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Author Topic: Australia General Discussion  (Read 249668 times)
Smid
Junior Chimp
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« Reply #1500 on: September 13, 2014, 11:08:08 PM »

Both parties did not support the Desal plant as built by Labor. The Liberals had proposed a modest Desal plant, Labor rubbished the idea prior to the election and then afterwards, they immediately built a massive Desal plant, the size of which is completely unnecessary. It will cost Victorians almost $20 billion over 30 years, even if no water has been ordered (and to date, no water has been ordered).

The size of the plant and the contract is completely disproportionate to Victoria's water needs, but despite that, the contract has not been torn up, unlike the irresponsible threats made by Daniel Andrews in the past week.

Daniel Andrews had previously said that if elected, he would honour the contracts. Indeed, he said:

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A fortnight later and now he says:

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By his own previous standards and comments, he does not value Victoria's reputation, he admits that he'll be telling the World that Victoria is closed for business, but he just doesn't care. He admits that it will cost jobs but that's a price he's willing to pay in order to win votes.
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Knives
solopop
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« Reply #1501 on: September 14, 2014, 04:50:48 AM »

The desalination plant at the time it was built made sense - did you forget how low dam levels are? The panic over the Muray-Darling? The thing he has said though is that - if the legal challenge fails Labor will go ahead, if not they will scrap the projects. And if the legal challenge is a success only then will they build it. However, this doesn't have to be like this - the government could wait 2 months, and if they win, then sign the contracts. Also, if the Liberals were so concerned about the bottom line, why are the spending millions of the states money advertising state projects?
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Smid
Junior Chimp
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« Reply #1502 on: September 14, 2014, 08:29:04 AM »

I recall that dam levels were low. That was why the Liberals were the only party that went to the 2006 election with a policy of building a desalination plant - a policy that Labor rubbished and then implemented, except that the Liberal plan was for a smaller and less-expensive plant. Not the $20 billion white elephant built by Labor. Labor's desalination plant did not make sense.

Much like how Labor now opposes East West Link, they originally opposed the Liberal-proposed desal plant. They also opposed CitiLink in 1995/96 - indeed, the Labor Opposition Leader at the time, John Brumby, threatened to tear up those contracts as well. Those projects were needed and built despite Labor's opposition to them. Congestion is bad enough already, let alone if CitiLink wasn't built.

There is also a need for East West Link. That's why VECCI, AIG and Infrastructure Australia all expressed concern at the irresponsible threats made by Daniel Andrews. Even the AWU is concerned about the jobs his new position now threatens. There is also a deep rift within his Shadow Cabinet - several senior Shadow Ministers were unaware of his new position prior to reading about it on his Twitter account and have been not-so-quietly grumbling about his lack of leadership.

The position you've attributed to Andrews is actually the position he held prior to last week's backflip. That's not surprising, though, he's been all over the shop since the project was first announced.

You are still forgetting the point - this isn't a newly-announced project. It was included in the Victorian Budget eighteen months ago. Since then, there has been considerable work carried out. Private enterprise has spent millions on the work needed to complete the tendering process. To say that the contracts need to be delayed further, rejects the entire notion of the caretaker period, which prevents governments from making decisions that bind a future government during the final period prior to an election, while allowing governments to make decisions and commitments prior to the caretaker period. We are not yet in caretaker therefore the Government is perfectly entitled to enter into contracts to implement policy that was announced eighteen months ago.

Daniel Andrews admitted that Labor lost the 2010 election because it failed to invest in infrastructure for Melbourne's growing population. He hasn't learnt from the past and is threatening to repeat it. As I've already mentioned, he recognises "there'll be obviously jobs that could potentially be at risk" from his policy, that he'll "send a message to the World that we're closed for business" and that he is proposing "a very silly thing to do" that would not be done by "a government that actually values our state's reputation and good name", nor even "a responsible party that wants to govern." Now we can see that he's also willing to gamble the ability to cope with population growth.
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Knives
solopop
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« Reply #1503 on: September 14, 2014, 09:36:23 AM »

Well I can't remember back to the 2006 election as I was only 10 and really my memory of 2014 is hazy. However, my problem with the whole process going on now and the fact that this wasn't an election promise and therefore it should be taken to the electorate. Tbh, I've probably got most of the facts wrong however, I still believe that this road should only be built after there is major investment in the rail network which just isn't going to happen.
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Platypus
hughento
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« Reply #1504 on: September 14, 2014, 10:13:56 AM »

I think the key difference is that the Liberals *are* campaigning on the East West link this time around - so campaign on it without signing contracts weeks out from the election.

Not about to defend Labor, just purely a point about the Liberals, not even about the E/W link itself. If it's a major part of your campaign, let the people vote before you sign off on it.

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Knives
solopop
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« Reply #1505 on: September 14, 2014, 10:24:07 AM »

I think the key difference is that the Liberals *are* campaigning on the East West link this time around - so campaign on it without signing contracts weeks out from the election.

Not about to defend Labor, just purely a point about the Liberals, not even about the E/W link itself. If it's a major part of your campaign, let the people vote before you sign off on it.



This is what I'm saying. It's ridiculous to commit billions of dollars for an election pledge before an election.
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Platypus
hughento
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« Reply #1506 on: September 22, 2014, 10:29:26 AM »

Any Liberal want to justify why we're destroying the Australian way of life for 99.999% of the population to 'defend the Australian way of life' from 0.001%?

Seriously, I get it. terrorists are very bad. But trading in the rights of the vast, vast majority of the country when we have already given various agencies a sh**tload of power, effectively, to combat a couple of hundred idiots is deeply offensive.

I know that the ALP is broadly supporting this, and they're disgusting for doing so, but this is basically Shorten not being brave enough to put more than a hair between him and the PM on 'national security'. Even so, it's a fundamentally coalition led campaign, and it is absolutely disgraceful.

Liberal my arse.
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Knives
solopop
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« Reply #1507 on: September 22, 2014, 10:37:55 AM »

Well I can't remember back to the 2006 election as I was only 10 and really my memory of 2014 is hazy. However, my problem with the whole process going on now and the fact that this wasn't an election promise and therefore it should be taken to the electorate. Tbh, I've probably got most of the facts wrong however, I still believe that this road should only be built after there is major investment in the rail network which just isn't going to happen.

You literally have no shame. How are you continuing to to say this bullsh**t??

... Dude? What is your problem. I'm 18 years old, I'm doing VCE at the moment, I was born on the 28/08/96, why do you believe I would lie about that? What would I stand to gain? You are such a creep.
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Knives
solopop
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« Reply #1508 on: September 22, 2014, 08:18:17 PM »

Well I can't remember back to the 2006 election as I was only 10 and really my memory of 2014 is hazy. However, my problem with the whole process going on now and the fact that this wasn't an election promise and therefore it should be taken to the electorate. Tbh, I've probably got most of the facts wrong however, I still believe that this road should only be built after there is major investment in the rail network which just isn't going to happen.

You literally have no shame. How are you continuing to to say this bullsh**t??

... Dude? What is your problem. I'm 18 years old, I'm doing VCE at the moment, I was born on the 28/08/96, why do you believe I would lie about that? What would I stand to gain? You are such a creep.

You unknowingly made your personal email address public on your account so that everybody could see your Facebook profile which contained your personal info as well as photographs of yourself, your wife and other friends and relatives. This is widely known and was discussed a few months ago, and only after I brought it up did you remove your email address (wisely so) from public view, and then attempted to argue a very strange and nonsensical defense of your alleged character, which nobody believed.

I have absolutely no idea what you "stand to gain" from your actions, because you are not the only middle aged man on this forum, and this forum doesn't have an upper age restriction. But it's really, really weird.

(Posting a random alleged birth date in full only reinforces the case against you).

Wow? Like, yes you saw an email address but did you see the email address contained the name 'Harry' and '96' and the Facebook account was called 'Bruce', now knowing this maybe I helped my dad set up his Facebook account and used one of my many email addresses to do so? ing moron.
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Platypus
hughento
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« Reply #1509 on: September 23, 2014, 09:25:31 AM »

If you think carefully, this discussion doesn't have anything to do with Australia at all.

--------

Everyone, put him on ignore, and unlike me idiotically just now, don't feel tempted to click 'show'.
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Knives
solopop
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« Reply #1510 on: September 23, 2014, 09:37:07 AM »

If you think carefully, this discussion doesn't have anything to do with Australia at all.

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Everyone, put him on ignore, and unlike me idiotically just now, don't feel tempted to click 'show'.

I finally just did that, I seriously don't understand why this German is so interested in me? Like, seriously?

---------------

Do you all reckon that with NZ pushing for a flag change, Australia might actually soon?
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Hifly
hifly15
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« Reply #1511 on: September 23, 2014, 10:19:22 AM »

If you think carefully, this discussion doesn't have anything to do with Australia at all.

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Everyone, put him on ignore, and unlike me idiotically just now, don't feel tempted to click 'show'.

I finally just did that, I seriously don't understand why this German is so interested in me? Like, seriously?

---------------

Do you all reckon that with NZ pushing for a flag change, Australia might actually soon?

If only you had put me on ignore earlier, I wouldn't have kept receiving stupid replies to my posts from you. Let it stay this way.

For everybody else, any proposal of a flag change won't pop up from any LNP lead government. Neither can I see it happening under a pragmatic Shorten-led government with fear of offending. It would require the next ALP prime minister to be someone on the Left and with a substantial majority.
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CrabCake
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« Reply #1512 on: September 23, 2014, 12:02:40 PM »

To be fair (and I do agree Anglophile Abbott wouldn't broach the subject) flags are a relatively "easy" way to win moderate points, while not spending much money. At least that's why I assume Key started this whole thing.
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afleitch
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« Reply #1513 on: September 23, 2014, 02:00:59 PM »

Hifly, I warned your privately about this sort of behaviour. Cool it.
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Fmr President & Senator Polnut
polnut
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« Reply #1514 on: September 27, 2014, 08:44:18 PM »

So, Campbell Newman's task of holding Ashgrove just got much harder.

Enjoy, Campbell
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BaconBacon96
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« Reply #1515 on: September 28, 2014, 02:16:11 AM »

So, Campbell Newman's task of holding Ashgrove just got much harder.

Enjoy, Campbell
If the LNP still win the election but Campbell loses his seat, I wonder who becomes Premier. Jeff Seeney? No thanks.
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Fmr President & Senator Polnut
polnut
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« Reply #1516 on: September 28, 2014, 02:19:32 AM »

So, Campbell Newman's task of holding Ashgrove just got much harder.

Enjoy, Campbell
If the LNP still win the election but Campbell loses his seat, I wonder who becomes Premier. Jeff Seeney? No thanks.

I keep hearing Springbourg ...
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BaconBacon96
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« Reply #1517 on: September 28, 2014, 03:05:57 AM »

So, Campbell Newman's task of holding Ashgrove just got much harder.

Enjoy, Campbell
If the LNP still win the election but Campbell loses his seat, I wonder who becomes Premier. Jeff Seeney? No thanks.

I keep hearing Springbourg ...
Ha. To be honest, I think I'd prefer him to Seeney. That said, there aren't many good choices in the LNP cabinet.
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Knives
solopop
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« Reply #1518 on: September 30, 2014, 10:41:04 PM »

Can anyone explain Christopher Pyne's voice?
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Fmr President & Senator Polnut
polnut
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« Reply #1519 on: September 30, 2014, 10:55:11 PM »

Can anyone explain Christopher Pyne's voice?

Posh Adelaide... see Alexander Downer.
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Mordecai
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« Reply #1520 on: September 30, 2014, 10:57:02 PM »

Can anyone explain Christopher Pyne's voice?

He's an asshole.
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Wake Me Up When The Hard Border Ends
Anton Kreitzer
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« Reply #1521 on: October 01, 2014, 10:00:47 AM »

Tasmania could introduce extremely draconian smoking laws...

I don't smoke myself, and wouldn't personally (don't mind the smell, but don't want heart attacks or bad teeth) but this is clearly a recipe for disaster...

Restricting access to tobacco is a bad idea in my opinion, considering it will just create another black & grey market alike, could result in more people turning to illicit drugs, and opens up the scary avenue for restricting/banning alcohol and fast food. While tobacco is VERY different to say, a bucket of fried chicken or a pint of beer, in that there's second-hand smoke, it still seems absurd to deny adults the right to buy and use tobacco.
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CrabCake
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« Reply #1522 on: October 01, 2014, 10:04:15 AM »

If nobody smoked tobacco, how will the government cope without its sweet, sweet tobacco revenue?
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Knives
solopop
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« Reply #1523 on: October 01, 2014, 10:25:48 AM »

Tasmania could introduce extremely draconian smoking laws...

I don't smoke myself, and wouldn't personally (don't mind the smell, but don't want heart attacks or bad teeth) but this is clearly a recipe for disaster...

Restricting access to tobacco is a bad idea in my opinion, considering it will just create another black & grey market alike, could result in more people turning to illicit drugs, and opens up the scary avenue for restricting/banning alcohol and fast food. While tobacco is VERY different to say, a bucket of fried chicken or a pint of beer, in that there's second-hand smoke, it still seems absurd to deny adults the right to buy and use tobacco.

That is a dreadful idea and will never see the light of day. Like, restrictions on where people can smoke but at the end of the day if a person wants to do that to their body and are willing to pay a lot for it - why not? The anti-smoking crusade is kind of disgusting.
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BaconBacon96
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« Reply #1524 on: October 01, 2014, 11:15:17 AM »

Tasmania could introduce extremely draconian smoking laws...

I don't smoke myself, and wouldn't personally (don't mind the smell, but don't want heart attacks or bad teeth) but this is clearly a recipe for disaster...

Restricting access to tobacco is a bad idea in my opinion, considering it will just create another black & grey market alike, could result in more people turning to illicit drugs, and opens up the scary avenue for restricting/banning alcohol and fast food. While tobacco is VERY different to say, a bucket of fried chicken or a pint of beer, in that there's second-hand smoke, it still seems absurd to deny adults the right to buy and use tobacco.
Indeed, people will soon see the flaws in this idea. Prohibition is a clear failure.
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