Gas Price Relief...is it possible?

[Small Business Owner of Any Repute]

There is relief:  They're called two legs and a heart beat...

Walk more, bike more, bundle errands together, keep your tires properly inflated, drive the more fuel efficient car if you have more than one...

In the medium term trade in your car for a more fuel efficient one.

In the long term, build train tracks.

Yeah, walking around is a real option when you have to go out and run errands with a large family. Going grocery shopping is real realistic w/out a vehicle.

Funny, those of us "big city folk" manage that all the time.

[JSojourner]

Big Oil isn't pushing prices higher. They've been just as corrupt, self-centered, and powerful in government the past century, but prices have stayed low. The only reason they're spiking now is because the two largest countries on the planet are now industrializing.

Absolutely right.

They were making shamefully obscene profits BEFORE the sluicegate opened and started pouring money into their pockets.  Now, the gate is open and they are drowning in cash. All the more reason to set tough price controls.  (and while we're at it, raise the taxes on big oil CEOs.  We can call it reparations.  Hell--  the people who manufactured compact discs ended up paying out for overcharging.  Why not Conoco?)

$3.75 a gallon in Indiana today.  I am wondering if $4.00 or $5.00 will be the point at which people start getting out pitchforks and torches.

[Franzl]

neither have you franz.

lol

[MODU]

Use Public Transit.

There, problem solved!

Not really, since most public transportation systems could handle a sudden flood of users.  Their capacity is usually set at a low percentage of the population - between 10% to 15%.  That would require a massive expasion of the public transportation services, which cities (let alone suburbs and rural areas) would not be able to afford and/or respond to in a short amount of time.

[2952-0-0]

That would require a massive expasion of the public transportation services, which cities (let alone suburbs and rural areas) would not be able to afford and/or respond to in a short amount of time.

They'd better do so, given that soaring price of crude oil will cause the cost of maintaning existing infrastructure (e.g. roads, utilities, etc) to soar.

If things turn out really bad, we're in for a painful transition similar to the problems in Russia in the 1990s.

[bgwah]

There is relief:  They're called two legs and a heart beat...

Walk more, bike more, bundle errands together, keep your tires properly inflated, drive the more fuel efficient car if you have more than one...

In the medium term trade in your car for a more fuel efficient one.

In the long term, build train tracks.

Yeah, walking around is a real option when you have to go out and run errands with a large family. Going grocery shopping is real realistic w/out a vehicle.

Emphasis on "large" in your case

Still reformed and polite, I see. Nothing like the old Bgwah at all.

But him calling someone a moron is okay? Typical Douchestaf.

[Jake]

Absolutely right.

They were making shamefully obscene profits BEFORE the sluicegate opened and started pouring money into their pockets.  Now, the gate is open and they are drowning in cash. All the more reason to set tough price controls.  (and while we're at it, raise the taxes on big oil CEOs.  We can call it reparations.  Hell--  the people who manufactured compact discs ended up paying out for overcharging.  Why not Conoco?)

$3.75 a gallon in Indiana today.  I am wondering if $4.00 or $5.00 will be the point at which people start getting out pitchforks and torches.

Because it's their fault prices are high? You're barking up the wrong tree on this one.

[Verily]

Well, what the Northeast and Pacific areas are doing is a good start.  Rebuilding town centers, slowly eliminating the strip mall, and overall focusing on turning away from car-dependent development.  The transit villages being built around Portland and New York City are positive developments as well.  People no longer need their cars in order to get to shopping, entertainment, or their jobs.  The focus on connecting suburbs to urban cores will reduce the need for cars and thus oil.  Close-knit communities are the solution to our oil obsession, and fortunately, they are becoming popular once again.  Unfortuntely from what I've seen, the South is not in step (surprise) with most of the country and is expanding their automobile-dependent culture at unbelievable rates.

You must not have been to California recently. It's probably the worst offender in terms of poor development planning, save perhaps Texas, Arizona and Georgia (or rather, Atlanta). Of course, northern California is not quite as bad as southern California, and it probably gets better in Oregon and Washington.

Ultimately, the painful transition has to be made. I suppose this is easy to say living somewhere which doesn't require much of a transition, certainly compared to about 90% of the country, but that doesn't change the reality. Manhattan, not Phoenix, is the future.

[JSojourner]

Absolutely right.

They were making shamefully obscene profits BEFORE the sluicegate opened and started pouring money into their pockets.  Now, the gate is open and they are drowning in cash. All the more reason to set tough price controls.  (and while we're at it, raise the taxes on big oil CEOs.  We can call it reparations.  Hell--  the people who manufactured compact discs ended up paying out for overcharging.  Why not Conoco?)

$3.75 a gallon in Indiana today.  I am wondering if $4.00 or $5.00 will be the point at which people start getting out pitchforks and torches.

Because it's their fault prices are high? You're barking up the wrong tree on this one.

Well wait a minute.

If gas is four bucks a gallon, and the oil companies are reaping almost unimagineable profits, what am I missing here?  I understand that they have to make a profit...that's business.  But there's profit and there's shameless gouging of the public. 

Exxon Mobil made 40 (B) billion in 2007.  Numbers in the first quarter of this year appear to be ahead of last year's pace.  And it looks to be the same for nearly all the other major oil companies.  Now, am I supposed to believe that on $4.00 a gallon, Exxon's costs are $3.50 a gallon...and then the .50 cent profit has to be split with service stations?  Something like that?  When I ask if I am missing something here, I'm being serious -- I could be.  But if that's the case, where are these massive earnings coming from?

They keep telling us they need to increase the price of gas because this refinery is closed, because there's violence in Nigeria, because Hugo Chavez is acting squirrelly or because that refinery is at half capacity...we hear different explanations all the time.  But if these are painful expenses for oil companies, wouldn't the pain show in their bottom line?

I'm just a solo proprietorship -- self employed, etc.  So I probably don't have a clue.  But something isn't adding up here.

What it SEEMS like, is that they are making shocking amounts of money (profit), claiming hard times and laughing at all the idiots who they have over a barrel.

[Ban my account ffs!]

The selfish isolationist in me says "The day we achieve energy independence is the day we can end this destructive friendship we have with oil producing nations of the Middle East.  Then we can actually call the Saudis out for who they really are:  Brutal totalitarian tyrants fit for a dark, dank, prison cell.

[dead0man]

If gas is four bucks a gallon, and the oil companies are reaping almost unimagineable profits, what am I missing here?  I understand that they have to make a profit...that's business.  But there's profit and there's shameless gouging of the public. 

Exxon Mobil made 40 (B) billion in 2007.  Numbers in the first quarter of this year appear to be ahead of last year's pace.  And it looks to be the same for nearly all the other major oil companies.  Now, am I supposed to believe that on $4.00 a gallon, Exxon's costs are $3.50 a gallon...and then the .50 cent profit has to be split with service stations?  Something like that?  When I ask if I am missing something here, I'm being serious -- I could be.  But if that's the case, where are these massive earnings coming from?

They keep telling us they need to increase the price of gas because this refinery is closed, because there's violence in Nigeria, because Hugo Chavez is acting squirrelly or because that refinery is at half capacity...we hear different explanations all the time.  But if these are painful expenses for oil companies, wouldn't the pain show in their bottom line?

I'm just a solo proprietorship -- self employed, etc.  So I probably don't have a clue.  But something isn't adding up here.

What it SEEMS like, is that they are making shocking amounts of money (profit), claiming hard times and laughing at all the idiots who they have over a barrel.

I'm still trying to figure out why you hate the enviroment.

[bullmoose88]

Absolutely right.

They were making shamefully obscene profits BEFORE the sluicegate opened and started pouring money into their pockets.  Now, the gate is open and they are drowning in cash. All the more reason to set tough price controls.  (and while we're at it, raise the taxes on big oil CEOs.  We can call it reparations.  Hell--  the people who manufactured compact discs ended up paying out for overcharging.  Why not Conoco?)

$3.75 a gallon in Indiana today.  I am wondering if $4.00 or $5.00 will be the point at which people start getting out pitchforks and torches.

Because it's their fault prices are high? You're barking up the wrong tree on this one.

Well wait a minute.

If gas is four bucks a gallon, and the oil companies are reaping almost unimagineable profits, what am I missing here?  I understand that they have to make a profit...that's business.  But there's profit and there's shameless gouging of the public. 

Exxon Mobil made 40 (B) billion in 2007.  Numbers in the first quarter of this year appear to be ahead of last year's pace.  And it looks to be the same for nearly all the other major oil companies.  Now, am I supposed to believe that on $4.00 a gallon, Exxon's costs are $3.50 a gallon...and then the .50 cent profit has to be split with service stations?  Something like that?  When I ask if I am missing something here, I'm being serious -- I could be.  But if that's the case, where are these massive earnings coming from?

They keep telling us they need to increase the price of gas because this refinery is closed, because there's violence in Nigeria, because Hugo Chavez is acting squirrelly or because that refinery is at half capacity...we hear different explanations all the time.  But if these are painful expenses for oil companies, wouldn't the pain show in their bottom line?

I'm just a solo proprietorship -- self employed, etc.  So I probably don't have a clue.  But something isn't adding up here.

What it SEEMS like, is that they are making shocking amounts of money (profit), claiming hard times and laughing at all the idiots who they have over a barrel.

Not that I necessarily believe it, but if you believe the margin that the gas station owner, and the fuel companies get has remained pretty much the same (adjusted for inflation)...can't the increased profits be due to 1) an increase in quantity sold (as the number of cars/drivers/cars using lots of fuel) rather than an increase in price or price going to the companies, and 2) an increase in the nominal profit due to inflation?

[Gustaf]

There is relief:  They're called two legs and a heart beat...

Walk more, bike more, bundle errands together, keep your tires properly inflated, drive the more fuel efficient car if you have more than one...

In the medium term trade in your car for a more fuel efficient one.

In the long term, build train tracks.

Yeah, walking around is a real option when you have to go out and run errands with a large family. Going grocery shopping is real realistic w/out a vehicle.

Emphasis on "large" in your case

Still reformed and polite, I see. Nothing like the old Bgwah at all.

But him calling someone a moron is okay? Typical Douchestaf.

I didn't say it was okay. He also responded to a pretty mean attack and can be at least somewhat excused by overreacting to that. And attacking someone's family members' weight is much worse than calling someone a moron. But I'm sure you know that perfectly well. After all, you would never let someone off with something as kind as "moron" would you now? After all, that might not hurt as bad as the stuff you like.

[bgwah]

No, you're just maintaining your grudge against someone because of what happened in a silly fantasy elections game 4+ years ago. You only make a point to respond to what I say, and it's fairly obvious. And I was specifically referring to States himself, not anyone else. States has made fun of someone for being disabled after a car accident, but he's just a little angel in your book isn't he? Hahaha.

But it is pretty hilarious that someone who likes to act all big and tough admits they're too pathetic and weak to even walk to the grocery store. Hahaha.

[JSojourner]

If gas is four bucks a gallon, and the oil companies are reaping almost unimagineable profits, what am I missing here?  I understand that they have to make a profit...that's business.  But there's profit and there's shameless gouging of the public. 

Exxon Mobil made 40 (B) billion in 2007.  Numbers in the first quarter of this year appear to be ahead of last year's pace.  And it looks to be the same for nearly all the other major oil companies.  Now, am I supposed to believe that on $4.00 a gallon, Exxon's costs are $3.50 a gallon...and then the .50 cent profit has to be split with service stations?  Something like that?  When I ask if I am missing something here, I'm being serious -- I could be.  But if that's the case, where are these massive earnings coming from?

They keep telling us they need to increase the price of gas because this refinery is closed, because there's violence in Nigeria, because Hugo Chavez is acting squirrelly or because that refinery is at half capacity...we hear different explanations all the time.  But if these are painful expenses for oil companies, wouldn't the pain show in their bottom line?

I'm just a solo proprietorship -- self employed, etc.  So I probably don't have a clue.  But something isn't adding up here.

What it SEEMS like, is that they are making shocking amounts of money (profit), claiming hard times and laughing at all the idiots who they have over a barrel.

I'm still trying to figure out why you hate the enviroment.

Because I am convinced that those soft, sweet-looking little bunny rabbits and those cute little squirrels, such as the one in Snowguy's sig are in cahoots.  They, and the beagles, are planning world domination.

[opebo]

The only way to get gas price relief, and to ensure that we could have cheap gas for a few decades into the future, would be to destroy around 1/4 of the world's population, thus reducing demand.  So nuke the Chinese.

then who will make our socks

If gas goes back to $1.00/gallon, we can knit our own.

[MODU]

Grrrr . . . stupid "gas tax holiday" crap.  Don't Clinton and McCain understand the overall impact of such a stupid gimmick as that?

[Franzl]

Grrrr . . . stupid "gas tax holiday" crap.  Don't Clinton and McCain understand the overall impact of such a stupid gimmick as that?

Oh yes, I suspect that they do indeed, but unfortunately, they realize that many voters won't understand the impact. In other words, they're trying to get votes.

[Ban my account ffs!]

If gas is four bucks a gallon, and the oil companies are reaping almost unimagineable profits, what am I missing here?  I understand that they have to make a profit...that's business.  But there's profit and there's shameless gouging of the public. 

Exxon Mobil made 40 (B) billion in 2007.  Numbers in the first quarter of this year appear to be ahead of last year's pace.  And it looks to be the same for nearly all the other major oil companies.  Now, am I supposed to believe that on $4.00 a gallon, Exxon's costs are $3.50 a gallon...and then the .50 cent profit has to be split with service stations?  Something like that?  When I ask if I am missing something here, I'm being serious -- I could be.  But if that's the case, where are these massive earnings coming from?

They keep telling us they need to increase the price of gas because this refinery is closed, because there's violence in Nigeria, because Hugo Chavez is acting squirrelly or because that refinery is at half capacity...we hear different explanations all the time.  But if these are painful expenses for oil companies, wouldn't the pain show in their bottom line?

I'm just a solo proprietorship -- self employed, etc.  So I probably don't have a clue.  But something isn't adding up here.

What it SEEMS like, is that they are making shocking amounts of money (profit), claiming hard times and laughing at all the idiots who they have over a barrel.

I'm still trying to figure out why you hate the enviroment.

Because I am convinced that those soft, sweet-looking little bunny rabbits and those cute little squirrels, such as the one in Snowguy's sig are in cahoots.  They, and the beagles, are planning world domination.

It's a chipmunk.  And yes, they are hell bent on destroying the world.  One of them had the gall to eat my chocolate chip pancakes when I was 6 years old.  It was traumatizing.

[DanielX]

Solutions:

1. Additional drilling and, more importantly, refineries. Gasoline refining is a large bottleneck currently, and there has been little construction. Also kickstart drilling in ANWR, the Dakotas, and other

2. Change U.S. emissions regulations, which at the moment harshly penalize diesel fueled vehicles.  New diesel cars are lightyears ahead of their earlier counterparts in terms of quality and cleanliness; diesel itself generates slightly better fuel economy than gasoline. Fund biodiesel - which can be made from, among other things, manure and crop wastes.

3. Nuclear power. Shoot the morons who halted nuclear development in the 70s-90s, and start building new nuclear power plants, and refurbishing and updating older ones. This will reduce energy prices overall, replace oil burning (and coal burning, allowing coal-to-oil conversion), make hydrogen production and plug-in hybrids cheaper, and other nice stuff. Also build more hydroelectric plants, and solar/wind/geothermal where it can be done reasonably.

4. Process garbage using anaerobic digestion, plasma arc disposal, gasification, or other methods that can coax fuel and/or electricity out of garbage. These methods have the added benefit of reducing the load of garbage that has to be dumped or incinerated.

5. Relax tariffs on cars imported from European, Australian, or Japanese factories, as well as work to regularize safety standards with the EU, Japanese, and Australasian safety authorities. Basically, make things easier for smaller cars to be sold in the United States. Note that a lot of this is public perception - also true for diesels - that small cars are undesirable.

6. Return the US to the gold standard, or another non-fiat standard; or otherwise clamp down hard on the money supply. Cut down on inflation, and gasoline prices won't rise as much . 

[War on Want]

Solutions:

1. Additional drilling and, more importantly, refineries. Gasoline refining is a large bottleneck currently, and there has been little construction. Also kickstart drilling in ANWR, the Dakotas, and other

2. Change U.S. emissions regulations, which at the moment harshly penalize diesel fueled vehicles.  New diesel cars are lightyears ahead of their earlier counterparts in terms of quality and cleanliness; diesel itself generates slightly better fuel economy than gasoline. Fund biodiesel - which can be made from, among other things, manure and crop wastes.

3. Nuclear power. Shoot the morons who halted nuclear development in the 70s-90s, and start building new nuclear power plants, and refurbishing and updating older ones. This will reduce energy prices overall, replace oil burning (and coal burning, allowing coal-to-oil conversion), make hydrogen production and plug-in hybrids cheaper, and other nice stuff. Also build more hydroelectric plants, and solar/wind/geothermal where it can be done reasonably.

4. Process garbage using anaerobic digestion, plasma arc disposal, gasification, or other methods that can coax fuel and/or electricity out of garbage. These methods have the added benefit of reducing the load of garbage that has to be dumped or incinerated.

5. Relax tariffs on cars imported from European, Australian, or Japanese factories, as well as work to regularize safety standards with the EU, Japanese, and Australasian safety authorities. Basically, make things easier for smaller cars to be sold in the United States. Note that a lot of this is public perception - also true for diesels - that small cars are undesirable.

6. Return the US to the gold standard, or another non-fiat standard; or otherwise clamp down hard on the money supply. Cut down on inflation, and gasoline prices won't rise as much . 

The only one I agree with is 4 other than that, all of those methods would certainly mess up things in the future.

[AkSaber]

Solutions:

1. Additional drilling and, more importantly, refineries. Gasoline refining is a large bottleneck currently, and there has been little construction. Also kickstart drilling in ANWR, the Dakotas, and other

2. Change U.S. emissions regulations, which at the moment harshly penalize diesel fueled vehicles.  New diesel cars are lightyears ahead of their earlier counterparts in terms of quality and cleanliness; diesel itself generates slightly better fuel economy than gasoline. Fund biodiesel - which can be made from, among other things, manure and crop wastes.

3. Nuclear power. Shoot the morons who halted nuclear development in the 70s-90s, and start building new nuclear power plants, and refurbishing and updating older ones. This will reduce energy prices overall, replace oil burning (and coal burning, allowing coal-to-oil conversion), make hydrogen production and plug-in hybrids cheaper, and other nice stuff. Also build more hydroelectric plants, and solar/wind/geothermal where it can be done reasonably.

4. Process garbage using anaerobic digestion, plasma arc disposal, gasification, or other methods that can coax fuel and/or electricity out of garbage. These methods have the added benefit of reducing the load of garbage that has to be dumped or incinerated.

5. Relax tariffs on cars imported from European, Australian, or Japanese factories, as well as work to regularize safety standards with the EU, Japanese, and Australasian safety authorities. Basically, make things easier for smaller cars to be sold in the United States. Note that a lot of this is public perception - also true for diesels - that small cars are undesirable.

6. Return the US to the gold standard, or another non-fiat standard; or otherwise clamp down hard on the money supply. Cut down on inflation, and gasoline prices won't rise as much . 

Excellent ideas.

[MODU]

Daniel,

Quit posting common sense solutions!  Shame on you!

[NDN]

Solutions:

1. Additional drilling and, more importantly, refineries. Gasoline refining is a large bottleneck currently, and there has been little construction. Also kickstart drilling in ANWR, the Dakotas, and other

2. Change U.S. emissions regulations, which at the moment harshly penalize diesel fueled vehicles.  New diesel cars are lightyears ahead of their earlier counterparts in terms of quality and cleanliness; diesel itself generates slightly better fuel economy than gasoline. Fund biodiesel - which can be made from, among other things, manure and crop wastes.

3. Nuclear power. Shoot the morons who halted nuclear development in the 70s-90s, and start building new nuclear power plants, and refurbishing and updating older ones. This will reduce energy prices overall, replace oil burning (and coal burning, allowing coal-to-oil conversion), make hydrogen production and plug-in hybrids cheaper, and other nice stuff. Also build more hydroelectric plants, and solar/wind/geothermal where it can be done reasonably.

4. Process garbage using anaerobic digestion, plasma arc disposal, gasification, or other methods that can coax fuel and/or electricity out of garbage. These methods have the added benefit of reducing the load of garbage that has to be dumped or incinerated.

5. Relax tariffs on cars imported from European, Australian, or Japanese factories, as well as work to regularize safety standards with the EU, Japanese, and Australasian safety authorities. Basically, make things easier for smaller cars to be sold in the United States. Note that a lot of this is public perception - also true for diesels - that small cars are undesirable.

6. Return the US to the gold standard, or another non-fiat standard; or otherwise clamp down hard on the money supply. Cut down on inflation, and gasoline prices won't rise as much . 

Wow you stole my response.

Anyway all of that, plus subsidies for switchgrass and/or sugarcane based ethanol instead of the corn bullsh**t we have now. Although I wouldn't advocate a full return to the Gold Standard.. Just go back to the system we had until Nixon decided to close the gold window completely.

[opebo]

Solutions:

1. Additional drilling and, more importantly, refineries. Gasoline refining is a large bottleneck currently, and there has been little construction. Also kickstart drilling in ANWR, the Dakotas, and other

Crap.  Nowhere near enough oil there to change the basic collapse. 

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Tiny incremental changes while the sky is falling.

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nuclear produces electricity, daniel, which we have  plenty of and cheap.  The problem is transport, and only oil can do this.

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Woooptido, kill two birds with one stone.  Except it is insignificant.

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Small cars are undesirable!  By definition!.  Sheesh, have you never been in one?  I remember one time I stepped out of my '82 Chevy Caprice to test drive a VW Golf -  I thought that horrible little car was going to give me a nervous breakdown.  I was so relieved to get back in the Caprice - smooth, big, as it should be.

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Good lord, I have no idea what you're talking about here, but you might want to consider our owners must have some reason for utilizing this non-gold standard against us.

Anyway, if we want to go back to driving proper v-8 sedans and living decently - as we did before 1980 - we have to get rid of about half the world's population.  Sad but true.  Tough choices.