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Author Topic: Question on Catholicism (Yay!)  (Read 4952 times)
Хahar
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« on: April 20, 2008, 08:17:23 pm »
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The list of popes fascinates me. (Does it to anyone else?) But there's one thing that confuses me. What difference between Pope-elect Stephen and Adrian V is there that makes the latter Pope but the former a simple priest?
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« Reply #1 on: April 20, 2008, 09:27:46 pm »
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I thought it was that Stephen died before he could become a Bishop (or something like that).
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« Reply #2 on: April 21, 2008, 02:00:16 am »
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The list of popes fascinates me. (Does it to anyone else?) But there's one thing that confuses me. What difference between Pope-elect Stephen and Adrian V is there that makes the latter Pope but the former a simple priest?


Stephen had not yet been consecrated a bishop at the time of his death.  It took a long time for the Vatican to hammer the system out, as evidenced by the irregularities in the numberings of Stephens and Johns (there is no John XX), but it was decided that, if you were a bishop when proclaimed Pope, then you automatically became the pope, you just had to be formally installed at the Lateran.  If you were not yet a bishop at the time of your being proclaimed pope, then you were not the Pope until becoming a Bishop.

The latter circumstance will likely never happen again, as a non-bishop hasn't been named a Cardinal is several centuries and a non-Cardinal hasn't been chosen in at least as long.
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« Reply #3 on: April 21, 2008, 02:34:02 am »
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Also interesting is how there was once a female pope.
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« Reply #4 on: April 21, 2008, 07:22:29 am »
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The list of popes fascinates me. (Does it to anyone else?) But there's one thing that confuses me. What difference between Pope-elect Stephen and Adrian V is there that makes the latter Pope but the former a simple priest?


Stephen had not yet been consecrated a bishop at the time of his death.  It took a long time for the Vatican to hammer the system out, as evidenced by the irregularities in the numberings of Stephens and Johns (there is no John XX), but it was decided that, if you were a bishop when proclaimed Pope, then you automatically became the pope, you just had to be formally installed at the Lateran.  If you were not yet a bishop at the time of your being proclaimed pope, then you were not the Pope until becoming a Bishop.

The latter circumstance will likely never happen again, as a non-bishop hasn't been named a Cardinal is several centuries and a non-Cardinal hasn't been chosen in at least as long.

Cool!  I was right Smiley
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« Reply #5 on: April 21, 2008, 06:34:56 pm »
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Also interesting is how there was once a female pope.

Do you really believe that?
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« Reply #6 on: April 21, 2008, 07:26:08 pm »
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Also interesting is how there was once a female pope.

Also interesting about how that never happened.

Not only can we trace the origins of that legend and why, we can also patently disprove it.
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« Reply #7 on: April 21, 2008, 07:28:48 pm »
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Also interesting is how there was once a female pope.

Do you really believe that?

The myth of Pope Joan is about as creditable as the Prophesies of St. Malachy, which is to say not at all.
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Хahar
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« Reply #8 on: April 22, 2008, 07:58:50 pm »
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Also interesting is how there was once a female pope.

Do you really believe that?

The myth of Pope Joan is about as creditable as the Prophesies of St. Malachy, which is to say not at all.

I'd say the Prophecies are much more credible than Pope Joan; they've been bought into by serious Catholics, if in a half-joking way.
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« Reply #9 on: April 22, 2008, 08:30:29 pm »
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Also interesting is how there was once a female pope.

Do you really believe that?

The myth of Pope Joan is about as creditable as the Prophesies of St. Malachy, which is to say not at all.

I'd say the Prophecies are much more credible than Pope Joan; they've been bought into by serious Catholics, if in a half-joking way.

The Prophesies were "rediscovered" in the 1500's.  Hmmm... interesting how, looking at the mottos, the ones prior to the 1500's are dead on accurate, whereas with the ones after then, you have to stretch the absolute limits of your imagination to get them to fit.  And the one for Benedict XIV can't even be bended to fit him at all.  "A rural animal"... he was from the second largest city in Italy at the time.  Where you look at this article http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prophecy_of_the_Popes#cite_note-70 And see how hard people have tried to make the other ones work, then realize that his explanation is blank, that just goes to show how off it is.

Eitherway, they are both utter crap... and even if they were real, it is almost certain the "Peter the Roman" prediction was added after the original prophesies.
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Хahar
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« Reply #10 on: April 22, 2008, 08:37:49 pm »
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Also interesting is how there was once a female pope.

Do you really believe that?

The myth of Pope Joan is about as creditable as the Prophesies of St. Malachy, which is to say not at all.

I'd say the Prophecies are much more credible than Pope Joan; they've been bought into by serious Catholics, if in a half-joking way.

The Prophesies were "rediscovered" in the 1500's.  Hmmm... interesting how, looking at the mottos, the ones prior to the 1500's are dead on accurate, whereas with the ones after then, you have to stretch the absolute limits of your imagination to get them to fit.  And the one for Benedict XIV can't even be bended to fit him at all.  "A rural animal"... he was from the second largest city in Italy at the time.  Where you look at this article http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prophecy_of_the_Popes#cite_note-70 And see how hard people have tried to make the other ones work, then realize that his explanation is blank, that just goes to show how off it is.

Eitherway, they are both utter crap... and even if they were real, it is almost certain the "Peter the Roman" prediction was added after the original prophesies.

Yeah; it's good for a laugh, though.
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« Reply #11 on: April 22, 2008, 10:41:45 pm »
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Also interesting is how there was once a female pope.

Do you really believe that?

The myth of Pope Joan is about as creditable as the Prophesies of St. Malachy, which is to say not at all.

I'd say the Prophecies are much more credible than Pope Joan; they've been bought into by serious Catholics, if in a half-joking way.

The Prophesies were "rediscovered" in the 1500's.  Hmmm... interesting how, looking at the mottos, the ones prior to the 1500's are dead on accurate, whereas with the ones after then, you have to stretch the absolute limits of your imagination to get them to fit.  And the one for Benedict XIV can't even be bended to fit him at all.  "A rural animal"... he was from the second largest city in Italy at the time.  Where you look at this article http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prophecy_of_the_Popes#cite_note-70 And see how hard people have tried to make the other ones work, then realize that his explanation is blank, that just goes to show how off it is.

Eitherway, they are both utter crap... and even if they were real, it is almost certain the "Peter the Roman" prediction was added after the original prophesies.

Yeah; it's good for a laugh, though.

Yeah, but I recently had a debate with my aunt over it, because she is the kind of Catholic who believes it just because a few people take it seriously (she is not a scholar) and because she is convinced the end is coming soon anyway.
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Хahar
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« Reply #12 on: April 22, 2008, 10:46:01 pm »
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Also interesting is how there was once a female pope.

Do you really believe that?

The myth of Pope Joan is about as creditable as the Prophesies of St. Malachy, which is to say not at all.

I'd say the Prophecies are much more credible than Pope Joan; they've been bought into by serious Catholics, if in a half-joking way.

The Prophesies were "rediscovered" in the 1500's.  Hmmm... interesting how, looking at the mottos, the ones prior to the 1500's are dead on accurate, whereas with the ones after then, you have to stretch the absolute limits of your imagination to get them to fit.  And the one for Benedict XIV can't even be bended to fit him at all.  "A rural animal"... he was from the second largest city in Italy at the time.  Where you look at this article http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prophecy_of_the_Popes#cite_note-70 And see how hard people have tried to make the other ones work, then realize that his explanation is blank, that just goes to show how off it is.

Eitherway, they are both utter crap... and even if they were real, it is almost certain the "Peter the Roman" prediction was added after the original prophesies.

Yeah; it's good for a laugh, though.

Yeah, but I recently had a debate with my aunt over it, because she is the kind of Catholic who believes it just because a few people take it seriously (she is not a scholar) and because she is convinced the end is coming soon anyway.

The last prophecy doesn't actually predict The End, does it? Or is that synonymous with the last pope?
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« Reply #13 on: April 22, 2008, 10:56:39 pm »
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Also interesting is how there was once a female pope.

Do you really believe that?

The myth of Pope Joan is about as creditable as the Prophesies of St. Malachy, which is to say not at all.

I'd say the Prophecies are much more credible than Pope Joan; they've been bought into by serious Catholics, if in a half-joking way.

The Prophesies were "rediscovered" in the 1500's.  Hmmm... interesting how, looking at the mottos, the ones prior to the 1500's are dead on accurate, whereas with the ones after then, you have to stretch the absolute limits of your imagination to get them to fit.  And the one for Benedict XIV can't even be bended to fit him at all.  "A rural animal"... he was from the second largest city in Italy at the time.  Where you look at this article http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prophecy_of_the_Popes#cite_note-70 And see how hard people have tried to make the other ones work, then realize that his explanation is blank, that just goes to show how off it is.

Eitherway, they are both utter crap... and even if they were real, it is almost certain the "Peter the Roman" prediction was added after the original prophesies.

Yeah; it's good for a laugh, though.

Yeah, but I recently had a debate with my aunt over it, because she is the kind of Catholic who believes it just because a few people take it seriously (she is not a scholar) and because she is convinced the end is coming soon anyway.

The last prophecy doesn't actually predict The End, does it? Or is that synonymous with the last pope?

Depends on exactly what theology you follow.

I don't really believe in a literal end times, so I think the papacy is going to go on forever.

Those who do believe in "End Times" or more appropriately the "New Earth" would tell you that the two evens would be synonymous and, in fact, the New Earth requires an end to the Papacy, as it would, by definition, usher in an era where the Papacy as an institution is unnecessary.  If Christ rules directly over the Earth again, then there is no need for a Vicar of Christ.
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« Reply #14 on: January 20, 2010, 03:20:02 pm »
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The Prophesies were "rediscovered" in the 1500's.  Hmmm... interesting how, looking at the mottos, the ones prior to the 1500's are dead on accurate, whereas with the ones after then, you have to stretch the absolute limits of your imagination to get them to fit.  And the one for Benedict XIV can't even be bended to fit him at all.  "A rural animal"... he was from the second largest city in Italy at the time.  Where you look at this article http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prophecy_of_the_Popes#cite_note-70 And see how hard people have tried to make the other ones work, then realize that his explanation is blank, that just goes to show how off it is.

Eitherway, they are both utter crap... and even if they were real, it is almost certain the "Peter the Roman" prediction was added after the original prophesies.

Jesus Christ has raised me from the dead!

I am in the process of attempting to respond to the first 1000 results in a google search for 'Peter the Roman', the final pontiff in the St. Malachy prophecies.  Total  results are over 3 million.  Yet, the prophecy given in 1139 A.D. was in virtual obscurity for over 400 years until the invention of the printing press.  In the computer age there has been a resurgence in the interest of the list of names.

As Jesus Christ spoke of not rejoicing over our ability to pray that our joy may be full, but that our names are written in heaven, and the fact that Jesus Christ has raised me from the dead to the office of 'Peter the Roman', I hold that the list of names in the St. Malachy prophecies are akin to, if not exactly, those very names written in heaven.

Even Nostradamus spoke of 'Peter the Roman' in Century VII, #24.

The use of 'the strong one' in the quatrain refers to Daniel 7:7.

Jesus Christ's resurrecting me is in His fulfillment of an agreement of contract law (Matthew 3:15) into which both He and I entered prior to my baptising Him.

Atlas comes up in the 201-300 page of results.

I am pleased to meet you.

Please feel free to respond.

The reality of the future is not totally revealed to us, it is written, "eye hath not seen, nor ear heard of the wonders God has in store for us."

As Christ had sent me to bear him witness, I now bear witness that HEAVEN IS GREAT!!!

The world will be saved through the Blessed Virgin Mary's Brown Scapular and Rosary as prophesied.
« Last Edit: January 21, 2010, 11:37:20 pm by Edward Palamar »Logged

I normally use my surname, Edward Palamar, but I remain:

the resurrected John,
Prophet of the Most High,
whom Jesus Christ called the "Elias who was to come.",
St. John the Baptist,
enjoying the rapture in the call of duty as Peter the Roman
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« Reply #15 on: January 20, 2010, 04:34:38 pm »
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Go away.
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« Reply #16 on: January 21, 2010, 12:27:14 am »
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Wow... this is too good to delete.  I think I'll enshrine it in the museum of idiocy instead.
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« Reply #17 on: January 21, 2010, 01:20:09 am »
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I am in the process of attempting to respond to the first 1000 results in a google search for 'Peter the Roman', the final pontiff in the St. Malachy prophecies.  Total  results are over 3 million.

God told me he wants you to go all the way.  Don't let him down.
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« Reply #18 on: January 21, 2010, 01:58:15 am »
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Hey God told him to bump 20 month-old posts. Don't mess.
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« Reply #19 on: January 21, 2010, 02:10:59 am »
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WTF?
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« Reply #20 on: January 21, 2010, 04:50:51 am »
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The Prophesies were "rediscovered" in the 1500's.  Hmmm... interesting how, looking at the mottos, the ones prior to the 1500's are dead on accurate, whereas with the ones after then, you have to stretch the absolute limits of your imagination to get them to fit.  And the one for Benedict XIV can't even be bended to fit him at all.  "A rural animal"... he was from the second largest city in Italy at the time.  Where you look at this article http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prophecy_of_the_Popes#cite_note-70 And see how hard people have tried to make the other ones work, then realize that his explanation is blank, that just goes to show how off it is.

Eitherway, they are both utter crap... and even if they were real, it is almost certain the "Peter the Roman" prediction was added after the original prophesies.

Jesus Christ has raised me from the dead!

I am in the process of attempting to respond to the first 1000 results in a google search for 'Peter the Roman', the final pontiff in the St. Malachy prophecies.  Total  results are over 3 million.  Yet, the prophecy given in 1139 A.D. was in virtual obscurity for over 400 years until the invention of the printing press.  In the computer age there has been a resurgence in the interest of the list of names.

As Jesus Christ spoke of not rejoicing over our ability to pray that our joy may be full, but that our names are written in heaven, and the fact that Jesus Christ has raised me from the dead to the office of 'Peter the Roman', I hold that the list of names in the St. Malachy prophecies are akin to, if not exactly, those very names written in heaven.

Even Nostradamus spoke of 'Peter the Roman' in Century VII, #24.

The use of 'the strong one' in the quatrain refers to Daniel 7:7.

Jesus Christ's resurrecting me is in His fulfillment of an agreement of contract law (Matthew 3:15) into which both He and I entered prior to my baptising Him.

Atlas comes up in the 201-300 page of results.

I am pleased to meet you.

Please feel free to respond.

The reality of the future is not totally revealed to us, it is written, "eye hath not seen, nor ear heard of the wonders God has in store for us."

As Christ had sent me to bear him witness, I now bear witness that HEAVEN IS GREAT!!!

What a troll! Grin
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Benwah [why on Earth do I post something] Courseyay
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« Reply #21 on: January 21, 2010, 09:42:43 am »
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lol at the reactions. Smiley
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« Reply #22 on: January 21, 2010, 04:36:55 pm »
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WOW....ok, no more questions about Catholicism....Wink
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« Reply #23 on: January 21, 2010, 06:23:08 pm »
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WOW....ok, no more questions about Catholicism....Wink

Smiley

I especially like how he claims that God has risen him from the grave to take on the task of being the final Pope.
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« Reply #24 on: January 21, 2010, 08:08:27 pm »
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WOW....ok, no more questions about Catholicism....Wink

Smiley

I especially like how he claims that God has risen him from the grave to take on the task of being the final Pope.

If that were true, one thinks that a Swiss Guard or two might have noticed a walking out from under St. Peter's.
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