Should the US have a National Lottery?

[Ebowed]

Why did the most liberal Democrats vote against banning online gambling?

Uh, that's a completely different issue.  I would never vote for an online gambling ban.  (Although Bernie Sanders did.)  This is about a government sponsored lottery.

Why would I go to a gun show?

Because you're a wannabe redneck.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Why did the most liberal Democrats vote against banning online gambling?

Uh, that's a completely different issue.  I would never vote for an online gambling ban.  (Although Bernie Sanders did.)  This is about a government sponsored lottery.

Which as I pointed out, is the socialist stance, rather than leaving it up completely to the private sector, which would be the libertarian stance (the social conservative stance is basicaly banning all gambling altogether)

Why would I go to a gun show?

Because you're a wannabe redneck.

Then why haven't I bought any guns and don't plan on buying any guns? Thinking gun control doesn't work doesn't make you a redneck.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Socialism is not simply a more "radical" version of American Liberalism. From a Socialist point of view, gambling is clearly some form of evil.

[Ebowed]

Which as I pointed out, is the socialist stance, rather than leaving it up completely to the private sector, which would be the libertarian stance (the social conservative stance is basicaly banning all gambling altogether)

Oh, okay.  Who cares?

I'm not leaving gambling to the 'private sector' - I support regulation and taxation.  The government itself should not be in the business of teasing people with lottery tickets.

I've given my stance and backed it up with very liberal reasoning.  Your only argument is that my position is the "ultra-conservative" opinion.  So, again, who the hell cares?  No one cares about your labels.

Then why haven't I bought any guns and don't plan on buying any guns? Thinking gun control doesn't work doesn't make you a redneck.

You tell us that, but I bet you load your rifle and slowly fight the urge not to blast everyone's heads off whenever you read a post by WalterMitty or one of your other obsessions.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

My argument is the lottery works for raising money for things such as education and welfare programs which benefits the public. So keep it going. Easier to push for than raising taxes. Hell in RBH's thread you basically said you couldn't understand any rationale for opposing a lottery.

My apartment doesn't allow guns, nor do I have any reason to buy them anyway. Aside from that I have always remembered you as being against gun control. This recent transition to being radically for it and considering anyone who thinks gun control is ineffective is a redneck is a much larger turnaround than anything I've ever done.

[Ebowed]

My argument is the lottery works for raising money for things such as education and welfare programs which benefits the public.

Lotteries are notoriously corrupt in that regard.  Only a small percentage of the money goes to where it was promised to go to.

If you want social services, raise taxes.  Doesn't matter if it's harder to push for.  It's much more effective.

Hell in RBH's thread you basically said you couldn't understand any rationale for opposing a lottery.

I asked for a rationale to oppose the lottery.  That's very different than saying I can't even begin to comprehend why anyone would do so-- I was simply genuinely curious in the arguments against it, as I hadn't thought about it much before.

Aside from that I have always remembered you as being against gun control. This recent transition to being radically for it and considering anyone who thinks gun control is ineffective is a redneck is a much larger turnaround than anything I've ever done.

I never said I was for gun control.  On a local level, I agree that it doesn't work.  On a national level, restrictions actually have to make sense-- i.e. not based on cosmetics (the assault weapons ban) or restricting civil liberties (preventing "terrorist" suspects from buying them).  This is a moderate and reasonable stance.

On the other hand, you seem to be more in the camp of the "ultra-conservatives."  Oh, yeah, there we go with those silly labels again!

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

My argument is the lottery works for raising money for things such as education and welfare programs which benefits the public.

Lotteries are notoriously corrupt in that regard.  Only a small percentage of the money goes to where it was promised to go to.

If you want social services, raise taxes.  Doesn't matter if it's harder to push for.  It's much more effective.

In some states, maybe. Not here. Not in Georgia either, where it funds the HOPE Scholarship. Plus raising taxes especially ones like sales taxes can be a regressive tax on poors too, while a lottery effects only stupid poors (and stupid non-poors). If you're a smart poor, you're better off with a lottery than your taxes being raised.

I never said I was for gun control.  On a local level, I agree that it doesn't work.  On a national level, restrictions actually have to make sense-- i.e. not based on cosmetics (the assault weapons ban) or restricting civil liberties (preventing "terrorist" suspects from buying them).  This is a moderate and reasonable stance.

On the other hand, you seem to be more in the camp of the "ultra-conservatives."  Oh, yeah, there we go with those silly labels again!

I actually basically have the same stance as you, and your stance is closer to mine than WalterMitty's probably.

And as said before, I hardly cared about gun control much (and still don't much really) until I read WalterMitty's rants. The sheer illogicality (hey I invented a word!) of them turned me away. It's similar to immigration actually, I didn't care about it until reading CARLHAYDEN's rants, the sheer stupidity of them made me very pro-amnesty. Often bad arguments can push in the other direction, and Walter did just that to me with gun control.

[Bacon King]

I've never heard of anyone going into bankruptcy or ruin because of a lottery. Even poors aren't going to go starving just because they buy a $1 lottery ticket every now and then.

That's definately not the case. If I may use an example from my own observation, often people will not buy just a single lottery ticket every now and then. A few weeks ago, while waiting in line at a convenience store in town, I watched a woman buy an entire roll of scratch-off tickets, totalling something like two hundred dollars. From the conversation between her and the cashier, it was evident this was a common ritual for her and that she was spending a large chunk of her income.

I don't know how common that sort of thing is, but my understanding is that sort of behavior isn't all too rare.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Well that's her own problem and her own stupidity. Not as stupid as had she been buying cigarettes and those are still legal.

[AkSaber]

Yes, I would vote against a state lottery and it is not only "ultra-conservatives" that oppose them.

Same for me!!

[MasterJedi]

I wouldn't mind if there was a national lottery.

[DanielX]

Not the greatest idea, but its a better one than most sorts of taxes....

[John Dibble]

No, but I don't mind if the states do.