For the suburb lovers: Should I feel bad for these kids?

[Gabu]

Also, I thought we weren't going to have to hear about suburbs anymore now that you're in Minneapolis.

[memphis]

Not this sh*t again! Obviously schools vary greatly in quality as do individual cities and suburbs. Just live where you want and shut up about it already. You're just like Carl Hayden and illegal immigration.

[AndrewTX]

I'm trying to find the option where I feel bad for you. Hmm, you must have left it off.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Uh why? Where would they make you go? Sounds pretty overprotective to me. I'm sure most inner-city parents do though, I hardly see a risk in it.

How would you know? You're just as much of a bumpkin as I am.

Isn't the largest town you've ever lived in like 12k or something?

More like 65,000 actually. I currently live in a city with a population of around 12,000.

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Don't recall you ever mentioning a ghetto before. Where was it?

[Tetro Kornbluth]

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As in DIY Punk, or what? If so that's rather interesting.. given that I know some people of that description around about my age and they live in the bad, evil suburbs. And the only place I see those type of emo kids you despise is in the city centre (they seem to like hanging out alongside Dublin Central Bank.. why? I have no idea). But here again comes a disclaimer about Ireland not being America and so forth.

Oh and I must repeat:

Also, I thought we weren't going to have to hear about suburbs anymore now that you're in Minneapolis.

[The Man From G.O.P.]

There's a reason you work that overnight shift BRTD, and a reason why you'll never amount to much.

[angus]

you get to grow up in the inner-city, which would be far more fun.

So you can end up like, say, Andy Sipowics of NYPD blue.  A drunk, bigoted fat cop who enjoys beating up on people?  On many an episode he described what it was like to grow up in an ultra-high density neighborhood.  He often talked about the daily beatings, not only from his father but from the ill-educated, unmotivated teenagers in his neighborhood.  And somehow I'm just not getting that it was "fun."

Or what about Detroit or Houston during the days before the Superfund and unleaded gasoline.  There's a reason that the average adult Manhattanite male is five-foot-eight while the average Nebraskan male is five-foot-eleven.  It has more to do with good food and clean air than with genetics, most now believe.  I think of walking home from school breathing noxious fumes and drinking water from lead pipes.  Mmmm, lead.  Sign me up.

Or consider those who live in the highest density part Calcutta, with maybe 3 or 4 square feet of living space per person.  that'd be great fun.  Having no privacy when you sh**t, and for that matter, pissing and sh**tting only feet from where you regularly eat.  Boy, that just makes me wish my parents were cool enough to move a higher-density city.

I'm really not sure your children's best long-term interests are served when you move to a neighborhood specifically because of its density, or because of the night life.  Maybe they would be.  After all, some of the liveliest spots are in crime-ridden areas, so there's always something exciting to observe.  Lots of education to be gained from people-watching, to be sure.  And some of the greatest poets and songwriters came from broken homes in bad neighborhoods with abusive parents.  Pain can be a great muse.  But it's just not something you normally plan to give your children. 

An unorthodox view, to say the least.  Twenty years from now you can let us know how it works out for your progeny.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Don't recall you ever mentioning a ghetto before. Where was it?

Standing Rock Reservation. Contiguous with Sioux County North Dakota.

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As in DIY Punk, or what? If so that's rather interesting.. given that I know some people of that description around about my age and they live in the bad, evil suburbs. And the only place I see those type of emo kids you despise is in the city centre (they seem to like hanging out alongside Dublin Central Bank.. why? I have no idea). But here again comes a disclaimer about Ireland not being America and so forth.

Because European suburbs are not like American suburbs and not remotely comparable (Are Paris' suburbs like the ones here?)

There's a reason you work that overnight shift BRTD

Because I moved two weeks ago after graduating during a recession maybe?

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Don't recall you ever mentioning a ghetto before. Where was it?

Standing Rock Reservation. Contiguous with Sioux County North Dakota.

So still as much of a bumpkin as me then

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Don't generalise so much about such things.

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Which ones? Anyways the boundaries of Paris were fixed a long time ago; New York (as an example)'s equivilents to the old Red Belt (Red as in Communist. Traditionally) around Paris were incorporated into the city proper a long time ago.

[John Dibble]

No, those kids are likely more intelligent and mature than you, and will possibly have productive and meaningful lives. You are the one that should be pitied, not them.

[Bandit3 the Worker]

I don't see why it would be better to go to an inner-city school.

Contrast:

Covington Independent Schools...or Campbell County Schools.

Any questions?

(I was class of '92, so probably both were better then than they are now.)

[Willy Woz]

Oh, I am certainly feeling bad for somebody...

[Colin]

Let's see... going to a public school in DC or going to a public school in Arlington.  Hmmm... tough choice. 


*dies laughin*

Do I live in DC?

Not every city is Minneapolis though. Hell Minneapolis has more in common with cities in Canada or Australia than any American city.

Then why does Minneapolis have higher crime than Chicago and Newark?

Really? It does? Is that overall crime rate? How much of that is due to crimes like vandalism or petty theft as compared to armed robbery, murder, assault or rape.

Look at city-data's crime index figures. For 2005 (2006 is most recent but figures for Minneapolis are incomplete)

Minneapolis: 769.9
Chicago: 610.0
Newark: 609.0

Well that doesn't really tell me anything since that's an aggregate of all crime data present as some sort of index, which I don't even know how it measures crime nor how it weights different crimes. What I was asking was not that you show me something that says that it is higher but show me actual statistics for violent crime, murder, assault, armed robbery, rape, etc. in comparison to other cities such as Chicago or Detroit. The overall crime may be higher in Minneapolis but this could be because of vandalism or petty theft rather than the violent crimes mentioned above.

[minionofmidas]

Why would urban kids that young have to wait for a schoolbus? If the neighborhood is sufficiently densely populated to seriously deserve being called urban, there will be at least one primary school within easy walking distance, probably several.

[Bandit3 the Worker]

Why would urban kids that young have to wait for a schoolbus? If the neighborhood is sufficiently densely populated to seriously deserve being called urban, there will be at least one primary school within easy walking distance, probably several.

Not necessarily in the U.S.

An urban area around here just lost its primary school, and students have to take a bus 3 miles into a suburb just to go to school.

The fluburbs run the country. They don't care about the cities at all.

[minionofmidas]

Why would urban kids that young have to wait for a schoolbus? If the neighborhood is sufficiently densely populated to seriously deserve being called urban, there will be at least one primary school within easy walking distance, probably several.

Not necessarily in the U.S.

An urban area around here just lost its primary school, and students have to take a bus 3 miles into a suburb just to go to school.

Can't have been so large that I'd call it urban, then.

[Bandit3 the Worker]

Can't have been so large that I'd call it urban, then.

It wasn't that big, but it was urban.

[angus]

Why would urban kids that young have to wait for a schoolbus? If the neighborhood is sufficiently densely populated to seriously deserve being called urban, there will be at least one primary school within easy walking distance, probably several.

I don't know how it is nowadays, but I often had to take a long bus ride across town to go to school, even where there was sometimes an elementary school within eyesight of my house.  Sometimes I'd pass by several schools on the bus ride to my school.  And there would be grade designations.  Once, I remember we lived about three blocks from Bancroft, but I was bussed to Franklin, about three miles away, and my sister, a year younger than I, attended Jones, about four miles away.  The elementary school which was in walking distance of my house, of course, had students from the immediate vicinity of Franklin and Jones elementary schools who attended it.  I actually thought all that was normal.  You know, like no matter how weird the world around you is, you think whatever you experience is just the way it is.  It wasn't until I was older, maybe 12, during the Reagan/Carter debates that I learned "busing" was an issue.  But as a child, I just thought it was quite natural to always have to take a long bus ride to school, even when there was an elementary school within walking distance. 

Anyway, my point is that your assumption that children can walk to the local school is invalid.  At least that's the way it was in the 70s.  I don't know if "busing" is still in fashion.  In Cedar Falls, Iowa, it is not.  You go to your nearest school.  There's one about four blocks from here that my son would attend if he were two years older.  And my understanding is that in Cedar Falls, all schools serve the local neighborhood.  This has become important since we are thinking of buying a house, or at least moving to a new rental property since I'm not entirely satisfied here, and I'd like to know when you look up the composite fourth and eighth grade reading and math scores, and the student/teacher ratio, of the schools close to the house I'm buying or renting actually refer to the schools my son would attend if we stay here a few years.

[Хahar 🤔]

You're bragging about the high crime rate? Seriously.

[Jaggerjack]

My suburban school is among the best in the state.

I don't see why it would be better to go to an inner-city school.

I also don't know why I dignify this thread with a response.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

You're bragging about the high crime rate? Seriously.

Not bragging, just making a point.

[perdedor]

Tall buildings, traffic, and clubs you can't get into do not make a place cool to live. Suburban kids should feel fortunate to be able to go to a highly quality school. I spent the vast majority of my schooling years in downtown Houston.

[Willy Woz]

This is idiotic.

[Platypus]

Grew up in the inner city, went to an inner city primary school, an inner city private school for two years, and an inner city high school. I didn't attend my local inner city high school for three reasons: 1. It wasn't a good school, but some of the best schools are in the inner city and most of the worst are in the suburbs; 2. I was offered a place at a selective-entry state school of high quality (and before that a half-scholarship at one of the best private schools, both in reputation and actuality, in the state; 3. The school ethos was not at all a match for my personality.

The situation is different in the US, due to zoning. I strongly support school vouchers for public high schools, with school specialisation in areas such as trade skills, art, music, performing arts, academics, sports, etc.; with an increase in funding for lower year levels. Give each student a quality baseand then a choice for their final years of schooling. Of course, some schools would remain non-specialised, and specialised schools woul still cater for multiple interests, but thissystem enables more efficent education for an individual student, imho.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

I love how I made this poll just to take a cheap shot at suburb lovers, and yet most are taking the bait and saying "yes, you should feel bad for any kid living in the inner city because growing up there is always hell."