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Author Topic: Favorite Foreign Leader  (Read 6777 times)
Keystone Phil
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« on: July 26, 2004, 07:43:05 pm »
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I don't know if this topic was brought up before but I thought it would be good to discuss. So who is your favorite foreign leader?

For me, I have to say Silvio Berlusconi.



 I know I'm going to get a lot of criticism but hey...he's a strong conservative voice in liberal Europe.

Another political figure I admire is Iain Duncan Smith. He's not a head of state but he was the former leader of Britain's Conservative Party.



I'm sure the our British and other foreign friends on the forum will just love who I admire!
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Platypus
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« Reply #1 on: July 26, 2004, 11:34:52 pm »
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Silvio Berlesconi?

IDS?

I *know* you're just trolling now.

Slivio is one of the most venomous, disgusting people in the world.

IDS is..well, he's not as bad, but i certainly wouldn't want to have him as Prime Minister.

There are not many people who I would prefer Howard over, but SBerlesconi is most certainly one of them.

Coincidentally, my most admired world leader is non existant. None of them are any good, really. Thebo is an idiot on AIDS. Gerhad can't run the economy. Putin wins the elections by a bit TOO much. Martin is probably as close as it gets, and that's kinda sad :p
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« Reply #2 on: July 26, 2004, 11:36:29 pm »
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Historical: Churchill

Current: Blair or Sharon
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« Reply #3 on: July 26, 2004, 11:36:55 pm »
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He's the man right here...

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Keystone Phil
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« Reply #4 on: July 26, 2004, 11:56:27 pm »
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Silvio Berlesconi?

IDS?

I *know* you're just trolling now.


Excuse me I would prefer if you don't call me a troll. I've never been accused of that before by even those who disagree with me the most. I resent being referred to a troll when I spend a lot of time engaging in civil debate.
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« Reply #5 on: July 27, 2004, 12:21:23 am »
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Recent Past leaders: 1) Yitzhak Rabin 2) Carlos Salinas 3) Mikhail Gorbachev 4) Margaret Thatcher 5) Helmut Kohl 6) Ehud Barak

Current leaders: 1) Tony Blair 2) ...  3) ... 4) ... where are they??


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Keystone Phil
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« Reply #6 on: July 27, 2004, 12:26:00 am »
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Recent Past leaders: 4) Margaret Thatcher

I totally forgot about Maggie Thatcher. She fought alongside Reagan during the Cold War and had a strong voice for conservative causes in Britain.
 
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ThePrezMex
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« Reply #7 on: July 27, 2004, 12:48:57 am »
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Keystone:
1) why IDS?? IMHO he was one of the worst leaders the Tories have had. Thatcher, Major, Hague and Michael Howard, all better than IDS - Even some others that weren't leaders like Kenneth Clarke and Michael Portillo. What does IDS has in particular?

2) I think it doesn't matter whether Berlusconi is conservative or not, or if he supported the war or not. It has been proven beyond doubt that he is one of the most corrupt and crooked politicians around. Many people will argue that most politicians in Italy are equally corrupt - well, true, but that is not a justification. He has basically accomplished zero in Italy - compare that to the record of Aznar in Spain, an effective conservative.
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Keystone Phil
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« Reply #8 on: July 27, 2004, 12:55:24 am »
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Keystone:
1) why IDS?? IMHO he was one of the worst leaders the Tories have had. Thatcher, Major, Hague and Michael Howard, all better than IDS - Even some others that weren't leaders like Kenneth Clarke and Michael Portillo. What does IDS has in particular?


The reason why I admire Smith is because I enjoyed his debates with Blair the most. Hague was ok and I'm not a huge Howard fan right now. He's just taken over fairly recently so I'm just not used to watching him debate. So many people say that IDS was boring and quiet but I saw him as an exciting leader in the House of Commons during PM questions.

Now concerning Berlusconi...the whole corruption thing certainly isn't a positive thing about him but his conservativism is something I admire in an ever changing, left leaning Europe.
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ThePrezMex
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« Reply #9 on: July 27, 2004, 01:07:19 am »
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Keystone:
1) why IDS?? IMHO he was one of the worst leaders the Tories have had. Thatcher, Major, Hague and Michael Howard, all better than IDS - Even some others that weren't leaders like Kenneth Clarke and Michael Portillo. What does IDS has in particular?


The reason why I admire Smith is because I enjoyed his debates with Blair the most. Hague was ok and I'm not a huge Howard fan right now. He's just taken over fairly recently so I'm just not used to watching him debate. So many people say that IDS was boring and quiet but I saw him as an exciting leader in the House of Commons during PM questions.

Now concerning Berlusconi...the whole corruption thing certainly isn't a positive thing about him but his conservativism is something I admire in an ever changing, left leaning Europe.

Ok, I never saw IDS debating, since I can't watch C-SPAN in Mexico. I can now that I'm here. But, even The Economist (my favorite source for news) which you could call "conservative" in certain way, was not very favorable to IDS. I think Hague would have made a great leader if he had waited until now; he was way too young.
Anyway, if I were allowed to vote in Britain, I would have voted every time for Thatcher and the first time for Major, but would have voted for Blair everytime.


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« Reply #10 on: July 27, 2004, 04:12:54 am »
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Foreign leaders I like/d (I wouldn't say admire/d)...
lemme think...
Jean Chrétien maybe...
Guy Verhofstadt...
Gorbachev when I was a kid, but I share that aberration in taste with most Germans...
Mandela (hey - that was easy, wasn't it?)
Vaclav Havel...
I know that's a pretty mixed bag...
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« Reply #11 on: July 27, 2004, 04:38:40 am »
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For me, I have to say Silvio Berlusconi.



 I know I'm going to get a lot of criticism but hey...he's a strong conservative voice in liberal Europe.

Another political figure I admire is Iain Duncan Smith. He's not a head of state but he was the former leader of Britain's Conservative Party.



I'm sure the our British and other foreign friends on the forum will just love who I admire!

You're kidding me right? Silvio Berlusconi? Do you know much about the man?

He was booted out of government back in the nineties I think it was for corruption and then when he somehow managed to weasel his way back, he reformed the law so that neither he, nor his cronies could be investigated for corruption charges. The man is as corrupt as they come.

On Iain Duncan Smith, are you serious? Interesting? He was a terrible debater and THE most ineffective leader of the opposition in history and as such the only one not to have a waxwork in Madame Tussaudes. He was useless, we called him Iain Duncan Cough or The Quiet Man. One of the  most uninspiring speakers who failed to capitalise when Labour's numbers were falling. Labour's base of support was ripe for the picking and he sat there and did nothing, managing to drop the Tories by a point while the Liberal Democrats took all the support.
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« Reply #12 on: July 27, 2004, 04:49:58 am »
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Another political figure I admire is Iain Duncan Smith. He's not a head of state but he was the former leader of Britain's Conservative Party.



I'm sure the our British and other foreign friends on the forum will just love who I admire!


IDS was weak and demanded loyalty when in the past he had be disloyal and rebellious under the Major government he deserves no respect or admiration and the nerve he demonstrated in demanding loyalty from his colleagues was so breathtakingly hypocritical that it was laughable...

I must confess to find Silvio rather cool Cheesy in a corrupt, despotic sorta way Wink

But to top the list it has to be Tony...

 


…god bless Tony Smiley

This link I found quite funny  

http://www.westlaonline.com/blair2004/

apart from Tony… hmmm, I guess kinda admire Michael Heseltine

who was a former minister in the conservative governments of the 1980’s and 1990’s and the defacto leader of the moderate “wet” wing of the party for that time despite ultimately failing to become prime minister… his only down side is he is very very pro-European Sad  same as Blair
« Last Edit: July 27, 2004, 04:51:30 am by Sec. Treasury. Ben »Logged

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JohnFKennedy
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« Reply #13 on: July 27, 2004, 04:54:46 am »
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I signed it Grin. There are 5508 signatures on there!!!!!
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cwelsch
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« Reply #14 on: July 27, 2004, 06:33:37 am »
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I tend to dislike actual politicians, maybe because they all tend to be either liars or whiners and the ones that aren't rarely fit me in most areas.  And of course I hate the politics of pretty much anywhere outside the US (and to a lesser degree Canada) because those countries hate the middle class and think having a little money is a sign of laziness or dishonesty.  Of course, tons of the same people who hate the middle class love super-rich people like actors or the Queen (met and talked to tons of Laborites who love the Queen).  I just don't fit much of anywhere because they all seem to hate the market and hate anybody who accumulates any bit of wealth.

If forced to answer I'd probably quote you philosophers or something.  If you held my arm to my back I'd probably be convinced to say a few nice things about Thatcher (although I don't even know if I'd've voted for her) or Mulroney in Canada.  Nowadays, I dunno, probably Westerwelle of the German Free Democrats (not exactly a political mastermind, if results count).

Naturally I'd be very positive on Otto Guevara, the first Libertario elected in Costa Rica (although not the last, since 2002) and to a lesser degree on Rodney Hide of ACT New Zealand (also a Libertarian party).  But then I don't know a ton about Westerwelle, I know next to nothing of Hide, and a fair amount on Guevara.  But knowing libertarians/classical-liberals and political positions can lead me to make assumptions and guesses.


All of which assumes you mean leader in a vaguer sense of the word than you probably did.
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« Reply #15 on: July 27, 2004, 06:33:45 am »
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Most world leaders are scumbags or incompetent idiots.

Overall, Blair's done a good job... and his constituancy is in County Durham Smiley

Gary Doer (the Premier of Manitoba) has done a good job overall...
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« Reply #16 on: July 27, 2004, 06:39:59 am »
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Phil, Phil...what have we said about Silvio? Tongue

He isn't even an effective conservative. Despite leading a stable government, I think it has survived longer than any other Italian government since Mussolini, he has failed to do anything about Italy's abysmal, over-regulated economy. He's a mafia type who refuses to allow criticism against him be aired on the channels he control, about 95% of all Italian tv.
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Akno21
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« Reply #17 on: July 27, 2004, 06:53:49 am »
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I'll have to go with Blair.

But I also don't hate Jacques Chirac, as many Americans do. I applaud him to stadning up for what he belived in, even when he was being pressured and mocked by the powerful American government.
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« Reply #18 on: July 27, 2004, 07:16:19 am »
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For me he's not foreign, but I like John Howard, Prime Minister of Australia.  Like George W, he's facing a tough election later this year.  His opposition is the Australian Labor Party's (ALP) Mark Latham, a foul-mouthed socialist from the outer fringe of Sydney.

Aussie elections tend to be close in the federal arena, and this one will be a cliff-hanger.  Latham's main election promise so far is to cut and run from Iraq, the same way Spain did.  If that happens, most Australians will be ashamed.  I did not personally agree with starting the Iraq war, although I hated Saddam.  However, now that we are there we need to stay the distance and help the common Iraqi people, who just want to live in peace.
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« Reply #19 on: July 27, 2004, 07:33:03 am »
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Most foreign leaders are neither good nor bad...I would say Blair's pretty good though. But politicians should never be allowed to gain our trust too much...
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« Reply #20 on: July 27, 2004, 07:51:41 am »
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Foreign leaders I like/d (I wouldn't say admire/d)...
lemme think...
Jean Chrétien maybe...
Guy Verhofstadt...
Gorbachev when I was a kid, but I share that aberration in taste with most Germans...
Mandela (hey - that was easy, wasn't it?)
Vaclav Havel...
I know that's a pretty mixed bag...

Who is Laloo Prasad?
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Lewis Trondheim
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« Reply #21 on: July 27, 2004, 07:58:53 am »
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Foreign leaders I like/d (I wouldn't say admire/d)...
lemme think...
Jean Chrétien maybe...
Guy Verhofstadt...
Gorbachev when I was a kid, but I share that aberration in taste with most Germans...
Mandela (hey - that was easy, wasn't it?)
Vaclav Havel...
I know that's a pretty mixed bag...

Who is Laloo Prasad?
Laloo Prasad the poster or Laloo Prasad the crook scumbag politician?
a) formerly known as Lewis Trondheim
b) the former PM of the Indian state of Bihar, husband of the current PM. Was a mobster before he became a politician, a poor labourer before he became a mobster. Leader of the Rashtriya Janata Dal, a key partner of the current congress government. His policy proposals are leftwingish populist anti-Brahmins. Al described him as "the Huey Long of Indian politics". Plus, he's my character in the Pawns of Power RPG.
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« Reply #22 on: July 27, 2004, 09:01:13 am »
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IDS was a complete idiot and Berlusconi is a crook.
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« Reply #23 on: July 27, 2004, 02:22:13 pm »
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I would say Silvio Berlusconi (who, if he were an American, would be your typical New York Republican), but the euros will start carping and whatnot.
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Keystone Phil
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« Reply #24 on: July 27, 2004, 03:51:35 pm »
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I would say Silvio Berlusconi (who, if he were an American, would be your typical New York Republican), but the euros will start carping and whatnot.

Noooo way! Berlusconi is no New York Republican. NY Republicans tend to be more moderate and he is no moderate, believe me.

Now Berlusconi has had his scandals and ya know what...I don't defend him for any corrupt dealings he's been involved in. But for his conservative voice and his stronger leadership (Italy's Olive Tree coalition was defeated in a landslide in 2001 for a reason ya know) I admire him. He also stood with America during the Iraq war when we weren't very popular in Europe. Like him or not, that took courage to do as a leader in Europe.
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