End of the Budget Amendment [Withdrawn]
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  End of the Budget Amendment [Withdrawn]
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Author Topic: End of the Budget Amendment [Withdrawn]  (Read 5824 times)
Verily
Cuivienen
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« on: February 02, 2008, 03:14:35 PM »
« edited: February 26, 2008, 11:14:25 PM by Verily »

End of the Budget Amendment

Article I, Section 8 of the Constitution is hereby repealed.

(Sponsor: Ebowed)
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Speed of Sound
LiberalPA
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« Reply #1 on: February 02, 2008, 03:17:55 PM »

I have been calling for this for months. We havent passed a budget in a year and half, lets kill it already.
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Јas
Jas
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« Reply #2 on: February 02, 2008, 03:41:51 PM »

I think it's clear the budgetary process doesn't work.

If there is to be any sort of budgetary process, the current constitutional model, simply isn't workable. Given the problems involved in a budgetary process, I believe that if any form of budgetary practive is to be tried in future then it should be based on statutary, not constitutional, principles.

I would therefore recommend that this amendment be passed and that should those willing to commit to work on a budgetary process wish to proceed with one a legislative franework be submitted as ordinary legislation for consideration.
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Kaine for Senate '18
benconstine
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« Reply #3 on: February 02, 2008, 03:48:57 PM »

I seem to be turning into a full-time lobbyist: I encourage Senators to either pass this Bill, or begin passing Budgets again.
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Speed of Sound
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« Reply #4 on: February 02, 2008, 03:52:47 PM »

I seem to be turning into a full-time lobbyist: I encourage Senators to either pass this Bill, or begin passing Budgets again.
The latter, I remind all of my colleagues, includes dealing with inflation, economic demographics, and and sifting through every bill with any spending in it in the last year and a half. Any takers? Wink
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Robespierre's Jaw
Senator Conor Flynn
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« Reply #5 on: February 02, 2008, 04:52:32 PM »

Are we going to give up on the budget this easily?

Back in 2005, the Atlasian Government successfully passed the October 2005 Budget by a vote of 6-3 (i'm quite sure). The Senate didn't give up on it back then, why should we now? Are we going to use the same old excuse we haven't had one in nearly 2 years we should kill it off?

I wouldn't be surprised if the Senate did.
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Jake
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« Reply #6 on: February 02, 2008, 04:59:19 PM »

Anyone interested in submitting a budget for the Senate's approval is more than welcome. I'll even introduce it. But I'm simply not interested in doing it.
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Speed of Sound
LiberalPA
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« Reply #7 on: February 02, 2008, 05:35:29 PM »

Are we going to give up on the budget this easily?

Back in 2005, the Atlasian Government successfully passed the October 2005 Budget by a vote of 6-3 (i'm quite sure). The Senate didn't give up on it back then, why should we now? Are we going to use the same old excuse we haven't had one in nearly 2 years we should kill it off?

I wouldn't be surprised if the Senate did.
Then you go for it. If you chair the committee, Ill be on the committee and we can work it out. I think youll be surprised how bad we fail.
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Robespierre's Jaw
Senator Conor Flynn
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« Reply #8 on: February 02, 2008, 05:40:55 PM »


I doubt that would even happen Senator because you guys would vote it down anyway.
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Sensei
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« Reply #9 on: February 02, 2008, 05:54:13 PM »

I think we need to get rid of it right now, and if the time comes that someone comes up with a good way  to bring it back, and the Senate sees it fit, we do a budget.
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Speed of Sound
LiberalPA
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« Reply #10 on: February 02, 2008, 08:46:37 PM »


I doubt that would even happen Senator because you guys would vote it down anyway.
Thats because we would need a majority to agree on made up numbers. It just isnt do-able, but Ill work with ya if you REALLY want to.
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Small Business Owner of Any Repute
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« Reply #11 on: February 02, 2008, 09:14:03 PM »

I will pledge to vote for this Amendment if the Senate can cocurrently pass a bill requiring the Senate to pass a budget outside of the constitution where,

(1) Senate business does not grind to a halt when budgetary matters are being discussed,
(2) The Senate is empowered to define what goes into the budget, making it independent of having a GM, and
(3) Require the Senate to pass a budget "from time to time," as we have now required a State of the Union address to be given "from time to time."

I do not think the Senate should abandon the budget process entirely.  Give those of us who wish to try and pass a budget the tools to do so.  As things currently stand, we are constitutionally unable to pass a legit budget.
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Ebowed
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« Reply #12 on: February 02, 2008, 10:23:04 PM »

Are we going to give up on the budget this easily?

Back in 2005, the Atlasian Government successfully passed the October 2005 Budget by a vote of 6-3 (i'm quite sure). The Senate didn't give up on it back then, why should we now? Are we going to use the same old excuse we haven't had one in nearly 2 years we should kill it off?

I wouldn't be surprised if the Senate did.

Very ill-informed.

The last few budgets the Senate did pass, over two years ago, were exact copies of previously passed budgets merely adjusted for legislative changes- there was little result out of the actual debate on the budget, then, and it was only done to fulfill the constitutional requirement.

This isn't giving up.  This is acknowledging that it's time to move on.
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Verily
Cuivienen
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« Reply #13 on: February 05, 2008, 01:13:23 PM »

Bump.
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minionofmidas
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« Reply #14 on: February 05, 2008, 04:37:47 PM »

Reintroducing a budget requires admitting we aren't the US first.
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Verily
Cuivienen
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« Reply #15 on: February 10, 2008, 01:34:06 PM »

If no one has anything further to add, I will move for a final vote in twenty-four hours. Though I can't imagine that debate on this isn't more contentious. Perhaps people are just sick of discussing the Budget.
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Small Business Owner of Any Repute
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« Reply #16 on: February 12, 2008, 01:48:56 AM »

If no one has anything further to add, I will move for a final vote in twenty-four hours. Though I can't imagine that debate on this isn't more contentious. Perhaps people are just sick of discussing the Budget.

I think it's the latter, and the fact that this bill just got lost in the shuffle a bit.  I'll introduce an amendment tomorrow.
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Small Business Owner of Any Repute
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« Reply #17 on: February 12, 2008, 12:31:40 PM »

Article 1, Section 8 of the Constitution is hereby amended to read:

Section 8: Budget
1. The Senate shall be responsible for drafting and approving a Budget from time to time, as determined by the membership of the body.
2. The Senate shall be empowered to decide what will be included in each Budget, and what may be excluded.
3. The Senate shall be empowered to decide how and where Atlasia derives each year's economic figures (such as GDP estimates, estimates of tax revenue, or needed additional appropriations, etc.).
4. The Senate shall continue to conduct ordinary business while discussion of each budget continues.
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Small Business Owner of Any Repute
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« Reply #18 on: February 12, 2008, 12:33:16 PM »

The proposed amendment essentially eliminates the budget requirement in the same manner with which we eliminated the State of the Union requirement, while empowering those of us who wish to attempt a budget the power and ability to do so.
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Speed of Sound
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« Reply #19 on: February 12, 2008, 10:24:29 PM »

This amendment only legalizes what we've already been doing for almost 2 years. Thusly, the passing of this amendment is, in fact, the killing of this bill secretly. I will vote against the amendment, and urge my fellow senators to do the same.
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Sensei
senseiofj324
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« Reply #20 on: February 12, 2008, 11:09:48 PM »

I will definitely be voting against this amendment.
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Small Business Owner of Any Repute
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« Reply #21 on: February 13, 2008, 01:08:51 AM »

This amendment only legalizes what we've already been doing for almost 2 years. Thusly, the passing of this amendment is, in fact, the killing of this bill secretly. I will vote against the amendment, and urge my fellow senators to do the same.

No, it actually makes us legally able to draft a budget.
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Verily
Cuivienen
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« Reply #22 on: February 13, 2008, 06:27:45 PM »

We are now voting on the following amendment. Please vote Aye, Nay or Abstain.

Article 1, Section 8 of the Constitution is hereby amended to read:

Section 8: Budget
1. The Senate shall be responsible for drafting and approving a Budget from time to time, as determined by the membership of the body.
2. The Senate shall be empowered to decide what will be included in each Budget, and what may be excluded.
3. The Senate shall be empowered to decide how and where Atlasia derives each year's economic figures (such as GDP estimates, estimates of tax revenue, or needed additional appropriations, etc.).
4. The Senate shall continue to conduct ordinary business while discussion of each budget continues.

Aye
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Ebowed
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« Reply #23 on: February 13, 2008, 07:18:28 PM »

Nay
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Speed of Sound
LiberalPA
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« Reply #24 on: February 13, 2008, 07:33:32 PM »

Nay
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