05:42 pm »
Ignore

The great Fernand Braudel was a bit of a magpie when it came to maps, and had a charming habit that involved scattering ones by other people that seemed vaguely relevant to his arguments throughout his books. This set (taken from his last work) seems especially appropriate for this thread. It's to do with family structure and was accompanied by a note that the pattern fitted 'in general terms' certain other major geographical/political divisions in France. Braudel actually preferred a three-part model of family types to the simple extended/nuclear one, but, anyway...



A - Farmers
B - Rural Households
C - Urban Households
Logged

"I have become entangled in my own data, and my conclusion stands in direct contradiction to the initial idea from which I started. Proceeding from unlimited freedom, I end with unlimited despotism. I will add, however, that there can be no solution of the social formula except mine."
PASOK Leader Hashemite
Hashemite
Moderator
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 31469
South Africa


Political Matrix
E: -1.29, S: -7.30

P P P

View Profile WWW
« Reply #86 on: April 13, 2012, 04:04:30 pm »

Some median income maps within large cities:









Logged

only back for the worldcup
Lewis Trondheim
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 58778
India


View Profile
« Reply #87 on: April 15, 2012, 08:58:38 am »
Ignore

Why does Orléans have that bizarre shape?
Logged

"The secret to having a rewarding work-life balance is to have no life. Then it's easy to keep things balanced by doing no work." Wally



"Our party do not have any ideology... Our main aim is to grab power ... Every one is doing so but I say it openly." Keshav Dev Maurya
PASOK Leader Hashemite
Hashemite
Moderator
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 31469
South Africa


Political Matrix
E: -1.29, S: -7.30

P P P

View Profile WWW
« Reply #88 on: April 15, 2012, 09:04:04 am »

Why does Orléans have that bizarre shape?

I'm not quite sure. A few French communes have bizarre shapes, but in this case it might be a (rare) case of amalgamation. The south of the city, La Source, is a new area built around a uni campus and a fairly low-income HLM 'city' and it is divided from the rest of the city by the Loiret river.
Logged

Pages: 1 2 3 [4] Print 
« previous next »
Jump to:  


Login with username, password and session length

Logout

Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines