Poll on preferential voting
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  Poll on preferential voting
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Author Topic: Poll on preferential voting  (Read 6199 times)
Fritz
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« on: July 25, 2004, 05:50:44 PM »

Our Senate is considering a bill to repeal preferential voting.  Voice your opinion on this issue by voting in this poll.  This is completely unofficial, of course.
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ilikeverin
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« Reply #1 on: July 25, 2004, 06:39:19 PM »

Just say no!
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Keystone Phil
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« Reply #2 on: July 25, 2004, 06:42:12 PM »

Yes, repeal it. One voter =  one vote.
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The Dowager Mod
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« Reply #3 on: July 25, 2004, 07:11:18 PM »

I don't remember how i voted on that one.
DOH!
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PBrunsel
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« Reply #4 on: July 25, 2004, 07:12:55 PM »

Well it cost me a seat in the Senate, so let it die! Smiley

Actually I don't care how we vote, just as long as people take the time to vote.
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KEmperor
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« Reply #5 on: July 25, 2004, 07:56:57 PM »

I favor a return to the traditional system.
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Keystone Phil
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« Reply #6 on: July 25, 2004, 07:59:06 PM »

I favor a return to the traditional system.

Let is be known that a Supreme court Justice is in favor of one voter, one vote! Thank you for voicing this opinion, KEmperor!
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KEmperor
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« Reply #7 on: July 25, 2004, 08:03:28 PM »

I favor a return to the traditional system.

Let is be known that a Supreme court Justice is in favor of one voter, one vote! Thank you for voicing this opinion, KEmperor!

Haha, now you've made me add that this is simply a personal preference, and is in no way reflective of the Court's position.
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Keystone Phil
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« Reply #8 on: July 25, 2004, 08:19:32 PM »

I favor a return to the traditional system.

Let is be known that a Supreme court Justice is in favor of one voter, one vote! Thank you for voicing this opinion, KEmperor!

Haha, now you've made me add that this is simply a personal preference, and is in no way reflective of the Court's position.

Oh I knew it was a personal thing. I hope no one took it that the Court felt the way KEmperor did.
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Akno21
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« Reply #9 on: July 25, 2004, 08:20:22 PM »

This way you need to appeal to more voters. In the election I won, Keystone Phil had the support of 1/3 of the voters but I guess he was too polarizing or something because he didn't get any second or third place votes and it cost him the election.  
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Keystone Phil
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« Reply #10 on: July 25, 2004, 08:24:14 PM »

This way you need to appeal to more voters. In the election I won, Keystone Phil had the support of 1/3 of the voters but I guess he was too polarizing or something because he didn't get any second or third place votes and it cost him the election.  

And doesn't the fact that losing the popular vote make you a bit polarizing, Akno?
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Akno21
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« Reply #11 on: July 25, 2004, 08:30:57 PM »

This way you need to appeal to more voters. In the election I won, Keystone Phil had the support of 1/3 of the voters but I guess he was too polarizing or something because he didn't get any second or third place votes and it cost him the election.  

And doesn't the fact that losing the popular vote make you a bit polarizing, Akno?

If you want to call it that, call it that. I was saying you might be polarizing due to the fact that out of the 16 people who voted, 6 placed you first, and 8 placed you last. (2 did not fill out all their choices). As for me I had 4 first places, but only 3 4th places.

I support the system as it stands, and do belive we should focus on issues concerning the well-being of Atlasians.
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Keystone Phil
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« Reply #12 on: July 25, 2004, 08:41:36 PM »

This way you need to appeal to more voters. In the election I won, Keystone Phil had the support of 1/3 of the voters but I guess he was too polarizing or something because he didn't get any second or third place votes and it cost him the election.  

And doesn't the fact that losing the popular vote make you a bit polarizing, Akno?

If you want to call it that, call it that. I was saying you might be polarizing due to the fact that out of the 16 people who voted, 6 placed you first, and 8 placed you last. (2 did not fill out all their choices). As for me I had 4 first places, but only 3 4th places.

I support the system as it stands, and do belive we should focus on issues concerning the well-being of Atlasians.

I support focusing on the issues too and I hope you address the issues we care about (even though I might not like your opinion, we need a voice). However the current system is unfair to a candidate that works their hardest, regardless of party, gets the 1st place vote and then actually loses the election.
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Fmr. Gov. NickG
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« Reply #13 on: July 25, 2004, 09:55:08 PM »

This way you need to appeal to more voters. In the election I won, Keystone Phil had the support of 1/3 of the voters but I guess he was too polarizing or something because he didn't get any second or third place votes and it cost him the election.  

And doesn't the fact that losing the popular vote make you a bit polarizing, Akno?

If you want to call it that, call it that. I was saying you might be polarizing due to the fact that out of the 16 people who voted, 6 placed you first, and 8 placed you last. (2 did not fill out all their choices). As for me I had 4 first places, but only 3 4th places.

I support the system as it stands, and do belive we should focus on issues concerning the well-being of Atlasians.

I support focusing on the issues too and I hope you address the issues we care about (even though I might not like your opinion, we need a voice). However the current system is unfair to a candidate that works their hardest, regardless of party, gets the 1st place vote and then actually loses the election.

If we still had the FTPT system on this forum, I would not have run for the Senate and Akno would have won on 1st place votes alone.  Under the old system, the Dems and the Progressives (as my party was called then) never ran candidates against each other.  The PV system just lets every party run a candidate...it makes the campaigns more interesting without hurting the final election result.
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Fmr. Gov. NickG
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« Reply #14 on: July 25, 2004, 09:59:01 PM »

This way you need to appeal to more voters. In the election I won, Keystone Phil had the support of 1/3 of the voters but I guess he was too polarizing or something because he didn't get any second or third place votes and it cost him the election.  

And doesn't the fact that losing the popular vote make you a bit polarizing, Akno?

If you want to call it that, call it that. I was saying you might be polarizing due to the fact that out of the 16 people who voted, 6 placed you first, and 8 placed you last. (2 did not fill out all their choices). As for me I had 4 first places, but only 3 4th places.

I support the system as it stands, and do belive we should focus on issues concerning the well-being of Atlasians.

I support focusing on the issues too and I hope you address the issues we care about (even though I might not like your opinion, we need a voice). However the current system is unfair to a candidate that works their hardest, regardless of party, gets the 1st place vote and then actually loses the election.

Why does getting the most 1st place votes mean you worked the hardest?  Under the PV system, you also have to work hard getting the 2nd and 3rd place votes of people who don't necessarily agree with you on everything.

Phil, you knew how the system worked, and yet didn't work hard enough to get anything but last-place votes from everyone who wasn't a Republican.  Why should our system elect someone who has no appeal to anyone but those in his own party?
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Keystone Phil
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« Reply #15 on: July 25, 2004, 10:08:20 PM »

This way you need to appeal to more voters. In the election I won, Keystone Phil had the support of 1/3 of the voters but I guess he was too polarizing or something because he didn't get any second or third place votes and it cost him the election.  

And doesn't the fact that losing the popular vote make you a bit polarizing, Akno?

If you want to call it that, call it that. I was saying you might be polarizing due to the fact that out of the 16 people who voted, 6 placed you first, and 8 placed you last. (2 did not fill out all their choices). As for me I had 4 first places, but only 3 4th places.

I support the system as it stands, and do belive we should focus on issues concerning the well-being of Atlasians.

I support focusing on the issues too and I hope you address the issues we care about (even though I might not like your opinion, we need a voice). However the current system is unfair to a candidate that works their hardest, regardless of party, gets the 1st place vote and then actually loses the election.


Phil, you knew how the system worked, and yet didn't work hard enough to get anything but last-place votes from everyone who wasn't a Republican.  Why should our system elect someone who has no appeal to anyone but those in his own party?

I don't know Nick, ask the majority of people that voted for me as Senator. Now because I'm not liked by the opposition means I shouldn't be a Senator? Should candidates now be looking to satisfy every single voter? I don't think so. That's how candidates become fake and lie about positions to get elected.

Ok I didn't get the most 2nd votes but I got the most 1st. Akno gets the most 2nd votes but not the 1st. I have to hear about how not winning the 2nd vote is too polarizing but we hear nothing about Akno losing the 1st vote.  Shouldn't we be considering that? The first vote should be the only vote. THAT is the fair system.

Listen we need to try to solve this problem but our real focus is on the district and the issues. Lets have this debate but we have to remember the important forum issues should concern the members and our new Senator.
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Bleeding heart conservative, HTMLdon
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« Reply #16 on: July 25, 2004, 10:19:00 PM »

How could they ask the majority of people who voted for you?  You only got a plurality.  If the system had been different, there would have been only 1 non-right candidate and that candidate would have won.
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Keystone Phil
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« Reply #17 on: July 25, 2004, 10:22:19 PM »

How could they ask the majority of people who voted for you?  You only got a plurality.  If the system had been different, there would have been only 1 non-right candidate and that candidate would have won.

Could you PROVE that everyone would have voted? No, you can't. These hypotheticals are useless. You can't predict what members will do. Example: Akno getting elected.
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Fmr. Gov. NickG
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« Reply #18 on: July 25, 2004, 10:24:39 PM »

This way you need to appeal to more voters. In the election I won, Keystone Phil had the support of 1/3 of the voters but I guess he was too polarizing or something because he didn't get any second or third place votes and it cost him the election.  

And doesn't the fact that losing the popular vote make you a bit polarizing, Akno?

If you want to call it that, call it that. I was saying you might be polarizing due to the fact that out of the 16 people who voted, 6 placed you first, and 8 placed you last. (2 did not fill out all their choices). As for me I had 4 first places, but only 3 4th places.

I support the system as it stands, and do belive we should focus on issues concerning the well-being of Atlasians.

I support focusing on the issues too and I hope you address the issues we care about (even though I might not like your opinion, we need a voice). However the current system is unfair to a candidate that works their hardest, regardless of party, gets the 1st place vote and then actually loses the election.


Phil, you knew how the system worked, and yet didn't work hard enough to get anything but last-place votes from everyone who wasn't a Republican.  Why should our system elect someone who has no appeal to anyone but those in his own party?

I don't know Nick, ask the majority of people that voted for me as Senator. Now because I'm not liked by the opposition means I shouldn't be a Senator? Should candidates now be looking to satisfy every single voter? I don't think so. That's how candidates become fake and lie about positions to get elected.

Ok I didn't get the most 2nd votes but I got the most 1st. Akno gets the most 2nd votes but not the 1st. I have to hear about how not winning the 2nd vote is too polarizing but we hear nothing about Akno losing the 1st vote.  Shouldn't we be considering that? The first vote should be the only vote. THAT is the fair system.

Listen we need to try to solve this problem but our real focus is on the district and the issues. Lets have this debate but we have to remember the important forum issues should concern the members and our new Senator.

You don't need to satisfy every voter, just half.   Of all the candidates, Phil, you satified the fewest.  Of the 13 voters that ranked the candidates, 8 ranked you last.  Do you really think you should be the one to represent them?
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Keystone Phil
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« Reply #19 on: July 25, 2004, 10:27:31 PM »

I satisfied the fewest? Actually on the first vote, the people's selection for who they want FIRST, I received the most. To correct you, Bullmoose received the fewest.
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Fritz
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« Reply #20 on: July 25, 2004, 10:35:47 PM »

Anyone in favor of repealing PV on the forum ought to also be in favor of repealing the EV system in the United States.  One person, one vote, right?  And its not fair that the guy with the most votes lost the election.

Don't you agree, Phil?
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Fmr. Gov. NickG
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« Reply #21 on: July 25, 2004, 10:36:56 PM »

I satisfied the fewest? Actually on the first vote, the people's selection for who they want FIRST, I received the most. To correct you, Bullmoose received the fewest.

Why can't a person be satisfied with more than one candidate?  Although I did not vote for Akno first, I am very satisfied that he won.  
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Keystone Phil
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« Reply #22 on: July 25, 2004, 10:40:11 PM »

Anyone in favor of repealing PV on the forum ought to also be in favor of repealing the EV system in the United States.  One person, one vote, right?  And its not fair that the guy with the most votes lost the election.

Don't you agree, Phil?

I knew this would come up and no the situations are different. The EV system gives a fair vote and voice to each state.
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Keystone Phil
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« Reply #23 on: July 25, 2004, 10:44:00 PM »

And since we aren't doing one vote per person, why aren't we allowed to do the following...

1) Keystone Phil
2) Keystone Phil

See what I'm saying? I could have won that way while others would be divided on the second ballot. But wait...that is unfair, though! You're voting for someone more than once! Yep, I am. Just as others did in this election. One vote per person.
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Fmr. Gov. NickG
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« Reply #24 on: July 25, 2004, 10:47:16 PM »

And since we aren't doing one vote per person, why aren't we allowed to do the following...

1) Keystone Phil
2) Keystone Phil

See what I'm saying? I could have won that way while others would be divided on the second ballot. But wait...that is unfair, though! You're voting for someone more than once! Yep, I am. Just as others did in this election. One vote per person.

You wouldn't have won by doing that.  You clearly don't understand how preferential voting works.  Only the 2nd place votes of previously eliminated candidates are counted!
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