So Russia and Georgia just went to war

[Iosif is a COTHO]

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http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/aug/08/georgia.russia2

Good thing Georgia aren't in NATO.

[dead0man]

We'll turn our backs on them like we (not just the US, the West at large) have done many times before all over the world.  If we have nothing to gain but the liberty of others, we're not very consistent about helping.

[Iosif is a COTHO]

From my limited understanding of this, it doesn't exactly seem that the Georgians are snowy white in this conflict.

[dead0man]

Is any side ever?

[Iosif is a COTHO]

No, but considering the Ossetians by and large don't want to be part of georgia and Georgia is attempting to forcibly make them part of georgia, I don't think it's quite accurate to say the U.S is turning it's back on liberty by nor helping out Georgia.

[Silent Hunter]

Just great. Not what we needed.

Hope this is over quickly and with few deaths.

[The Mikado]

No comment at this hour, but I am closely monitoring this story.

[2952-0-0]

I thought the Soviet Union collapsed?

That's what we wanted you to think!

[Silent Hunter]

I have a friend from Georgia. I don't know where she is, but I hope she's OK.

[Angel of Death]

Hasn't the fighting been restricted to South Ossetia so far?

Just to inject some lightheartedness into this, the Chinese must be really pissed off at this bumping the opening of the Olympics from the front page.

[The Man From G.O.P.]

Dollar was up, euro was down, oil was down....




And then this...



Anyway, I hope the Russians take it easy, as much as the world hates the US right now, I think the Russians underestimate how much the rest of the world doesn't want to see a right wing version of the Soviet Union.

[Meeker]

Do they even have a reason? You can't just suddenly invade a country.

How stupid is Putin?

[Iosif is a COTHO]

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erm, you do realize Russia didn't start this, right?

[Beet]

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erm, you do realize Russia didn't start this, right?

Each side accuses the other of starting it.

But I think no one has any doubts that in a full fledged war between Russia and Georgia, Russia wins, hence the concern with what Russia will do. Technically South Ossetia was a part of the Georgian SSR, and broke away in the 1990s.

[Silent Hunter]

Do they even have a reason? You can't just suddenly invade a country.

Defending Russian citizens in South Ossetia. The ones they gave passports to in order to undermine the Georgians there.

Russia may or may not have started this, but Stalin certainly did when he partitioned Ossetia.

[Dan the Roman]

To be fair saying Georgia started this, while true in the limited sense, ignores the fact that Russia began it when it supported the secession of Georgian territory in 1993. Georgia is quite simply, asserting its sovereignty within its internationally recognized borders.

Then again, that was what Serbia was doing in Kosovo.

I think Georgia is betting that Russia is bluffing, and that they can oust the South Ossetian government in a fait accompli before Russia can do anything. The Russsians realize what they are doing and that they have a choice between doing nothing and overeacting. Right now they are doing nothing while threatening to overreact. We will see if they actually do.

[J. J.]

The video I've seen looks like a lot more than "doing nothing."

[War on Want]

I place blame on both countries but this should be a short, quick war in which Russia defeats Georgia in about a week and a half and South Ossentia gets what it wants.

[Middle-aged Europe]

I've just read that the Georgians are planning to withdraw 2000 of their troops from Iraq and Afghanistan and bring them back home in the next few days.

[War on Want]

I've just read that the Georgians are planning to withdraw 2000 of their troops from Iraq and Afghanistan and bring them back home in the next few days.

That's not surprising should be expected. It should make the war get more coverage here which would be a good thing. The depressing part about all of this is that a story about Mexican drug cartels growing pot is a more popular story than the start of a full blown modern war.

[2952-0-0]

I place blame on a Georgian, Iosef Dzhugashvili.

[Bunwahaha [still dunno why, but well, so be it]]

I've just read that the Georgians are planning to withdraw 2000 of their troops from Iraq and Afghanistan and bring them back home in the next few days.

Yeah, when Sakachvili sent them to Irak he said something like that: "It will be a good training for them [georgian soldiers]".

I saw tonight that Russia sent tanks in South Ossetia. To engage a fight against the georgian army? Let us see...

Anyway, I think the reaction of the whole West, so especially the one of the US, will be interesting to follow. Georgia is an ally they want in NATO. On the other hand, West is sensed to defend freedom and democracy by which South Ossetian said they wanna be part of Russia, as long as we can trust the fairness of the 1992 referendum.

For sure I don't think that these foreground considerations are important for Western leaders. Would US/West have reasons to support Georgia against Russia? If yes, how far? Personally, I would be very surprised of it, I don't see an important reason for some consesquences which could be too much big. Georgia might be alone against Russia, let us see...

[Verily]

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erm, you do realize Russia didn't start this, right?

Each side accuses the other of starting it.

But I think no one has any doubts that in a full fledged war between Russia and Georgia, Russia wins, hence the concern with what Russia will do. Technically South Ossetia was a part of the Georgian SSR, and broke away in the 1990s.

If we really want to spread blame around, Stalin started it. After all, Ossetia was not a part of Georgia until he shoved it into the Georgian SSR.

[Bunwahaha [still dunno why, but well, so be it]]

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erm, you do realize Russia didn't start this, right?

Each side accuses the other of starting it.

But I think no one has any doubts that in a full fledged war between Russia and Georgia, Russia wins, hence the concern with what Russia will do. Technically South Ossetia was a part of the Georgian SSR, and broke away in the 1990s.

If we really want to spread blame around, Stalin started it. After all, Ossetia was not a part of Georgia until he shoved it into the Georgian SSR.

That's right, it seems that Caucasian borders have been created to create problems...

[Silent Hunter]

That's right, it seems that Caucasian borders have been created to create problems...

As were those in Africa...