Sarah Palin's daughter IS pregnant, actually
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  Sarah Palin's daughter IS pregnant, actually
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Author Topic: Sarah Palin's daughter IS pregnant, actually  (Read 14863 times)
agcatter
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« Reply #75 on: September 01, 2008, 12:28:18 PM »

The internet is a given.  Also count on the lib gals on The View.
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Meeker
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« Reply #76 on: September 01, 2008, 12:29:11 PM »

It makes no sense that Palin would drop out. McCain knew about this before he picked her and was apparently OK with it.

Has this been established? If so, McCain looks even more reckless than I thought.

McCain says he knew in the statement.
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ucscgaldamez
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« Reply #77 on: September 01, 2008, 12:29:35 PM »

Well, whether this is irrelevant or not, it will still be all over the news. The public is barely getting to know her and she will obviously be somewhat defined by the news that come out.

What has been discussed all over the news:

1. She's a woman, history.
2. Relative inexperienced
3. Commander-In-Chief question
4. Son has Down syndrome
5.Governor of Alaska, mayor of 8,000 people
6. Unmmarried daughter is pregnant

All I know is that trivial issues do take an impact on people who don't follow politics as usual. My mother who votes and dont follow politics at all is slightly Republican. She heard the news and said, "she can't even run her own house." My sister said "she should be home taking care of that stuff."

And these are women saying this. Not very smart but you know...

We'll see what happens. I don't think McCain should replace her that would look really bad on his part. If there is a hit to be taken, he should take it. I think there were more qualified people for this position and I think he made the wrong choice.
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minionofmidas
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« Reply #78 on: September 01, 2008, 12:30:02 PM »

Hold on a second.  This family seems like white trash?

What???
Okay, I'll rephrase it.

Working Class.

Better? Smiley
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Brittain33
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« Reply #79 on: September 01, 2008, 12:30:30 PM »
« Edited: September 01, 2008, 12:32:23 PM by brittain33 »

Brittain, I just don't think a 17 year old getting knocked up is that big a deal. Granted if Palin opposes sex education, that was a failing. Maybe the daughter's birth control failed. Who knows.

My question is, seriously, who cares what you think? Smiley Who cares what I think? That's not where the action is on this issue.

I really do NOT think it shows bad judgment on Sarah Palin's part. I do not know what goes on in their family, but I do not pass judgment on her raising of her children, only to be glad that as a gay man I didn't grow up in a household like that. The problem is with the large number of people who do feel like behavior like this is the fault of the mother and the permissive culture, and who will be "depressed," as Sam says, to see an exemplar of a good mother and a good culture producing the same outcome.
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Torie
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« Reply #80 on: September 01, 2008, 12:30:40 PM »

I still want to know if anyone feels that this ought to be relevant in the campaign.

I took a stab at why I think it will be, even though the Democrats can not and should not make it a campaign issue. As a social conservative, I'm curious to hear your take on my read on the issue.

For the record, if I am right, I see the outcome to be a swap of someone else for Palin rather than long-term damage to the ticket, with Palin using this news as an excuse for her to spend more time with her family. For once, that excuse would be accurate.

That would destroy McCain's campaign if she drops out. It shows either McCain didn't know, or knew, and than when the inevitable happened, he panicked.
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Person Man
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« Reply #81 on: September 01, 2008, 12:31:08 PM »

I mean, come on, Palin is supposed to be the most socially conservative VP in the nation's history, yet raises her children to be irresponsible and promiscous. I mean, I wouldn't be surprised if that family consideres women as objects. This is what happens when you believe that morality is the government's responsibility.
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Torie
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« Reply #82 on: September 01, 2008, 12:31:57 PM »

Hold on a second.  This family seems like white trash?

What???
Okay, I'll rephrase it.

Working Class.

Better? Smiley

You still haven't answer my little query. Sad
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minionofmidas
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« Reply #83 on: September 01, 2008, 12:32:47 PM »

I still want to know if anyone feels that this ought to be relevant in the campaign.

I took a stab at why I think it will be, even though the Democrats can not and should not make it a campaign issue. As a social conservative, I'm curious to hear your take on my read on the issue.

For the record, if I am right, I see the outcome to be a swap of someone else for Palin rather than long-term damage to the ticket, with Palin using this news as an excuse for her to spend more time with her family. For once, that excuse would be accurate.

That would destroy McCain's campaign if she drops out. It shows either McCain didn't know, or knew, and than when the inevitable happened, he panicked.
Indeed it would.

It's not going to happen, and there's no reason why it should, either.

I mean, come on, Palin is supposed to be the most socially conservative VP in the nation's history, yet raises her children to be irresponsible and promiscous.
False dichotomy. Smiley
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Brittain33
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« Reply #84 on: September 01, 2008, 12:33:12 PM »

I mean, come on, Palin is supposed to be the most socially conservative VP in the nation's history, yet raises her children to be irresponsible and promiscous. I mean, I wouldn't be surprised if that family consideres women as objects. This is what happens when you believe that morality is the government's responsibility.

Aargh. Please don't do this, it derails the thread into outrage and means we don't discuss the issue as it really plays out.
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Erc
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« Reply #85 on: September 01, 2008, 12:33:32 PM »

Meeker (I believe) mentioned earlier in this thread that McCain knew about this before the choice.  Does anyone have any confirmation of this?
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« Reply #86 on: September 01, 2008, 12:34:11 PM »

What I meant by the Republican party forcing her to marry the guy... the Republican party is the party of family values.  Family values dictate that if you are young and pregnant, you should marry the guy as soon as possible.  This has been the case for a very long time.

Democrats would be more accepting if SHE decided not to marry the guy.  But I have no doubt that in this case, with the political implications and all, that this girl had very little say in the matter.

It is not a matter of doing what's best for this girl and her baby, but what will look best to self righteous, 'wear-my-morals-on-my-sleeve' Americans who will get warm fuzzies knowing she is marrying the father of the child.
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Grumpier Than Uncle Joe
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« Reply #87 on: September 01, 2008, 12:34:24 PM »

I mean, come on, Palin is supposed to be the most socially conservative VP in the nation's history, yet raises her children to be irresponsible and promiscous. I mean, I wouldn't be surprised if that family consideres women as objects. This is what happens when you believe that morality is the government's responsibility.

Aargh. Please don't do this, it derails the thread into outrage and means we don't discuss the issue as it really plays out.

Save your breath, brittain....this one is going to 200 replies minimum.....and most of them disgusting.
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Meeker
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« Reply #88 on: September 01, 2008, 12:34:40 PM »

Meeker (I believe) mentioned earlier in this thread that McCain knew about this before the choice.  Does anyone have any confirmation of this?

It's in the original article I posted.

http://www.reuters.com/article/topNews/idUSN2944356420080901?feedType=RSS&feedName=topNews&rpc=22&sp=true
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Keystone Phil
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« Reply #89 on: September 01, 2008, 12:35:08 PM »
« Edited: September 01, 2008, 12:38:10 PM by Keystone Phil »


The simple fact is, a lot of people with conservative social values believe that women who have full-time careers and families do a disservice to the latter because they can't be in both places at once. They're right, there are trade-offs.

Roll Eyes

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Except they have been drooling over this pick since it happened. This news might dampen their excitment but probably not much. I think they'll also appreciate that she's actually keeping the child and getting married.

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And neither do I, for the record.

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McCain knew. I don't think she's forced to marry this guy because of the campaign. This would have happened even if Palin was still just the Governor.


I mean, come on, Palin is supposed to be the most socially conservative VP in the nation's history, yet raises her children to be irresponsible and promiscous. I mean, I wouldn't be surprised if that family consideres women as objects. This is what happens when you believe that morality is the government's responsibility.

Aargh. Please don't do this, it derails the thread into outrage and means we don't discuss the issue as it really plays out.

The guy is a troll.
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HardRCafé
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« Reply #90 on: September 01, 2008, 12:36:27 PM »

Obviously this is very unfortunate for the Palin family.

Reaction seems to be all across the board.  Overwhelmingly supportive so far, but with fissures.  The next 48 hours will be more unpredictable than the past 72.
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Torie
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« Reply #91 on: September 01, 2008, 12:36:47 PM »

Snow, you seem to think "family values" types think one size fits all, and that the knocked up kid should marry the guy, no matter who he is. That's a ludicrous stereotype. These folks can weigh the pros and the cons just as well as those inhabiting secular city.
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Brittain33
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« Reply #92 on: September 01, 2008, 12:36:51 PM »

Meeker (I believe) mentioned earlier in this thread that McCain knew about this before the choice.  Does anyone have any confirmation of this?

It's in the original article I posted.

http://www.reuters.com/article/topNews/idUSN2944356420080901?feedType=RSS&feedName=topNews&rpc=22&sp=true

I wonder if they would have admitted it if they hadn't known, though. Palin appears to have felt that the vetting process was so skimpy, and her chances so unlikely, that I wouldn't have faulted her for not thinking she had to bring it up before she found herself on a plane to Dayton.

This reflects poorly on McCain whether he knew or not. Maybe I'm wrong, but at the very least, did they think they would keep it a secret through Election Day and it wouldn't be a distraction? Wouldn't they have acknowledged it somehow?
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Erc
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« Reply #93 on: September 01, 2008, 12:38:27 PM »

Meeker (I believe) mentioned earlier in this thread that McCain knew about this before the choice.  Does anyone have any confirmation of this?

It's in the original article I posted.

http://www.reuters.com/article/topNews/idUSN2944356420080901?feedType=RSS&feedName=topNews&rpc=22&sp=true

Wow.  What the hell was McCain thinking?
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Sam Spade
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« Reply #94 on: September 01, 2008, 12:38:59 PM »

The problem is with the large number of people who do feel like behavior like this is the fault of the mother and the permissive culture, and who will be "depressed," as Sam says, to see an exemplar of a good mother and a good culture producing the same outcome.

If I know those people well enough (at least from Texas), the answer is not that much.  Mainly because most of them have had it happen in their own personal lives (I have with a cousin, fwiw).
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minionofmidas
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« Reply #95 on: September 01, 2008, 12:39:25 PM »

Why are socially conservative "white trash" types better than socially conservative upper middle class white types Lewis?  Please help me with some of this.
Ah, you gotta understand the Euro Pinko Commie mind here. Smiley

The traditional ruling class - ie the conservative rich; Bush's class - is still the Enemy.
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Why is that "obvious"?

Man, is this thread growing fast. I recognize that Bristol Palin (unlike her mom) is sort of hot, but... come on.
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Torie
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« Reply #96 on: September 01, 2008, 12:41:06 PM »
« Edited: September 01, 2008, 12:44:17 PM by Torie »

Ya, Lewis, but you picked on socially conservative upper middle class types. Am I not a class enemy? Tongue

You don't know the circumstances of this pregnancy. That is what is obvious. I don't teens having sex makes one part of a white trash family. Upper middle class kids have sex too. Who knew?
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minionofmidas
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« Reply #97 on: September 01, 2008, 12:43:17 PM »

Ya, Lewis, but you picked on socially conservative upper middle class types. Am I not a class enemy? Tongue
I don't know enough about your background to judge. -_-

But seriously, no. To Al perhaps (he certainly seems to think so in regard to Opebo), but not to me. Much like misguidedly conservative Poors, you guys are people one can work with. Smiley
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Grumpier Than Uncle Joe
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« Reply #98 on: September 01, 2008, 12:46:07 PM »

This story is all over the MSM's web sites.......i think they're gonna cover it on TV.....some
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ilikeverin
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« Reply #99 on: September 01, 2008, 12:48:43 PM »

What's ridiculous is how much people are praising or castigating Governor Palin for her daughter's actions.

Parents have no influence over the development of a child's personality after the point of conception.

None.  None at all.  Adopted children are no more similar to their parents or to their siblings than any random person plucked off the streets.

Blame the daughter's peers all you want: about 50% of variation in personality is due to forces other than genes, and likely a good deal of that is peer influence.  But Palin should not be faulted for the decision that led to this pregnancy; nor should she be credited for the courageous decision on the part of the daughter to keep the child.
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